Is The MCU The Greatest Franchise Of All Time?

[Babillygunn]

Bond. James Bond.

culturally, the Bond films are the most influential. They were the MCU of the 60’s and still going strong over 50 years later. I don’t think the MCU will produce that longevity. Also, not many franchises can survive let alone thrive when the roles, including the lead, are regularly recast. The franchise is constantly reinventing itself and therefore remains fresh. That’s part of the bond formula.

obviously it depends on the metrics that you use, but Bond films deserve to be in the discussion, and for me, it’s the franchise that I enjoy the most.

 

[LvtLeeTDK]

I'm in Asia. I can confirm that though I like Star Wars, most people here does not give a **** about the franchise.
The IMAX first screening in my place was full for like 2 minutes after opening. While I went to see Episode 9 in a half-filled cinema.

 

[psylockolussus]

Yeah I live in Asia as well, and I don't remember theaters being full for the Star Wars flicks and I live in a city with over a million during weekdays and people outside of the city also flock here in the malls (well before Covid 19) during weekends. Star Wars is still well known, and probably more successful than most film franchises, but it is not as popular as the MCU.

 

[psylockolussus]

Bond. James Bond.

culturally, the Bond films are the most influential. They were the MCU of the 60’s and still going strong over 50 years later. I don’t think the MCU will produce that longevity. Also, not many franchises can survive let alone thrive when the roles, including the lead, are regularly recast. The franchise is constantly reinventing itself and therefore remains fresh. That’s part of the bond formula.

obviously it depends on the metrics that you use, but Bond films deserve to be in the discussion, and for me, it’s the franchise that I enjoy the most.

Eh. You are saying the franchise you enjoy the most but Bond films RARELY broke boX office records. And even before the MCU, there were already bigger successful and more influential movie franchises than James Bond. Are the James Bond movies even appeal to kids and families?

If Spider-Man has been rebooted twice just in the last decade and what makes youthinkit won't happen with the other Marvel properties.

 

[Babillygunn]

Eh. You are saying the franchise you enjoy the most but Bond films RARELY broke boX office records. And even before the MCU, there were already bigger successful and more influential movie franchises than James Bond. Are the James Bond movies even appeal to kids and families?

Yes. I am answering a subjective question by stating my opinion as to what my favorite franchise is.
But more to the original point of the thread, I am also saying that there is more to a franchise’s worth than box office. That is just one metric that can be used as what constitutes “greatest.” The Bond franchise has incredible longevity and has reinvented itself without rebooting. The only reboot arguably was when Craig took over and that was a very soft reboot. I think due to longevity and social impact, it at least deserves A place in the discussion of “greatest franchises” of all time.

I readily admit that I am in the minority on this. However that would be my opinion. Also, if I had the option of watching a Marvel movie versus Star Wars or Bond...I’m taking Bond just out of sheer enjoyment. Again, I know that I’m in the minority, and most people are free to disagree.

 

[psylockolussus]

Yes. I am answering a subjective question by stating what my favorite franchise is. I am also saying that there is more to a franchise’s worth than box office. That is just one metric that can be used.
The Bond franchise has incredible longevity and has reinvented itself without rebooting. The only reboot arguably was when Craig took over and that was a very soft reboot. I think due to longevity and social impact, it at least deserves A place in the discussion of “greatest franchises” of all time.
I readily admit that I am in the minority on this.

The topic is about being the greatest franchise - not being one of the greatest franchises. Two completely different things.

 

[Babillygunn]

The topic is about being the greatest franchise - not being one of the greatest franchises. Two completely different things.

Ok then. Bond is the greatest. And your opinion doesn’t matter.

 

[psylockolussus]

The early post-Endgame and post-virus films will give a good hint to what success we can expect from the MCU long term. If the next 10 years is anything like the first then many of these discussions about top franchise will start becoming moot.

I feel like the next Black Panther, Capt. Marvel, well basically anyone that was featured in Endgame areguaranteed to be a success (assuming they don't drop the quality). While if films like Black Widow are going to take a hit from the virus later this year, then the rest would as well especially the new James Bond movie.

