Microsoft Sued For Spying On Users

[jaguarr]

http://cooltech.iafrica.com/technews/652880.htm

TECH NEWS
Microsoft sued for 'spying' on users
Staff reporter
Tue, 04 Jul 2006

Microsoft has been sued by a customer who alleges that the Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA) anti-piracy tool, which is downloaded by Windows as a security update, is in fact spyware, reports VNUnet.com.
The customer feels that Microsoft's anti-piracy tool, which gathers information about the user's system — including such information as hard drive serial numbers — and determines whether the Windows software on the system is a legal copy, is in violation of spyware laws and the rights of consumers.
The suit says that Microsoft misled customers in that "the updates from Windows Automatic Update installed WGA 2006 Verification without specific notice to or approval from the users, even when the users sought to specifically control what was installed on their system through the Custom installation setting," according to VNUnet.com.
A spokesperson for Microsoft, Jim Desler, called the allegations "without merit" and said that "it's distorting the objectives of WGA and the filing obscures the harm of software piracy. WGA is distributed in a manner that is lawful," reports itnews.com.au.
Desler also blasted the accusations of the WGA tool being spyware: "WGA is not spyware. When you consider the accepted definition of spyware, that it's installed without the user's consent and has some malicious purpose, it's clear WGA is not spyware."
Public opinion does have an impact on Microsoft though, as they recently released instructions on how to remove the WGA tool, according to VNUnet.com.





jag

 

[SsM]

Wow.. That is indeed interesting. Damned monopoly!

 

[Symbiote Hulk]

Hang on, I have something that says You may be a victim of counterfeiting and Each time I logg in, a little box pops up and says It is Strongly suggested that you get a genuine version of microsoft or something like that and there's a little 5 second timer before I can click cancel on the box. I clicked Ok the first time and it said something like Download free Microsoft genuine version. I then clicked cancel.

I smell a potential Viruse or Spyware.....is it Microsoft?

 

[Darthphere]

http://cooltech.iafrica.com/technews/652880.htm

TECH NEWS
Microsoft sued for 'spying' on users
Staff reporter
Tue, 04 Jul 2006

Microsoft has been sued by a customer who alleges that the Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA) anti-piracy tool, which is downloaded by Windows as a security update, is in fact spyware, reports VNUnet.com.
The customer feels that Microsoft's anti-piracy tool, which gathers information about the user's system — including such information as hard drive serial numbers — and determines whether the Windows software on the system is a legal copy, is in violation of spyware laws and the rights of consumers.
The suit says that Microsoft misled customers in that "the updates from Windows Automatic Update installed WGA 2006 Verification without specific notice to or approval from the users, even when the users sought to specifically control what was installed on their system through the Custom installation setting," according to VNUnet.com.
A spokesperson for Microsoft, Jim Desler, called the allegations "without merit" and said that "it's distorting the objectives of WGA and the filing obscures the harm of software piracy. WGA is distributed in a manner that is lawful," reports itnews.com.au.
Desler also blasted the accusations of the WGA tool being spyware: "WGA is not spyware. When you consider the accepted definition of spyware, that it's installed without the user's consent and has some malicious purpose, it's clear WGA is not spyware."
Public opinion does have an impact on Microsoft though, as they recently released instructions on how to remove the WGA tool, according to VNUnet.com.





jag

They released instructions on how to get rid of it. Why exactly are they suing again?

 

[jaguarr]

They released instructions on how to get rid of it. Why exactly are they suing again?

They're probably suing strictly to make a point and know that they won't actually win, so it's most likely for the publicity and to bring this issue into the limelight. The fact that M$ even did this "information gathering" thing with software that is supposed to protect their customers from spyware and other data collecting softwares that do so unauthorized is pretty despicable in my book. And then they had to be badgered about it before they released instructions on how to remove it. Personally, I dislike any company gathering information about me, particularly without my consent or knowledge.

jag

 

[jaguarr]

Hang on, I have something that says You may be a victim of counterfeiting and Each time I logg in, a little box pops up and says It is Strongly suggested that you get a genuine version of microsoft or something like that and there's a little 5 second timer before I can click cancel on the box. I clicked Ok the first time and it said something like Download free Microsoft genuine version. I then clicked cancel.

I smell a potential Viruse or Spyware.....is it Microsoft?

Try the tech support forums for your question.

jag

 

[Darthphere]

They're probably suing strictly to make a point and know that they won't actually win, so it's most likely for the publicity and to bring this issue into the limelight. The fact that M$ even did this "information gathering" thing with software that is supposed to protect their customers from spyware and other data collecting softwares that do so unauthorized is pretty despicable in my book. And then they had to be badgered about it before they released instructions on how to remove it. Personally, I dislike any company gathering information about me, particularly without my consent or knowledge.

jag

I can see the court case now:

Judge: What Microsoft did was against the law and will not be taken lightly when the persoanl information of an american is compromised.

