The camp has been erased for a reason.

[Spider-Bat]

I could not believe how horrible and campy this show was when I watched the first episode last week. I thought it might be fun, but I didn't think it would be this bad.

Sure it looked cartoony from the ads but so does the spectacular spider-man but that show is very good and quite serious.

They have spent too long erasing the camp from Batman for a reason. And after The Dark Knight he deserves a better and serious cartoon series.
Don't bring this crap back.

The idot producer said they wanted to remind people Super heroes have senses of humor well, Batman doesn't he's a dark not a joke.

Understand which charcters are light then do that with them not Batman. Idiots.

 

[Cain]

*sighs*

I swear the selfishness of some fans is too outrageous to even seem real sometimes. Do you understand that young children deserve a chance at becoming fans too?

Let me tell you when I became a Batman fan what got me into the character were reruns of the Filmation cartoon and the Adam West series. Those were campy as hell but I thought they were lots of fun. Burton's movie hadn't even been released yet and guess what a year after that I started buying Batman comics with my own money. I appreciate the memories of those programs even though now at 25 it's not my ideal interpretation of the character and his world.

What does this even mean

"And after The Dark Knight he deserves a better and serious cartoon series."

Why? I mean maybe some parents may not *gasp* want their children exposed to something "serious" and a "serious" cartoon will bore some kids too. TDK is a PG-13 borderline R movie and while my parents never censored me (first 2 movies I saw at the flicks were R and I was only 5) I understand and respect that some parents don't want their children exposed to something like that.

So it makes sense that a cartoon wasn't modeled after that tone. We already had two consecutive Batman cartoons that dealt with exploring the Bat verse with mature undertones and telling a one universe type of story. It's only right to switch it up and not be so stagnant you want a serious Batman toon? last time I checked the seasons of BTAS are available for purchase on DVD.

Fact is Batman isn't so grim and there were times even with the more respected stories from the 70's and 80's were there was a light hearted style to the stories and the character himself. Particularly the Brave and the Bold comic series from the 70's which this series is based on. This wasn't just something strictly from the 50's or 60's contrary to what revisionist history may say.

It's only right that there is something in the mass media that reminds people of that after Batman has become a character so synonamous with "darkness" now that it manages to turn some people off. You don't like the toon cool you have every right not to but to rant about it as if it's a pox on humanity or something is a bit over the top.

I didn't even watch this show and don't know if I will but one thing I will say is this. I am happy that it exists because it guarantees that there will be lots of kids who will be introduced to Batman this way. That means my favorite character gets to live on for more decades on end as these kids grow older and get exposed to more Batman product and that's not a bad thing by any means. Plus it also introduces them to DC characters that have never ever appeared in any cartoon or series before and as a DC fan that makes me happy as it brings more exposure to a lot of great characters and shows the world that DC is more than just Batman and Superman.

 

[Lobo]

 

[Cain]

^ Great av I will forever be a card carrying member of NO MAAM. Anyway to further elaborate on my previous post camp doesn't always equals crap and when it comes to Batman it was never erased. Last time I checked you could still find hundred of Batman comics with camp elements around, Batman: The Movie has never been pulled from stores, and there are also millions of Batman fans dying for WB and FOX to come to some agreement so that they could get the 60's series on DVD.

Camp is a big element of the Batman mythology like it or not and if it wasn't for camp the character would not have lasted 69 years in publication. It's only fair that it also gets represented when all we have out there repping our character is "teh evil darkness that is so bleak it makes demons cry".

 

[Lobo]

We shouldn't be complaining about a cartoon made for 8 year old's because it looks and sounds like a cartoon for 8 year old's. it's not for us, it's for them. We've already had Batman TAS various adult themed movies, and even some more adult oriented JLU episodes.

As for the av, thanks, btw do you know this song? Mmm Hmm Him?

 

[KingOfMars]

I could not believe how horrible and campy this show was when I watched the first episode last week. I thought it might be fun, but I didn't think it would be this bad.

Sure it looked cartoony from the ads but so does the spectacular spider-man but that show is very good and quite serious.

They have spent too long erasing the camp from Batman for a reason. And after The Dark Knight he deserves a better and serious cartoon series.
Don't bring this crap back.

The idot producer said they wanted to remind people Super heroes have senses of humor well, Batman doesn't he's a dark not a joke.