 

[Iceman]

I feel like the next Black Panther, Capt. Marvel, well basically anyone that was featured in Endgame areguaranteed to be a success (assuming they don't drop the quality). While if films like Black Widow are going to take a hit from the virus later this year, then the rest would as well especially the new James Bond movie.

I think the MCU will still be very successful and the virus will hit all franchises. I think they’d have to drop the ball and start putting out poor films for the success to not continue long term. Nothing has created long term loyalty on this level before among the GA.

 

[MarvelFan]

Speaking of Star Wars is not popular in Asia, I also Asian (live in the Sun Rising land).

While I cannot say for other Asian countries, but here in Japan, Star Wars is really huge and popular. Back from the old movies which has being made a reference for a lot of popular culture here (I remember in some of classic Doraemon stories has reference of Darth Vader like character and Luke Skywalker).

A Star Wars attraction is one of popular attraction in Tokyo Disneyland, too.

MCU, on the other hand...while it is become a global phenomenon for years, it has not been quite catching a spark here among mainstream audience in Japan until the very recent Endgame.

Even in 2018, musical movies such as Greatest Showman and Bohemian Rhapsody has gaining more recognition than Infinity War and Black Panther.

One things that I already says a few time is that superhero genre is not quite big and popular in Japan. (Though we have passionate fanbase here).
Add also to the more diverse the Japan sub culture is, including the depiction of what a superhero character should be in our culture, thats why we have so many hero/superhero characteristics which different from one another.

Heroes from anime, manga, games,and tokusatsu (even tokusatsu genre alone has different kind of superheroes in Kamen Rider, Sentai, Ultraman, Garo)....though they all are different from one another but all of them has something that resonates more closely to Japanese identity and culture. And American superheroes, unfortunately still not resonating enough for most mainstream audience here.

Hopefully with the success of Endgame last year, not just MCU but also DC can grow more and more among the mainstream audience in Japan.

 

[Frodo]

Interesting topic. I tend to analyze at Comicbook based films and tv shows from a different perspective than alot of fans do. I look at all of them in the context of what came before and their place in time, pop culture, and the standards and expectations of the time these films were made and released in.

As far who grew up in the 80s and 90s watching Superhero serials,cartoons, tv and films from the 40s,50s,70s, 80s, and 90s on rented VHS tapes from Blockbuster and Wherehouse video.

I also watched the genre go from being considered literally a joke by the mainstream, to being what it is now. So if I'm gonna label something " the greatest of all time" , there are alot of different considerations that have to go into making that kind of judgement.

For example, I'd have to wait for the MCU to end before I could even judge if it is or isn't the greatest of all time.

The term "All time" to me, means past, present, and future. It implies to me, that nothing else could come along and be better in the coming years.

I don't know what the quality of MCU films will be like going forward ,nor what they will be in decade.

I also don't know how they'll stack up to future franchises in the genre when all is said an done,let alone other franchises in general.

There's always gonna be a new kid on the block or a young turk who builds on what came before and takes it to a new level or a different direction.

That's what's happened in this genre in the past, and will happen again. So its always a bit dicey to start labeling things GOAT imo.

All of that is just one example of why I couldn't label the MCU as the greatest of all time in 2020, while the franchise is still ongoing.

Now, if we're talking about whether it has produced some of the best films in genre to date, whether its had a great impact on pop culture, and whether its achieved alot despite the odds and naysayers, then I could say yes without hesitation.

 

[DlAMONDZ]

Outside America? Yes

 

[weezerspider]

It’s Star Wars because Star Wars is an original idea, not an adaptation of another medium. No other hugely successful film franchise can say that.

 

[Bayne]

It’s Star Wars because Star Wars is an original idea, not an adaptation of another medium. No other hugely successful film franchise can say that.

Star Wars was based on Flash Gordon (which George Lucas wanted to make but couldn't get the rights to) sprinkled with various elements from Dune, John Carter and Kurosawa's samurai movies. Not being a direct adaptation doesn't really make it significantly 'original'.

