Superman Returns Re: The Offical Jason Appreciation Thread

[Matt]

I wonder how Richard will react once Lois tells him the truth...

Thats my problem...Richard seems like a fairly nice, decent guy. Then Superman comes back and suddenly takes everything away from him. His fiancee, his child...everything. I don't see how the audience WON'T root for Richard. They are walking a very fine line.

 

[MoreCowbell]

Thats my problem...Richard seems like a fairly nice, decent guy. Then Superman comes back and suddenly takes everything away from him. His fiancee, his child...everything. I don't see how the audience WON'T root for Richard. They are walking a very fine line.

Yeah, I've always said Richard is the bigger obstacle. He's damned if he does and if he doesn't.

 

[charl_huntress]

Thats my problem...Richard seems like a fairly nice, decent guy. Then Superman comes back and suddenly takes everything away from him. His fiancee, his child...everything. I don't see how the audience WON'T root for Richard. They are walking a very fine line.

There is a huge difference for rooting for the underdog and wanting him to win over your favorite team, and that's the fine line I think the audience is going to walk. Everyone is going to want Lois, Jason and Supes/Clark to be together, and that's the point I think you are missing.

 

[The Caped Knight]

I wonder how Richard will react once Lois tells him the truth...

I think Richard already knows . Besides Jason really isn't his son. Lois raised Jason on her own . Richard came into the picture a long way down the road .

He knows Lois is madly in love with SUPERMAN. and she got feelings for her friend Clark Kent .

 

[Matt]

There is a huge difference for rooting for the underdog and wanting him to win over your favorite team, and that's the fine line I think the audience is going to walk. Everyone is going to want Lois, Jason and Supes/Clark to be together, and that's the point I think you are missing.

You're taking the Lois/Clark relationship for granted as a fan. A huge portion of this audience will have never seen a Superman movie in their life. They know nothing of the mythos. Hell, half of them will be more familiar with Smallville and probably hoping a Lana character shows up in a sequel for Clark.

There is a good chance they will come to root for Richard. You have this nice guy, who has been good to Lois, loves her, loves her child like his own. Then you have Clark...someone who disappeared for five years then just waltzes back and tries to take the girl.

Who would you really root for?

 

[The Caped Knight]

There is a huge difference for rooting for the underdog and wanting him to win over your favorite team, and that's the fine line I think the audience is going to walk. Everyone is going to want Lois, Jason and Supes/Clark to be together, and that's the point I think you are missing.

You got that damn right .

 

[charl_huntress]

You're taking the Lois/Clark relationship for granted as a fan. A huge portion of this audience will have never seen a Superman movie in their life. They know nothing of the mythos. Hell, half of them will be more familiar with Smallville and probably hoping a Lana character shows up in a sequel for Clark.

C'mon on Matt! Superman has been around for nearly seventy years. Do you think people don't know who Lois Lane is, and do you seriously want me to believe people don't know who she is in the mythos????? It's like common knowledge she's his girlfriend. She IS the most recognizable figure in the mythos aside from Superman himself...so c'mon on with that.

As for Smallville, that's a niche market that hit, at its high point, 8 million viewers US. LnC was watched by over 20 million people US. The comic have also clearly established the ONE true love for Superman. C'mon...I don't need to bring in my shipper preferences to defend this position.

There is a good chance they will come to root for Richard. You have this nice guy, who has been good to Lois, loves her, loves her child like his own. Then you have Clark...someone who disappeared for five years then just waltzes back and tries to take the girl.

Who would you really root for?

I'm going to root for Superman, like most of the audience will too because pretty much everyone and their momma thinks Lois/Superman/Clark are synonmous.

I know who you will root for, but don't delude yourself into think you speak for the general public. They are limited in their knowledge of Superman, and I'm sure the one thing they are sure about is Superman loves and always saves Lois Lane. C'mon....be real with this Matt

 

[Matt]

C'mon on Matt! Superman has been around for nearly seventy years. Do you think people don't know who Lois Lane is, and do you seriously want me to believe people don't know who she is in the mythos????? It's like common knowledge she's his girlfriend. She IS the most recognizable figure in the mythos aside from Superman himself...so c'mon on with that.

As for Smallville, that's a niche market that hit, at its high point, 8 million viewers US. LnC was watched by over 20 million people US. The comic have also clearly established the ONE true love for Superman. C'mon...I don't need to bring in my shipper preferences to defend this position.



I'm going to root for Superman, like most of the audience will too because pretty much everyone and their momma thinks Lois/Superman/Clark are synonmous.