Understand which charcters are light then do that with them not Batman. Idiots.

so their idiots because they realise batman has a richer history than you are willing to admit, or maybe you are too young and naive to appreciate this, still the fact remains you cant dictate what you believe the character is to others, batman was meant to be a dark and brooding character by the man who created him, and as time passed the stories became what most consider campy and almost irrelevant, yet the point is the character has existed over sixty years, in many interpretations, and many brilliant writers and artist have come and gone over this time, many in my generation grew on the silver age version of batman and they are still nostalgic about this part of the characters history today, like it or not it hasnt been erased, it never will be, learn to respect what came before, and respect not everyone sees things as you do my young sir.

 

[BubbaGump]

Agreed, Cain. Some fans are just way too selfish. And even though this show is for kids I found myself unexpectedly laughing at parts ("they don't have legs"). I really enjoyed watching the pilot. It's turning out to be a great show, and miles better than The Batman.

I'm not sure you get that this is a kid's show, but uh...it is. You're ranting about a show aimed at 5-10 year olds. Nice, dude.

And adult doesn't neccesarily mean good. Take Gotham Knight for instance. It was adult for the sake of being adult and forgot all about solid story structure and characterization. Batman the Brave and the Bold is a show with a ton of heart and I guess you just can't see that through your fanboy glasses.

If you want dark, read the comics. Let the kids have a chance.

 

[DJ Kornphlake]

The idot producer said they wanted to remind people Super heroes have senses of humor well, Batman doesn't he's a dark not a joke.

If you read the comics, you'd know that he does have a sense of humor.

 

[ScarecrowMan666]

Yeah this thread is just stupid in general...some of my earliest memories of Batman is the Adam West version...sure I don't much like him now, but fact is when I was little it got me into Batman, and got me interested in the character. The show isn't that bad man. I watched it, and if you go into it expecting a dark brooding Batman, then you will be dissapointed. But try watching it just for fun, because it is a really fun series. I think it fits in well with things like Ben 10(also a great show for kids), and secret saturdays. Yes it's different, but let the kids have their Batman too. Don't be a selfish prick, and let them have their fun.

 

[Jochimus]

Frankly, I don't see where this show is campy.

Sure, Batman cracks one liners now and then, but IMO it's more of a snarky kind of humor (My favorite line, to GA: "What is this, the fifth or the sixth death trap I've been tied up to because of you over the years?") that, if Batman ever had sense of humor, you might actually see him having (in fact, in an odd way, it kinda reminds me of Frank Miller's Batman). It's not even close to Adam West, who had to spell out the name "Batman" to a telephone operator, could smell the color pink, and repeatedly inflicted the Batusi upon civilization. I just don't see the similarity.

IMO the purists who are worried about the return of camp are panicking for no justifiable reason, and this only seems to support my belief that there are comic book fans out there who seem to have some sort of vendetta against children.

And for the record, I never grew up with any specific version of Batman, just Batman: my first exposure to Batman was syndicated reruns of the old Adam West show, and then Super Friends/Super Powers on Saturday mornings, then the actual comics - which by that point had reverted back to the darker persona (most of the ones I got as kid involved stuff like snuff films, child labor scams and serial killers and rarely involved any of the classic Rogues), and by the time I was 12 it was Michael Keaton in black rubber armor. So I saw the gamut of what Batman could be early on.

 

[Superwoman Prime]

This trend of obsessing over darkness is pathetic... and really says a lot about modern society. Some people need to see their doctor and get medication.

Spider-Bat, I'll remind you that there are various versions of Batman. Both light, and dark, have been extremely successful, and help expand on the character, and bring in more demographics. That's why Batman is as popular as he is. He can be a VERY interesting character both for adults and children.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

You know what... I'm not even going to waste my fingers typing a long thought out argument... you just don't deserve it.

 

[Jack Ups]

I love the dark Batman, thats where my love lies, but i lvoe these type of things aswell, it lets you have fun with them, being a fan you should enjoy just being able to have media of him.

And all this Batman must be dark blah blah blah......get over it. Batman doesnt have too or should be dark and violent all the time.