Bush: heh heh heh suckers!

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Well, I know very little about this stuff, but I do think they should at least be able to check serial numbers and make sure that you're using a legal copy of Windows, especially if you're going to avail yourself of their updates, etc.
Pirates make me ill. They've got teams of hundreds, thousands, busting ass, risking investments, trying to make this product, and people won't even pay for it. F***ing lame.
People that take advantage of the intangible nature of conceptual, intellectual product burn me up fierce.

 

[Super Mark]

I knew it. THose Motherfu*kers. Looking over my shoulder! Wait. Oh, I see, ok, I didn't read the whole thing before flipping out. OK, I have the legal version.
Interesting article.

 

[jaguarr]

Well, I know very little about this stuff, but I do think they should at least be able to check serial numbers and make sure that you're using a legal copy of Windows, especially if you're going to avail yourself of their updates, etc.
Pirates make me ill. They've got teams of hundreds, thousands, busting ass, risking investments, trying to make this product, and people won't even pay for it. F***ing lame.
People that take advantage of the intangible nature of conceptual, intellectual product burn me up fierce.

I'm not disagreeing with you by any means, but there is the matter of full disclosure when engaging in tactics like this, which M$ hasn't been very good about in the past, this instance being no exception. The other problem many companies in the tech and arts industries run into is that they have this nagging tendency to WAY overprice their products in the name of maximizing profits; to the point that it drives MANY potential customers to pursue "other avenues" of acquiring their wares. This is especially true with the software and music industries, where all the R&D and marketing costs are recouped VERY quickly and the actual production costs are very, very low. There's been a lot of debate and argument around this the last ten years, but there's a pretty strong feeling that if these companies were to make their products a bit more affordable to the general public, then more people would actually pay for them rather than appropriating them illegally. Then these companies wouldn't need such inordinantly high budgets to develop anti-piracy schemes and technology, lobby for stronger legislation and pursue legal suits against violators so their profits would be better, and they'd have more money to put into producing stronger product. Sort of a double-edged sword for them. The bottom line is, though, they'll never be able to stop piracy, right or wrong. The geeks, hackers and tech thieves will always be three steps ahead of them, no matter what they do. They'd be better off finding ways to make it more desirable for people to want to buy their products to get the benefits of doing so. More carrot, less stick so to speak.

jag

 

[jaguarr]

I knew it. THose Motherfu*kers. Looking over my shoulder! Wait. Oh, I see, ok, I didn't read the whole thing before flipping out. OK, I have the legal version.
Interesting article.

If you installed their WGA tool, they're still collecting all kinds of data about you whether you like it or not.

jag

 

[Darthphere]

If you installed their WGA tool, they're still collecting all kinds of data about you whether you like it or not.

jag

[conservative/jonty]Well if youre not doing anything illegal or wrong it shouldnt matter.[/conservative/jonty]

 

[jaguarr]

[conservative/jonty]Well if youre not doing anything illegal or wrong it shouldnt matter.[/conservative/jonty]

You know, I said that a few times about the government when the whole thing about the New York Times and Washington Post publishing information about the gov't keeping tabs on people's bank accounts came out: "If the government hasn't been abusing the program and overstepping their legal bounds, then they shouldn't have anything to worry about and shouldn't be complaining". Not one neo-con (I do make a BIG distinction between neo-con's and actual conservatives) even went ten feet near that comment. Curious, eh?

jag

 

[Darthphere]

You know, I said that a few times about the government when the whole thing about the New York Times and Washington Post publishing information about the gov't keeping tabs on people's bank accounts came out: "If the government hasn't been abusing the program and overstepping their legal bounds, then they shouldn't have anything to worry about and shouldn't be complaining". Not one neo-con (I do make a BIG distinction between neo-con's and actual conservatives) even went ten feet near that comment. Curious, eh?

jag

Yeah, both of the extremes are hypocrites when it comes to that. Note: I said both.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I'm not disagreeing with you by any means, but there is the matter of full disclosure when engaging in tactics like this,

Yeah, I forgot to mention that. If the cops put out a TV ad campaign and put up huge signs that say "Hi! We will have 20 patrol units on Elm Street, 24 hours a day.", well, yeah, speeding on Elm Street will drop off dramatically. If they said "Hi, we'd like to know if you're using an illegal copy of Windows, so, if you feel like it, check "yes" if you stole it, check "no" if you bought it, or, just click on cancel and forget about the whole thing.", what criminal is going to check "yes"?

