Playstation The Official Playstation 5 Thread

MS strategy is kind of weird when they claim the Gamepass loses them money.
Going all in on the Gamepass therefore, strikes me as a weird choice.
But it seems the XBOX is still not making them any money and i dont see how that could change, there arent enough games for it that are really a must have imo.

Yeah, the bigger problem to me is that going away from Physical could be very bad.
But also, it would kind of suck to see the XBOX kind of vanish.

Im not a fan of the Console war, but i just love the idea of Video Game Consoles and losing another one, would suck.
Despite the fact that I've never owned an Xbox I would hate for them to leave the console market. Sony absolutely needs a competitor to keep them from stagnating creatively and becoming another Apple that gouges their customers.

The problem with Gamepass is putting new exclusives on there at launch. There's no way they can recoup a $100+ million development budget for multiple games when their subscriber base is only 30 million. They either need to stop doing that (which would probably anger most of their subscribers) or massively increase their audience, which would only be possible on other platforms like Playstation or Switch (for streaming). Just like with Hollywood streamers Microsoft is slowly learning that this business model is unsustainable, but it's a little late to come to this realization now that they've conditioned people that new games are basically free if they have Gamepass.

I'm not sure what the numbers are for Xbox, but the recent Insomniac hack proved that over 50% of all game sales for Playstation are still physical. There's still a massive market there that Xbox is no longer serving.
 
Despite the fact that I've never owned an Xbox I would hate for them to leave the console market. Sony absolutely needs a competitor to keep them from stagnating creatively and becoming another Apple that gouges their customers.

The problem with Gamepass is putting new exclusives on there at launch. There's no way they can recoup a $100+ million development budget for multiple games when their subscriber base is only 30 million. They either need to stop doing that (which would probably anger most of their subscribers) or massively increase their audience, which would only be possible on other platforms like Playstation or Switch (for streaming). Just like with Hollywood streamers Microsoft is slowly learning that this business model is unsustainable, but it's a little late to come to this realization now that they've conditioned people that new games are basically free if they have Gamepass.

I'm not sure what the numbers are for Xbox, but the recent Insomniac hack proved that over 50% of all game sales for Playstation are still physical. There's still a massive market there that Xbox is no longer serving.
Same.
Never owned a XBOX but i just love to see Video Game Consoles to exist.
Monopoles are never good, so a Competition to Sony is always good.

The Gamepass is a neat idea but you lose too many groups of people.
The Casual gamer hardly is interested in the gamepass, they are interested in maybe just a certain game or so.

When you think about it, its no wonder MS is struggling in the sector.
 
Same.
Never owned a XBOX but i just love to see Video Game Consoles to exist.
Monopoles are never good, so a Competition to Sony is always good.

The Gamepass is a neat idea but you lose too many groups of people.
The Casual gamer hardly is interested in the gamepass, they are interested in maybe just a certain game or so.

When you think about it, its no wonder MS is struggling in the sector.
this isn't the only sector where mS has struggled, though.

they struggled in the smartphone market, and they left.
they struggled in the music market, and they left.

I don't know if I would say they are struggling in the video game market, though. the 360 was a huge hit, even if the Ps3 outsold it at the end of their lifetimes. the xbone wasn't as successful as the 360, but just because it wasn't as successful shouldn't mean it was a failure. it sold over 50 million consoles and the Series X in my opinion is a hit. it has been selling quite a lot and just because it doesn't sell as much as Ps5 doesn't and shouldn't mean mS is struggling.
 
this isn't the only sector where mS has struggled, though.

they struggled in the smartphone market, and they left.
they struggled in the music market, and they left.

I don't know if I would say they are struggling in the video game market, though. the 360 was a huge hit, even if the Ps3 outsold it at the end of their lifetimes. the xbone wasn't as successful as the 360, but just because it wasn't as successful shouldn't mean it was a failure. it sold over 50 million consoles and the Series X in my opinion is a hit. it has been selling quite a lot and just because it doesn't sell as much as Ps5 doesn't and shouldn't mean mS is struggling.
The Series consoles are doing fine in the US, but in every other market its tanking, with retailers no longer even bothering to stock it or Xbox games. If you combine the sales of Series X & S they've only sold 20 million units in over 3 years, which is just over a third of PS5's sales. Gutting the disc drive from Series X in the upcoming "adorably all digital" revision isn't going to win over any customers.
 