 

[Grommers]

I have to agree with spider-bat...
yeah he was campy before, thats all good...but hello? welcome to the age we live in? Sure kids at age 8 deserve a batman they can watch...batman : tas I watched when I was like 6 or 7? It really isnt' bad graphically like everyone makes it out to be...

There's no reason for the campyness, and I agree with spider-bat saying it should never of been brought back. Batman : TAS proved they can make a show that is dark, but also appealing to kids. No reason they can't do the same again. They wanted this show to appeal directly to kids, probably in hopes to sell more toys to the kids. Which I never think is the right direction to go in.

But whatever..my words don't mean much, and I just hope that statistically this show fails. Why? Because you better believe we'll get a darker batman cartoon again. If i'm wrong, and this show does well, then good for it. I just hope it doesn't cross over into the comics as well.

 

[BubbaGump]

I have to agree with spider-bat...
yeah he was campy before, thats all good...but hello? welcome to the age we live in? Sure kids at age 8 deserve a batman they can watch...batman : tas I watched when I was like 6 or 7? It really isnt' bad graphically like everyone makes it out to be...

There's no reason for the campyness, and I agree with spider-bat saying it should never of been brought back. Batman : TAS proved they can make a show that is dark, but also appealing to kids. No reason they can't do the same again. They wanted this show to appeal directly to kids, probably in hopes to sell more toys to the kids. Which I never think is the right direction to go in.

But whatever..my words don't mean much, and I just hope that statistically this show fails. Why? Because you better believe we'll get a darker batman cartoon again. If i'm wrong, and this show does well, then good for it. I just hope it doesn't cross over into the comics as well.

Do you even read the comics? The uber dark titles are selling well and they're aimed for a mature market. They won't change that just because of the success of a show aimed at 5-6 year olds.

And I don't think you understand, but animation is a business as well. It's not like you pay to watch an episode of B&TB. Animation these days is expensive and WB has to find a way to fund the show so selling merchandise and toys is the only way to make a profit. That's how it's always been. Transformers was basically a 30 minute commercial. As was He-Man. As was every single crappy Saturday morning cartoon that everyone nostalgically remembers from their childhood. You never think it's the right direction to sell toys to kids? Well what about TAS? Because I don't think people realize it but that was the goal of the entire show. To recuperate the losses spent on the animation by selling toys. They just decided to focus on story more.

The Batman tried too hard to be like TAS and it failed (at least, to us. With the kids it lasted 5 seasons) because the writing was stupid as were the stories. B&TB isn't trying to be TAS and with that burden of it's shoulders it can do anything it wants. The writing is entertaining. For God's sake, this is the closest we've gotten to a Frank Miller badass Batman in well...ever (TNBA doesn't count).

The trend of obsessing over darkness IS pathetic. Especially assuming a majority of this board is over 20 and whining how a kids show wasn't made for them. Consider that and think about it for a moment.

Yeah. It is pretty DAMN pathetic.

 

[Grommers]

The only thing I find pathetic is that you compare B: TAS saying they recuperated there losses through toys. I never looked at "The Batman" as trying to be "TAS", and I very much enjoyed "The Batman." Maybe thats why I did enjoy it, and all you hated it so much?

As well, all this "darkness" crap...uh you do realize that crap just set movie records? Why? Because it focused more on story instead of toys and appealing to kids, there's no reason a "batman" show can't get high enough ratings.

Oh and thank you for proving my point more on saying the "uber-dark" batman comics are the top sellers...OH MAN! Your right animation is a business...and its headed in the wrong direction according to you.

If I wanted a happy-go-lucky hero that made jokes I'd much rather see Supes....oh wait this is just a cash in hopes to sell toys.

Cut the crap and stop justifying a kids batman because "its fair for 8 year olds." The only thing that is pathetic is your justifying those 30 minute long commercials saying that's good television when it isn't...

 

[C. W. Saturn]

I think it's time to remind the people that Batman is just an adult man who wears his pyjamas all day.

 

[Ion Kenshin]

i really dont see this show as being extremely campy the way that some people are describing it. I see it as a fun show and again it is marketed towards a younger demographic. While BTAS was watched by all of us at the ages that this new series is being targeted to we were a bit more mature in the cartoons we watched if thats makes any sense. The cartoons kids watch nowadays are ridculous. As long as its got bright flashy things in it kids will watch it. They dont have the option of the kinds of cartoons we used to enjoy.