The other problem many companies in the tech and arts industries run into is that they have this nagging tendency to WAY overprice their products in the name of maximizing profits; to the point that it drives MANY potential customers to pursue "other avenues" of acquiring their wares.

Yeah, I know. I know nothing about computers, so I just saved up $2,000, plopped it into my computer-genius friend's hand and said, "Build me the best computer you can for this much money."
Suddenly I couldn't get Windows updates and we figured out that it was because he slapped an illegal Windows 2000 on there, which pissed me off. So I go to B.U.Y. Windows XP and buh*GoInG*! WTF kind of price tag is THAT?!?. Nonetheless, the answer is to simply not buy over-priced stuff, 'cause it works both ways. They know that 4 out of 10 people are stealing their product, so they jack up the price to get the money they deserve from the smaller percentage that's actually compensating them for it. Stupid strategy, but that happens.
Plus, I think 6 bucks for a pack of smokes (thin paper tubes full of dried leaves) is criminal insanity, but that doesn't mean I sneak in and steal packs of smokes and feel justified because, well, they're so over-priced.

More carrot, less stick so to speak.

That makes sense though.

 

[jaguarr]

Yeah, I forgot to mention that. If the cops put out a TV ad campaign and put up huge signs that say "Hi! We will have 20 patrol units on Elm Street, 24 hours a day.", well, yeah, speeding on Elm Street will drop off dramatically. If they said "Hi, we'd like to know if you're using an illegal copy of Windows, so, if you feel like it, check "yes" if you stole it, check "no" if you bought it, or, just click on cancel and forget about the whole thing.", what criminal is going to check "yes"?

The difference is, though, that if I'm a Microsoft customer and I purchase a product from them using my own money, I expect to know up front if they've embedded data collection subroutines that run independently and in the background, collecting personal data about me and transmitting that data back to Microsoft. Microsoft are NOT a government sponsored law enforcement agency and are bound by different rules as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah, I know. I know nothing about computers, so I just saved up $2,000, plopped it into my computer-genius friend's hand and said, "Build me the best computer you can for this much money."
Suddenly I couldn't get Windows updates and we figured out that it was because he slapped an illegal Windows 2000 on there, which pissed me off. So I go to B.U.Y. Windows XP and buh*GoInG*! WTF kind of price tag is THAT?!?. Nonetheless, the answer is to simply not buy over-priced stuff, 'cause it works both ways. They know that 4 out of 10 people are stealing their product, so they jack up the price to get the money they deserve from the smaller percentage that's actually compensating them for it. Stupid strategy, but that happens.
Plus, I think 6 bucks for a pack of smokes (thin paper tubes full of dried leaves) is criminal insanity, but that doesn't mean I sneak in and steal packs of smokes and feel justified because, well, they're so over-priced.

So, yeah, they know a lot of people are stealing their product because they can't afford it, so they jack the price up even more to compensate. GREAT business model. At least it's self-perpetuating. i personally won't support companies that do crap like that and I haven't purchased a Microsoft product in at least 8 years because of their business tactics. They bully their customers, bully the government and generally go out of their way to squash the little guys who try to compete with them. The clock is ticking on them, though. They've burned so many bridges with their own employees that a lot of their high profile folks have jumped ship for places like Google, their innovation and creativity are at an all time low and they've had to completely strip their "new" operating system Vista of nearly ALL of it's compelling features and STILL have woud up delaying it's release by a ridiculous amount of time. The stranglehold they used to have on personal computing is going the way of the do-do.

That makes sense though.

I have a real issue with companies that treat their customers like criminals right from the get go. Paying customers deserve to be treated fairly and with some respect. And, they should be rewarded for their loyalty. It seems so much of Corporate America is less concerned with retaining the customers they have than they are with just trying to lure new people in, which is a f**ked up approach to doing business from my perspective. You have paying customers that you treat like crap, thereby pushing them away to other companies, while you focus on trying to bring in new suckers to abuse. Pathetic. Customer satisfaction just doesn't seem to be a priority for so many companies these days, and it's inexplicable to me.

jag

 

[Fledermaus]

I wonder if everybody will be able to get in on some class-action money?

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Yes, all good points, jag.
The whole scene seems to me like the "Person's depressed, 'cause they're fat, so they sleep all day and over-eat, which makes them fatter, which really makes them super-depressed, so they sleep and eat all day, which makes them hate themselves, so they get depressed and sleep all day and eat a lot..." thing, heh

 

[black_dust]

I thought it looked odd in the first place so i never downloaded it

 

[jaguarr]

The hellhounds have been unleashed:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2003103175_microsoft04.html

Microsoft faces second class-action spyware lawsuit

By Benjamin J. Romano
Seattle Times technology reporter

A second class-action lawsuit filed in less than a week against Microsoft alleges that a central pillar of the company's anti-piracy effort — installed automatically on millions of computers — amounts to spyware.