I know who you will root for, but don't delude yourself into think you speak for the general public. They are limited in their knowledge of Superman, and I'm sure the one thing I are sure about is Siuperm loves and always saves Lois Lane. C'mon....be real with this Matt

Yes, the name is recognizable. But how many people know anything beyond the name? Sure, she is a love interest, but that can change. All I am saying is, you create this perfect man for Lois and you really don't think the audience will sympatheiz for him when Clark comes in after being a deadbeat for five years and steals his girl?

 

[The Caped Knight]

Everyone knows SUPERMAN/Clark is DESTINED to be with Lois Lane. So I know they will be pulling for Lois & Clark to end up together .

 

[charl_huntress]

Yes, the name is recognizable. But how many people know anything beyond the name? Sure, she is a love interest, but that can change. All I am saying is, you create this perfect man for Lois and you really don't think the audience will sympatheiz for him when Clark comes in after being a deadbeat for five years and steals his girl?

You are assuming the general public is going to think/believe that Superman is a deadbeat dad. Again...c'mon???? They gave him a VERY plausible reason for leaving, and they hightlight that he feels like **** for not saying goodbye to Lois, which gives Lois the perfect scapegoat to be mad at him.

C'mon Matt, give me something else

Sure things can change in the mythos, but this has been the status quo for seventy years. Singer has expressed his extreme love for the mythos and Lois Lane, do you think he is going to be the one to change it????? LOL...ask me that question, I'm not so sure, but one thing I do know is folks are not going to think Supes was some deadbeat dad who abandoned his child because he simply didn't give a crap. This is Superman we are talking about Matt. Remember, he is the STAR of the movie. There will be very few scenes that make him look like a complete *******.

 

[Matt]

You are assuming the general public is going to think Superman is deadbeat dad. Again...c'mon. They gave him a VERY plausible reason for leaving, and they hightlight that he feels like **** for not saying goodbye, which gives Lois the perfect scapegoat to be mad. C'mon Matt, give me something else.

Sure things can change, but this has been the status quo for seventy years. Singer has expressed his extreme love for the mythos and Lois Lane, do you think he is going to be the one to change it????? LOL...ask me that question, I'm not so sure, but one thing I do know is folks are not going to think Supes was some deadbeat dad who abandoned his child because he simply didn't give a crap. This is Superman we are talking about Matt. Remember, he is the STAR of the movie. There will be very few scenes that make him look like a complete *******.

HEre's the major fallicy of your argument. You're pretty much ignoring the fact that they are developing Richard as this great guy, great husband, great dad on the grounds of "its Superman! Comeon!"

 

[charl_huntress]

HEre's the major fallicy of your argument. You're pretty much ignoring the fact that they are developing Richard as this great guy, great husband, great dad on the grounds of "its Superman! Comeon!"

You know what? Here is the fallacy of your arguement. You seem to be forgetting the reasons why Richard was created to be a copy-kat, human version of Superman. Or are you so keen to derail this movie that you can't see why Singer and crew made him like he is?????

C'mon...he's been raising Superman's son and dating his woman for the past five years. Do you think the audience wants to see Lois Lane and the son of Superman being raised by an *******????

C'mon...recognize your own deficient arguements before you try to call mine out because I know you are smart enough to see where this is heading

 

[Batman the 6th]

I'm rooting for Supes. He had no idea Lois was pregnant, and he does feel bad. That decision will change his life forever. My guess is Lois will realize that she doesn't love Richard as much as she loves Supes. BTW, what kind of feelings does Lois have for Clark? She barely mentioned him to Richard, and I'm not sure she did. She also ignores him completely.

 

[Matt]

You know what? Here is the fallacy of your arguement. You seem to be forgetting the reasons why Richard was created to be a copy-kat, human version of Superman. Or are you so keen to derail this movie that you can't see why Singer and crew made him like he is?????

C'mon...he's been raising Superman's son and dating his woman for the past five years. Do you think the audience wants to see Lois Lane and the son of Superman being raised by an *******????

C'mon...recognize your own deficient arguements before you try to call mine out because I know you are smart enough to see where this is heading

But the fact is, he has been there, he is the one the audience will sympatheiz with. Not Superman simply on the grounds that hes Superman.

 

[charl_huntress]

But the fact is, he has been there, he is the one the audience will sympatheiz with. Not Superman simply on the grounds that hes Superman.

Like I said before, there is a huge difference in rooting for the underdog and wanting your favorite team to win. This is the fine line you mentioned, and like I said this is the point you seem to be missing about the whole scenario.

The audience WILL want Lois to be with Superman/Clark like they have been rooting for them for years. We are talking about the general public...not Lana Lang fans, not Smallville fans, and not YOU.