Also, even for a broader idea of 'original', there are other franchises worth mentioning - whether it's for box office, number of films, or cultural impact - that were not direct adaptations. (Avatar, Godzilla, Terminator, Fast and the Furious, Alien, Matrix, Planet of the Apes, Indiana Jones, Mad Max, Pirates of the Caribbean, The Conjuring, etc). Star Wars may be close to the top in popularity but it's hardly the 'only' significant film franchise that can claim originality.

 

[psylockolussus]

It’s Star Wars because Star Wars is an original idea, not an adaptation of another medium. No other hugely successful film franchise can say that.

Avatar, Toy Story and Terminator aren't based from anything if I'm not wrong.

 

[weezerspider]

Star Wars was based on Flash Gordon (which George Lucas wanted to make but couldn't get the rights to) sprinkled with various elements from Dune, John Carter and Kurosawa's samurai movies. Not being a direct adaptation doesn't really make it significantly 'original'.

Also, even for a broader idea of 'original', there are other franchises worth mentioning - whether it's for box office, number of films, or cultural impact - that were not direct adaptations. (Avatar, Godzilla, Terminator, Fast and the Furious, Alien, Matrix, Planet of the Apes, Indiana Jones, Mad Max, Pirates of the Caribbean, The Conjuring, etc). Star Wars may be close to the top in popularity but it's hardly the 'only' significant film franchise that can claim originality.

Come on man, you can’t be that dense. Star Wars is not an adaptation of Flash Gordon or Kurosawa films. It’s inspired by those things. There’s no such thing as an original idea, yes, but not being directly based on IP and managing to be the biggest cultural phenomenon in 40 years AND STAY relevant all 40 years is significantly more relevant than anything else. Nothing else you mentioned even comes close to the cultural impact of Star Wars.

Avatar, Toy Story and Terminator aren't based from anything if I'm not wrong.

Avatar isn’t a franchise yet. It’s one movie. Let’s wait and see if it’s popularity and relevance has staying power. Terminator hasn’t been relevant since T2. A Star Wars TV show was literally more relevant in the last year than a brand new Terminator film. Toy Story isn’t even close to Star Wars success without having to adjust the old Star Wars films for inflation. Star Wars has made nine times the amount of cash as Toy Story.

 

[psylockolussus]

Avatar has a theme park and a sequel will come out... The second movie doesn't need to come out 1st to be called a "franchise".

Terminator might not be relevant anymore, but it was once successful. So you see, there's franchises aren't based from something that is/was successful. Star Wars isn't the only one.

 

[Bayne]

Come on man, you can’t be that dense. Star Wars is not an adaptation of Flash Gordon or Kurosawa films. It’s inspired by those things. There’s no such thing as an original idea, yes, but not being directly based on IP and managing to be the biggest cultural phenomenon in 40 years AND STAY relevant all 40 years is significantly more relevant than anything else. Nothing else you mentioned even comes close to the cultural impact of Star Wars.



Avatar isn’t a franchise yet. It’s one movie. Let’s wait and see if it’s popularity and relevance has staying power. Terminator hasn’t been relevant since T2. A Star Wars TV show was literally more relevant in the last year than a brand new Terminator film. Toy Story isn’t even close to Star Wars success without having to adjust the old Star Wars films for inflation. Star Wars has made nine times the amount of cash as Toy Story.

Sure, no idea is ever truly original. But there is unoriginal and there is *unoriginal*. Star Wars is the latter.

And originality is not the be all and end all qualification which makes a movie great. Lots of adaptations are among the greatest films ever made. I didn't write that list to say that all of those franchises are clearly 'equal' to Star Wars - in fact, I said they weren't. My point is simply that your claims about no great franchises being original are nonsense.

And that you can't judge what is or isn't a great franchise by just one category alone. Sure Star Wars has had huge popular impact. But it's not exactly an unqualified success story, either, is it? Every single Star Wars film since Jedi has been at least a little bit controversial with more than half of those movies being widely remembered as just not good at all. Hell, given recent results, if the Mandalorian hadn't snuck in under the wire at the very last minute, Star Wars probably wouldn't even be considered a viable property right now - it'd be going back on the shelf to wait for the disappointment and controversy to fade away.