But the attorney behind the first suit, filed on behalf of a Los Angeles man, said the company addressed many of his concerns in a software update it issued last Tuesday.

The second suit, filed Friday on behalf of a group of Washington businesses and individuals, appears to refer to a test version of Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA), a Microsoft program that is designed to check whether a user is running a legitimate copy of the company's operating system software.

Before it was updated, WGA "phoned home" to Microsoft servers once a day, delivering information about a user's computer and operating system. This daily communication was not disclosed when WGA was installed and fits the definition of spyware offered by at least two computer security groups, the Washington suit alleges.

It also states that users who elected to receive automatic updates from Microsoft "received WGA without user action, as though it was a critical security update — which it is not."

Microsoft disputes the allegations.

"We're confident that the allegations made in these suits are without merit," said Microsoft spokesman Jim Dessler. "They really do distort the objectives of our anti-piracy program and obscure the real issue here, which is the harm caused by piracy and counterfeiting not only to Microsoft, but to our customers."

The plaintiffs in the Washington suit — two businesses and three individuals who are "owners and users of computers running genuine licensed Microsoft Windows XP software" — are seeking class-action status against the company. The class would include all U.S. computer owners and users who have WGA software installed on their computers, according to the complaint.

Attorneys in the case could not be reached Monday.

Scott Kamber, an attorney representing the Los Angeles plaintiff, said the changes in the latest version of WGA, which include elimination of the daily "phone home" and a clearer licensing agreement, were a vindication.

"Microsoft knew it was wrong and that is why they changed it within 24 hours of us filing our complaint," Kamber said.

Dessler said the updates to WGA had nothing to do with the lawsuits.

"The program really has evolved to take into account customer feedback," Dessler said. It was "carefully developed to address privacy in a manner that is respectful to our customers and is entirely lawful."


jag

 

[jaguarr]

I thought it looked odd in the first place so i never downloaded it

Better check and make sure it didn't install itself anyway. Seems like this is a problem that many people are reporting, actually. You get it from M$ and you don't even know it. Nice.

jag

 

[black_dust]

Better check and make sure it didn't install itself anyway. Seems like this is a problem that many people are reporting, actually. You get it from M$ and you don't even know it. Nice.

jag

Naw i dont think it did, it was on my list of "Oi microsoft wants you to download this now..." i clicked no

 

[Sparta*]

All I have to say is **** you Microsoft....**** you, you *** guzzling pieces of dog ****/rant

 

[Darthphere]

So Microsoft releases this software hidden in an update, ****s up, realizes it, post information on how to delete it and now people want to sue? Ummm yeah.

 

[jaguarr]

This is a slightly related news story, so I'm adding it to this thread.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/276555_worm06.html

Hackers use new worm to infect PCs

Virus pretends it's Windows Genuine Advantage

Thursday, July 6, 2006

BLOOMBERG NEWS

A newly discovered worm, pretending to be Microsoft Corp.'s Windows Genuine Advantage program, is being used by hackers to install malicious software on personal computers.

The worm, a program that spreads itself throughout an infected PC, is being sent by way of Time Warner Inc.'s AOL Instant Messenger software, said Ronald O'Brien, senior analyst at Abingdon, U.K.-based Sophos Plc.

Closely held Sophos first warned about the worm Monday.

Once installed on a PC, the worm copies itself into a Windows system folder, creates a new file displayed as "Windows Genuine Advantage Validation Notification" and becomes part of the computer's automatic startup, O'Brien said.

Hackers can use the software to gain control of the PC, grab confidential information and create denial of service attacks against targeted Web sites, according to Sophos.

"The worm is using the Genuine Advantage identity as a means of convincing users of its validity," O'Brien said from Lynnfield, Mass., where Sophos has a U.S. office.

Kjersti Gunderson, a spokeswoman for Microsoft, said the next version of Microsoft's Malicious Software Removal Tool, to be released Tuesday, will scan for and clean the so-called Backdoor: Win32/IRCbot.R worm.

Microsoft's Windows Genuine Advantage software checks to see that users have licensed copies of Windows before allowing them to download important updates onto their PCs.

Microsoft's security advisory about the worm can be found at: www.microsoft. com/security/encyclopedia/details.aspx?name.


It just keeps getting worse for M$ with this WGA program of theirs.

jag