You say that TDK's success can justify that people want to see a dark batman and yes it can but once again that movie was directed to an older demographic. And lets be real i think its safe to say that part of the films success is also due in part to the fact that it was Heath Ledgers final performance from a Hollywood standpoint a death of an actor whose role in the film was a supposed catalyst that led to his death will draw in a crown like onlookers at a car crash. So i personally think it is not the best justification that everyone wants a darker Batman.

Yes the dark Batman comics are selling because older kids are buying them. For kids at a younger most parents dont take them to comic stores or buy them comics. But all young kids watch cartoons and that for most of them is their first introduction to these characters. From here when they get to the point of wanting to read anything much less comics they can progress to the next level of storytelling for that character. Its a different medium and a different take on the character targeted to different demographics. Appreciate it for the fact that it is a different view albeit not exactly want you want it to be.

No matter what people may think cartoons are still seen as primarily for children. Hell even when im watching anime people say "oh you're watching cartoons? thats kind of childish." So when companies are making cartoons not many if any at all are thinking about what the adults or young adults want. They are focusing on their target...children.

 

[Jochimus]

I think it's time to remind the people that Batman is just an adult man who wears his pyjamas all day.

Yup. Just as I posted previously in the general discussion thread...

Batman's been a "children-targeted sell-out" almost* from the very beginning, LONG before there were ever ANY Batman cartoons - his own creators saw to that (well, Kane did, anyway). He's been a fixture on toy-store shelves since the '60s. Heck, at his core, the character himself is basically an overgrown nine-year-old who copes with severe emotional trauma by running around in his playsuit after bedtime beating up the mean men who took his mommy and daddy away from him - he just happens to be legally able to drink and smoke and have sex and drive cars (one of the latter BEING a hellaciously-pimped, jet-powered answer to Power Wheels that would give Q-Branch a run for its money).

Even the producers of B:TAS knew this: in fact, Dini was one of the most prominent creators to bring this up recently, mentioning specifically how his gadgetry is little more than a collection of high-powered, lethal toys.
*=I said ALMOST, note. He had ONE year where he was actually cracking wise about kicking guys off of roofs and snapping their necks and laughing as men burned to death before Robin showed up. And people are complaining about Batman making jokes...

Yes the dark Batman comics are selling because older kids are buying them. For kids at a younger most parents dont take them to comic stores or buy them comics.

Or they'll pick up a Batman comic off the grocery store rack without ever bothering to actually open it up and look at it, as in my case. One of those Batman comics I mentioned getting as a kid was at a church youth group function, of all things - and involved Batman chasing a villainess called the Queen of Hearts who spent the better half of the story hacking out men's hearts with a power saw and displaying them in her collection. If the group leaders had seen that, they would have FREAKED.

The Dark Knight of the comics will always be around. The failure of "Batman & Robin" saw to that once and for all. This cartoon isn't going to compromise that, IMO.

 

[KingOfMars]

I dont understand this obsession with conforming to the age we live in, not everything should be politically correct or intelligent, or even placed in a modern time to resonate with an audience, its just fun, im sorry if that doesnt appeal to the stiffs or the fickle kids these days.

 

[C. W. Saturn]

The idot producer said they wanted to remind people Super heroes have senses of humor well, Batman doesn't he's a dark not a joke.

Well, and did you watch BTAS? He makes lots of jokes there.

 

[SHADOWBAT69]

All the negative posts really reflect how pathetic this society has become. I feel sorry for such closed minded people.

 

[Ion Kenshin]

he did in justice league unlimited when Diana comments about her shoes being uncomfortable in the once and future thing episode and Batman responds with "You fight crime in high heels"...definately in the realm of joking.

He also laughs at the joke made by the Joker in the Killing Joke i believe. the one about the prison escapee (sp?) crossing the beam of light from one building to the next or sumthin to that effect.

 

[Superwoman Prime]

All the negative posts really reflect how pathetic this society has become. I feel sorry for such closed minded people.

That's why I say we need another good, inspiring Superman blockbuster. To remind people there's other great super heroes outside of the dark and gritty mold.

 

[C. W. Saturn]

Batman laughed and smiled and had humour from 39 well in into the 90s, until the whole "BATMAN IS SERIOUS STUFF!!!" crap started.