The Series consoles are doing fine in the US, but in every other market its tanking, with retailers no longer even bothering to stock it or Xbox games. If you combine the sales of Series X & S they've only sold 20 million units in over 3 years, which is just over a third of PS5's sales. Gutting the disc drive from Series X in the upcoming "adorably all digital" revision isn't going to win over any customers.
but they just acquired Activision Blizzard. in 10 years time when the CoD contract expires, mS could easily make the game exclusive to Xbox which will instantly make the game a system seller.

also to your point and my previous point, 20 million units spells success to me. just because it isn't as successful as Ps5 doesn't mean it's failing.
 
Xbox isn't a market leader anymore and despite Starfield's release last year the Series' launch has been incredibly rocky. I don't see them making CoD an exclusive when it sells so many copies on Playstation. The user base isn't going to change platforms, they'll either find something else on the consoles they already own or play it on PC if they have one.
 
Xbox isn't a market leader anymore and despite Starfield's release last year the Series' launch has been incredibly rocky. I don't see them making CoD an exclusive when it sells so many copies on Playstation. The user base isn't going to change platforms, they'll either find something else on the consoles they already own or play it on PC if they have one.
but by what metric are we measuring Series' performance to say it's rocky? All I can see is people comparing it to Ps5 and putting it that way. but it shouldn't be seen as a failure just because the market leader is doing better. there always has to be a market leader, that doesn't mean the non-leaders are automatically losers and failures.

as for CoD, let me put it to you this way: CoD is biggest on playstation right now, but over the course of 10 years' time, mS will be putting the game day and date on game pass while it remains $70 retail, where do you think consumers will see most of the appeal? especially once crossing the 10 year mark, there will be only one console platform to play CoD on?
 
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How is it bad that Xbox games will available on other platforms? They're clearly going all in on Gamepass, and are more concerned with having more subscribers than selling consoles (as they clearly can't keep up with Sony or Nintendo).

The real cause for concern is them phasing out the disc drive on Series X, which means going forward your physical library will become useless.
It's not that part that's bad. Once any of the platform holders puts all their exclusives everywhere while not gaining the exclusives of other consoles, there are only going to be a very few hardcore people who stay with the one that is a subset of the other. If on PS5 you can play multiplats, PS5 exclusives and XBox exclusives, while on Xbox you can play only multiplats and Xbox exclusives, a huge chunk of the Xbox audience will move while almost noone is going to then move from PS5 to Xbox. The long term result will be that the install base for Xbox hardware falls below the level that even multiplats will deem it worthy porting to it (was already a problem with many Japanese titles) and if they do they will demand ever more favourable terms where they keep a much higher proportion of the revenue (as Activision was already trying to do even at these levels). From there eventually it's the path of Sega and being forced out of the platform holder market without the means to justify the R&D costs and production risks of producing new consoles at a loss for new generations.

I know of a whole bunch of people who are already ready to sell up if the right message doesn't come next week. With digital libraries and achievements, there is little point continuing to invest the time (a lifetime hobby) and money in a platform that has a fair chance of not being around in subsequent generations.
 
Feels like there is something significant to it all. Could suck massively for me after all these years in the platform and a ton of money spent and years of achievements. :csad:
Yea putting years and money into an digital ecosystem that ends up just ending one day would definintily suck. I would hope, if nothing else Xbox is around for healthy compeition with Sony but who knows at this point. If they do go out, I don't know if Nintendo could fill that role. They did at one point in time but it seems with the success first the Wii and now the Switch, they are playing more to their strengths than anything else.
 
Yea putting years and money into an digital ecosystem that ends up just ending one day would definintily suck. I would hope, if nothing else Xbox is around for healthy compeition with Sony but who knows at this point. If they do go out, I don't know if Nintendo could fill that role. They did at one point in time but it seems with the success first the Wii and now the Switch, they are playing more to their strengths than anything else.
Nintendo has definitely carved out its own niche at this point. If Xbox were to come to an end I wonder if something like the Steam Deck could fill that role, PC gaming becoming more accessible strikes me as the only real competition Playstation would face with Xbox gone.
 
With all this talk about MS possibly dropping out of the Gaming Console market, i have to say that i am kind of surprised Elon Musk hasnt yet thrown his hat into this.