You dismiss Avatar because it only has one movie (so far), yet that one movie outgrossed EVERY Star Wars movie ever made. Even after adjusting for inflation.

You dismiss Marvel for being 'unoriginal' - yet show me any other *movie series* that's ever done what the mcu has - but Marvel has released twice as many movies as Star Wars to far better reviews on average and also built up to an honestly larger pop culture impact than Star wars has, these days.

There are many different levels on which to judge these things and Star Wars is not the undisputable king of every metric.

 

[weezerspider]

Sure, no idea is ever truly original. But there is unoriginal and there is *unoriginal*. Star Wars is the latter.

And originality is not the be all and end all qualification which makes a movie great. Lots of adaptations are among the greatest films ever made. I didn't write that list to say that all of those franchises are clearly 'equal' to Star Wars - in fact, I said they weren't. My point is simply that your claims about no great franchises being original are nonsense.

And that you can't judge what is or isn't a great franchise by just one category alone. Sure Star Wars has had huge popular impact. But it's not exactly an unqualified success story, either, is it? Every single Star Wars film since Jedi has been at least a little bit controversial with more than half of those movies being widely remembered as just not good at all. Hell, given recent results, if the Mandalorian hadn't snuck in under the wire at the very last minute, Star Wars probably wouldn't even be considered a viable property right now - it'd be going back on the shelf to wait for the disappointment and controversy to fade away.

You dismiss Avatar because it only has one movie (so far), yet that one movie outgrossed EVERY Star Wars movie ever made. Even after adjusting for inflation.

You dismiss Marvel for being 'unoriginal' - yet show me any other *movie series* that's ever done what the mcu has - but Marvel has released twice as many movies as Star Wars to far better reviews on average and also built up to an honestly larger pop culture impact than Star wars has, these days.

There are many different levels on which to judge these things and Star Wars is not the undisputable king of every metric.

First off, I never said you can’t have a great franchise that’s “unoriginal”. You are putting words in my mouth. Second off, I’m discounting Avatar for only having one movie BECAUSE IT’S NOT A FRANCHISE YET! One movie doesn’t equal a franchise. Third, when did I dismiss Marvel?

The whole point of pointing out the fact that it’s original is we’re asking what the best FILM franchise is. Star Wars is the ONLY franchise to START as a FILM without any kind of built in audience and have this kind of success and impact. How is that hard for you to understand?

Also, to act like the MCU isn’t controversial is some real ignorance is bliss situation.

And what has MCU done that’s different? Cross overs? Universal did that in the 1930s. Ummm...what else have they done that no franchise has “ever done”? They’ve been more successful doing a lot of things, but there is nothing they’ve done that” no movie franchise has ever done”.

Star Wars is the only film franchise that was a FILM FIRST and had this kind of success and impact. Therefore, it’s clearly the greatest film franchise of all time.

 

[psylockolussus]

Yeah because everybody remember and aware of those Universal Pictures cross overs in the 1930s...

 

[Bayne]

First off, I never said you can’t have a great franchise that’s “unoriginal”. You are putting words in my mouth.

Speaking of putting words in people's mouths, I never said you said that. My point is that there ARE more great franchises that are original, and that Star Wars is not as original as you think.

Second off, I’m discounting Avatar for only having one movie BECAUSE IT’S NOT A FRANCHISE YET! One movie doesn’t equal a franchise.

One movie, a theme park and sequels in production. Sounds like a franchise to me, and one that's already outgrossed every Star Wars movie ever made, even adjusted for inflation.

Third, when did I dismiss Marvel?

When you claimed that Star Wars is automatically better than every other franchise just because it isn't a direct adaptation.

The whole point of pointing out the fact that it’s original is we’re asking what the best FILM franchise is. Star Wars is the ONLY franchise to START as a FILM without any kind of built in audience and have this kind of success and impact. How is that hard for you to understand?

There's nothing hard to understand. You're making a nonsensical point that has nothing to do with the discussion. It DOES NOT MATTER whether the franchise started with a film or adapted something earlier to become a film. It's still a film franchise either way and it still has to earn it's audience the hard way. I guarantee the number of people who went to see Iron Man because they already loved Iron Man (or even superheroes) is no more impressive than the number of people who went to see Star Wars because they already loved science fiction.