Yes, they will sympathize with him. Surely they would sympathize with anyone who loves a woman whose heart belongs to someone else...not to mention she has a child with them. Yes, Richard White will get sympathy, but the audience is going to be rooting for the home team.

Remember...this is a Superman movie...not the Richard White show.

 

[Batman the 6th]

Yeah, but it is still not Richards son. Lets take this idea.
I have a one night stand with this girl I've know for a few weeks. I then go back home to another state because I don't like it there. I come back 5 years later, and I see my fling has a five year old kid and has a fiancee. I found out the kid is mine. I have every right to be in my childs life. Plus, Lois could get Clark/Supes for child support. Just because he won't be in his childs life, doesn't mean he can't pay money for him. Ever hear Kanye West's "Golddigger?" Exactly.

 

[bsquad]

I wonder how Richard will react once Lois tells him the truth...

I wonder if he knows he isn't the biological father. I imagine that he knows, its just that he doesn't know for real if Superman is the father, although he suspects it.

I know that Richard and Superman seem like they will be in competion for Lois simply because they both love her its just that I don't think Superman would want a competion against him. He seems willing to step aside so he doesn't interfere with their love. Ofcourse his simply being around calls for people to look at it and think-who should she be with? But if I look at from Superman's POV, based on the type of person Superman is, if Superman had to answer I think he would say "Richard".

 

[Fatboy Roberts]

Then Superman comes back and suddenly takes everything away from him.

No he doesn't, and you KNOW he doesn't. You read the novel. Superman takes NOTHING. As a matter of fact, he lets Richard continue to be Jason's FATHER and flies off ALONE.

 

[Matt]

No he doesn't, and you KNOW he doesn't. You read the novel. Superman takes NOTHING. As a matter of fact, he lets Richard continue to be Jason's FATHER and flies off ALONE.

Just like Spider-man doesn't get with MJ at the end? By the end of the sequel, Lois and Clark will be together, raising their son, and Richard will likely be out of the picture. It was delaying the inevitable to keep the tension going and you know it.

 

[charl_huntress]

I wonder if he knows he isn't the biological father. I imagine that he knows, its just that he doesn't know for real if Superman is the father, although he suspects it.

I know that Richard and Superman seem like they will be in competion for Lois simply because they both love her its just that I don't think Superman would want a competion against him. He seems willing to step aside so he doesn't interfere with their love. Ofcourse his simply being around calls for people to look at it and think-who should she be with? But if I look at from Superman's POV, based on the type of person Superman is, if Superman had to answer I think he would say "Richard".

LOL...you just hit the nail on the head of why I'm a little leary of him flying off. You said it more perfectly than I have. That's my deal...I don't want an angsty hero. I want the light at the end of the tunnel that Singer promised. He said Superman is not angsty. Him flying off is some angsty ****...I DON'T like it I hope it's resolved in the next movie.

 

[bsquad]

No he doesn't, and you KNOW he doesn't. You read the novel. Superman takes NOTHING. As a matter of fact, he lets Richard continue to be Jason's FATHER and flies off ALONE.

true. he admits that it hurts like hell but he also admits that Richard is a good man. After Lois tells him straight up she loves Richard he doesn't push her or him. He accepts it and places the blame on himself for being naive enough to think that the world would wait for him

 

[The Caped Knight]

Just like Spider-man doesn't get with MJ at the end? By the end of the sequel, Lois and Clark will be together, raising their son, and Richard will likely be out of the picture. It was delaying the inevitable to keep the tension going and you know it.

True.

 

[bsquad]

LOL...you just hit the nail on the head of why I'm a little leary of him flying off. You said it more perfectly than I have. That's my deal...I don't want an angsty hero. I want the light at the end of the tunnel that Singer promised. He said Superman is not angsty. Him flying off is some angsty ****...I DON'T like it I hope it's resolved in the next movie.

well he has to stretch it out, he is planning a trilogy.

 

[Batman the 6th]

Me too.

 

[charl_huntress]

Just like Spider-man doesn't get with MJ at the end? By the end of the sequel, Lois and Clark will be together, raising their son, and Richard will likely be out of the picture. It was delaying the inevitable to keep the tension going and you know it.

Right...what is wrong with that? Why do you have a problem? Are you not liking the fact that they will/may possibly get together (because I'm not convinced that's an absolute)?

Anyway, it's like you are defending Richard and his purpose while not acknowledge his real purpose in the story.

Why do you want to hate this movie so much, Matt????? Seriously, you are bringing up stuff that is easily refuted, but you still keep harping on it. I know you are intelligent, so you can't really be a troll. Do you just not like Superman having a kid, or what?