The Man is a gamer or at least calls himself one who likes videogames.
With all the money he burns, im surprised he hasnt thought about doing a Tesla video game Console or so.
Not that i want the guy to have his fingers in the gaming market, the industry is already bad enough with a guy like Musk, but he certainly would have the Money.

Xbox isn't a market leader anymore and despite Starfield's release last year the Series' launch has been incredibly rocky. I don't see them making CoD an exclusive when it sells so many copies on Playstation. The user base isn't going to change platforms, they'll either find something else on the consoles they already own or play it on PC if they have one.
Were they ever Market leader?

The Smartest thing they can do is NOT do exclusives.
Not making money with the console and the gamepass...is not good.
The acquisitions and the legal fight around the Activision Blizzard buy, burned a rather deep hole into their pockets.
Somehow they need to make it back.
COD on PS is a good start there...sells incredible well every year.
 
These rumours sounded crazy at first but it actually makes sense as an Xbox strategy. They've been pushing GamePass, de-emphasizing Xbox as an exclusive platform, while building on their strong footing in the PC market. IP is worth way more than hardware; so Xbox could do well selling their huge library of titles on Playstation, while letting Sony incur all the losses of making the consoles themselves. Maybe eventually GamePass itself is allowed on the platform. The end of console gaming could be around the corner, and if that is the case GamePass will be a very well established service to ease the transition over to other platforms, with a huge catalogue of potential exclusive titles for whenever they need to boost subs.
 
Were they ever Market leader?
I'd say the 360 era. If we're looking specifically at units sold, the PS3 barely beat out the 360 but if you look at sales performance from the previous generatiion to the next, Xbox wins in that case. Microsoft had a 265.22% perecent increase in units sales going from the original Xbox to 360 compared to the 43.61% drop Sony had going from PS2 to PS3. Not to mention their 2 highest sold exclusive titles (Halo 3, Gears of War 2) beat out the PS3's highest exclusive (MGS4) while it's 3rd highest was comparable to it. Halo 3 sold almost double than what MGS4 did.

I've been a Playstation person since the first console, so I've always favored it more but when the 360 came out ngl I was pretty tempted to go that route instead of a PS3 lol. Had they kept up the momentum they gained during that time and not fumbled out of the gate with the Xbox One, it's very possible they could have overtaken the PS4.
 
I'd say the 360 era. If we're looking specifically at units sold, the PS3 barely beat out the 360 but if you look at sales performance from the previous generatiion to the next, Xbox wins in that case. Microsoft had a 265.22% perecent increase in units sales going from the original Xbox to 360 compared to the 43.61% drop Sony had going from PS2 to PS3. Not to mention their 2 highest sold exclusive titles (Halo 3, Gears of War 2) beat out the PS3's highest exclusive (MGS4) while it's 3rd highest was comparable to it. Halo 3 sold almost double than what MGS4 did.

I've been a Playstation person since the first console, so I've always favored it more but when the 360 came out ngl I was pretty tempted to go that route instead of a PS3 lol. Had they kept up the momentum they gained during that time and not fumbled out of the gate with the Xbox One, it's very possible they could have overtaken the PS4.
yeah, I think the argument can be made that the 360 was the market leader of the seventh generation because of so much ground that Sony lost in the beginning and middle of it, but I think there can be arguments to counter that too.

firstly, toward the end of the generation and even after the generation ended with Ps4/xbone launching while their predecessors were still being sold, the Ps3 did manage to outsell the 360. in the grand scheme of things this doesn't matter that much, and I would say that it doesn't matter at all if the Ps3 outsold the 360 after the production of the consoles had already ceased. but this was while they were still in production and for that reason I think it says something that at the end of their life cycles, the Ps3 sold more.

secondly, when analyzing the seventh generation as a whole, the Wii was the real market leader. it was the most successful hardware sold all throughout the generation. now, while it broke the boundaries of what is supposed to be a traditional video game console, the fact of the matter is, it kicked the Ps3's and 360's asses in sales. over 100 million consoles sold.

of course it wasn't without its industry tradeoffs; as a lasting effect of the image the Wii created for Nintendo's place among the big three, there has been a huge loss of third party support for the vast majority of multiplatform games and anytime there is a port created for the Nintendo consoles, it ends up being a big deal because of how behind it is in specs. personally, I believe that a lot, if not most people who owned a Wii back in the day, also owned either a Ps3 or a 360 for this reason. it certainly would explain why the gaps in sales aren't as big as they are in other generations - Wii sold about 10-15 million more than its competitors, while in other generations the market leader sold at least 20 million more than whoever came in 2nd place.

thirdly, I don't know who profited the most in the seventh generation but if we go by profitability as the measure of market leader, there is also the RROD to consider on mS's side. at its peak, the 360 had a failure rate of over 50%. and if that ain't one of the worst failure rates hardware wise for any kind of machine/device, I don't know what it is! and on this subject, I heard that it cost mS over $1 billion in damages.