Also, to act like the MCU isn’t controversial is some real ignorance is bliss situation.

Not really. Every franchise has controversy among the die hard fans, former fans and every franchise has haters who refuse to watch it at all. The MCU's share of these things is fairly normal, from what I can see. Star Wars' share is very much above average. And the MCU is still a massively consistent hit with the general audience, which Star Wars clearly is not anymore.

And what has MCU done that’s different? Cross overs? Universal did that in the 1930s. Ummm...what else have they done that no franchise has “ever done”? They’ve been more successful doing a lot of things, but there is nothing they’ve done that” no movie franchise has ever done”.

Integral, massive cross-overs including not just characters but actually building long-form storytelling across multiple different groups of movies (not even a linear series). That has never been done before, not even by Universal, which basically just liked pairing up famous characters a lot without ever giving a crap about maintaining continued storylines over time.

Also, they're the only self-contained film franchise to ever release three movies a year consistently without any failing (really the only one to ever attempt it).

Also, they're the only film franchise which has created an event movie on the level of Endgame, which is seen as the total culmination of 20+ films (again something no one else ever really attempted).

Star Wars is the only film franchise that was a FILM FIRST and had this kind of success and impact. Therefore, it’s clearly the greatest film franchise of all time.

No.

 

[weezerspider]

Speaking of putting words in people's mouths, I never said you said that. My point is that there ARE more great franchises that are original, and that Star Wars is not as original as you think.



One movie, a theme park and sequels in production. Sounds like a franchise to me, and one that's already outgrossed every Star Wars movie ever made, even adjusted for inflation.



When you claimed that Star Wars is automatically better than every other franchise just because it isn't a direct adaptation.



There's nothing hard to understand. You're making a nonsensical point that has nothing to do with the discussion. It DOES NOT MATTER whether the franchise started with a film or adapted something earlier to become a film. It's still a film franchise either way and it still has to earn it's audience the hard way. I guarantee the number of people who went to see Iron Man because they already loved Iron Man (or even superheroes) is no more impressive than the number of people who went to see Star Wars because they already loved science fiction.



Not really. Every franchise has controversy among the die hard fans, former fans and every franchise has haters who refuse to watch it at all. The MCU's share of these things is fairly normal, from what I can see. Star Wars' share is very much above average. And the MCU is still a massively consistent hit with the general audience, which Star Wars clearly is not anymore.



Integral, massive cross-overs including not just characters but actually building long-form storytelling across multiple different groups of movies (not even a linear series). That has never been done before, not even by Universal, which basically just liked pairing up famous characters a lot without ever giving a crap about maintaining continued storylines over time.

Also, they're the only self-contained film franchise to ever release three movies a year consistently without any failing (really the only one to ever attempt it).

Also, they're the only film franchise which has created an event movie on the level of Endgame, which is seen as the total culmination of 20+ films (again something no one else ever really attempted).




No.

If Person A becomes a multimillionaire but inherited a million dollars to start with and Person B becomes a millionaire from nothing, Person A may have more wealth, but Person B’s achievement is greater. The fact that Star Wars has had the kind of success it’s had without being an IP is easily a greater accomplishment.

And by definition, AVATAR isn’t technically a film franchise yet lol

 

[psylockolussus]

Yes it is the Greatest! 23 films without a rotten rating and a bunch of billion dollar films!!

Ever after phase 4 and 5, yup yup yup.

I hope they can rebound in 2024, 2025, 2026 and 2027.

 

[The Batman]

Short answer? No.

Long Answer? No one franchise, IMO, could actually be the greatest film franchise of all time. But if I had to pick one, I'd pick Star Wars or possibly James Bond before I'd pick the MCU.

 

[psylockolussus]

Greatest is subjective.

Compare to those franchises, Marvel Cinematic Universe certainly has variety. Action, comedy, sci-fi, fantasy, robots, space, time travel, magic, aliens, spies, etc. And this is me only thinking of the first 33 films they've released.