I'm making these points only to point out that yes, while one could argue that 360 was the market leader in the seventh generation, one could also definitely be making the argument on the contrary as well. which, to answer @Mani-Man 's question originally, would subsequently mean that they never really were the market leader at all.

as a side note, MGS4 wasn't Ps3's highest selling exclusive. Gran Turismo 5 sold about 12 million copies.
 
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as a side note, MGS4 wasn't Ps3's highest selling exclusive. Gran Turismo 5 sold about 12 million copies.
Was it? Weird, guess the data I was looking at wasn't entirely accurate. The list I was looking at didn't even have it in the top 5 PS3 games.
 
Was it? Weird, guess the data I was looking at wasn't entirely accurate. The list I was looking at didn't even have it in the top 5 PS3 games.
I went by Wikipedia, which sources a link directly from Polyphony Digital. their list puts MGS4 at half that, about 6 million copies.

edit: just out of curiosity I went and checked their list of best selling 360 and the top seller on their list is still double that of Ps3's; Kinect Adventures at 24 million copies! :rofl:
 
I went by Wikipedia, which sources a link directly from Polyphony Digital. their list puts MGS4 at half that, about 6 million copies.

edit: just out of curiosity I went and checked their list of best selling 360 and the top seller on their list is still double that of Ps3's; Kinect Adventures at 24 million copies! :rofl:
lol it's probably cause it came bundled with certain 360 models.
 
lol it's probably cause it came bundled with certain 360 models.
that is EXACTLY why it sold so much but I still find it remarkable. it's the same way Wii Sports became one of the top 5 best selling video games of all time!

lol...anyway, before I get carried away with these fun facts, the next game on the Wikipedia list for best selling 360 games that's exclusive is in fact Halo 3, with the last reported sales figures being about 15 million copies. it is still significantly more than the sales of GT5 in my opinion, but not by that large of a margin
 
I looked it up, I guess there was a PS3 bundle with Grand Turismo 5 as well as a 360 bundle with Halo 3. So it's possible the list I was looking at wasn't factoring in bundles into their data.
 
I looked it up, I guess there was a PS3 bundle with Grand Turismo 5 as well as a 360 bundle with Halo 3. So it's possible the list I was looking at wasn't factoring in bundles into their data.
ah, yes it definitely make sense that both of these killer apps were bundled at some point with their consoles which boosted sales. what list were you looking at?
 
ah, yes it definitely make sense that both of these killer apps were bundled at some point with their consoles which boosted sales. what list were you looking at?
 
thanks. so the information here is definitely outdated. for example, there is no way GTA4 sold less than 2 million copies on Ps3 to date.

here are the lists I was looking at:
 
These rumours sounded crazy at first but it actually makes sense as an Xbox strategy. They've been pushing GamePass, de-emphasizing Xbox as an exclusive platform, while building on their strong footing in the PC market. IP is worth way more than hardware; so Xbox could do well selling their huge library of titles on Playstation, while letting Sony incur all the losses of making the consoles themselves. Maybe eventually GamePass itself is allowed on the platform. The end of console gaming could be around the corner, and if that is the case GamePass will be a very well established service to ease the transition over to other platforms, with a huge catalogue of potential exclusive titles for whenever they need to boost subs.
Define "around the corner" in this case. The Ps5 has been breaking records for Sony, and the Switch is on pace to dethrone the PS2 as the best selling video game console of all time. From where I'm sitting, for all intents and purposes, console gaming seems to be alive and well.

Sure, a lot of things have reshaped the console gaming market to change the dynamics of what makes owning a console appealing, but the demand for the hardware is still here and doesn't seem to be slowing down. It just seems like Xbox was a little less lucky.
 

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