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Comics Are you ready for the SECOND COMING of the Mutant Messiah?

Yeah, her being useless I could barely tolerate. Now she's bratty and short-tempered too? Sometimes I forget she's 12 years old.
 
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What's the ****ing point in Cable teaching the girl to fight if she's just gonna stand there like a deer in headlights while Bastion's attacking her? Because that's really why Nightcrawler died. Nathan's little soldier got all ******ed.
 
I assume they really are going somewhere good with the Messiah bit, and that maybe not all is forgiven but Cyke at least remains the leader of the X-Men (judging by the preview covers). But Hope is a bit of a lame mutant really. Powers usually manifest in puberty - she's been there for a few years now. And often under times of great stress - she's been there all her life. Though maybe being under pressure and on the run your entire life makes your baseline stress levels pretty high and therefore not high enough to elicit a mutagenic response like normal circumstances with mutants.
 
Her powers will manifest or fully manifest or whatever when Cable dies. Mark my words. It seems pretty obvious and straight-forward, I think. And it'll be reasoned, per the narrative, as the person who's always cared for her dying, one, and her having always been protected prior.

I'll actually be surprised if that's not how it plays out.
 
The lack of powers doesn't even bother me. Cable's been training her to be a miniature version of himself: a mutant who doesn't need their powers to fight.
 
actually she's 17

I assume they really are going somewhere good with the Messiah bit, and that maybe not all is forgiven but Cyke at least remains the leader of the X-Men (judging by the preview covers). But Hope is a bit of a lame mutant really. Powers usually manifest in puberty - she's been there for a few years now. And often under times of great stress - she's been there all her life. Though maybe being under pressure and on the run your entire life makes your baseline stress levels pretty high and therefore not high enough to elicit a mutagenic response like normal circumstances with mutants.
Her powers have already manifested and during a high stress situation. Its the reason why she's alive today
 
So I finally caught with Second Coming today.It's been good so far but man Nightcrawler was my favorite X-men.I teared up when he died and I thought the funeral was well done.Like Logan said though she better be worth it.Her saying at the end of the recent issue she wasn't ready doesn't give me hope though.:csad:
 
well you cant blame her. She's been told that she is important and pretty much has the entire world on her shoulders. She's a teen and has no idea what she is expected to accomplish and everyone is putting a whole lot of pressure on her. Shee grew up only having one person trying to kill her but now theres an entire army out to get her. Theres no kid thats ready for that
 
The sad part is, I don't even think Cyclops knows what Hope is supposed to accomplish. It hasn't been said why she's important, other than the fact that she's the first mutant conceived and born after M-Day.
 
Cyclops is making things up as he goes along. He has no clear plan or direction. He's pretty much handling things as they present themselves instead of thinking ahead and anticipating his enemies moves. I cant say Im too surprised with what happened at the end of the last chapter and that was only made possible bc of the horrible decision he made
 
It's kind of hard to plan ahead without knowing your enemy's/enemies' capabilities.

Y'know, just a thought.
 
thats why he had X-force. He knew that Bastion and pretty much every major mutant hating figure in X-men history was back and plotting against them. Instead of telling any of the X-men and consulting about what to do, he kept that information to himslf and they are all basically just reacting to this, not knowing what hit them as no one anticipated or was prepared for the current attacks. Scott and X-force knew

The biggest mistake he made in the past year outside of that was forming Utopia. Theres less than 200 mutants left in the world, so for some reason he thought it was a great idea to have nearly all of them (well the vast majority) on the island. Bastion has smart by exploiting this most blatant flaw with Utopia. Did the X-men NOT learn from Genosha? Now Bastion's taken out their flight systems and those with the power to evacuate them off that island(the teleporters). One swift attack and they are all dead. Didnt someone bring up Genosha when Utopia was first proposed and Scott shut them down? I think it was Emma. What an idiot he was and most of them for not being alarmed and seeing where this was all leading
 
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Cyclops' reasoning was that Utopia would be easier to defend with so much mutant firepower on it. True, a long range missile attack might be the end of them but if anybody brings their troops to the island, they'll have a hell of a fight on their hands.

Northstar and Surge could prob evacuate Utopia if necessary.
 
Actually they cant, unless they act superfast bc [blackout]in the next chapter, they all get trapped in a magical dome that Bastion has set around the island. Basically he makes them all sitting ducks, just waiting to be killed off[/blackout] And the main reason why this was all possible is bc they all live on that island, making it much easier for the mutant haters to eradicate whats left of the mutant race. They better hope Pixie comes back with Illyana ASAP
 
Hank came back to Utopia to help with the injured and to check on Hope. So here's to every future scene of Hank rubbing his IToldYouSos in Scott's face.
 
thats why he had X-force. He knew that Bastion and pretty much every major mutant hating figure in X-men history was back and plotting against them. Instead of telling any of the X-men and consulting about what to do, he kept that information to himslf and they are all basically just reacting to this, not knowing what hit them as no one anticipated or was prepared for the current attacks. Scott and X-force knew

The biggest mistake he made in the past year outside of that was forming Utopia. Theres less than 200 mutants left in the world, so for some reason he thought it was a great idea to have nearly all of them (well the vast majority) on the island. Bastion has smart by exploiting this most blatant flaw with Utopia. Did the X-men NOT learn from Genosha? Now Bastion's taken out their flight systems and those with the power to evacuate them off that island(the teleporters). One swift attack and they are all dead. Didnt someone bring up Genosha when Utopia was first proposed and Scott shut them down? I think it was Emma. What an idiot he was and most of them for not being alarmed and seeing where this was all leading
Bleh. I'd have gotten to this sooner, but apparently I have customers at work tonight. Talk about sucky.

Anyway. No, Cyclops had X-Force as a hit squad. They're death-dealers, not infiltrators and espionage experts, even if at least three of the people on the team could have performed admirably at those roles. Furthermore, the title was meant as an action title, not as a thriller or mystery title. And I don't know that Yost and Kyle could have written an engaging thriller/mystery title.

And correct, Cyclops is an insular character. Is this a newsflash?

Regardless, with how much of a threat they're making Bastion, how powerful and all-encompassing he is, some story where the X-Force team or some other team of mutants infiltrated his ranks and found out about all the hoopla and what-not so as to accurately give Cyclop tactical ability during Second Coming would have: 1) dethroned the threat of Second Coming, and 2) rung hollow.

It is integral to the story of Second Coming for Cyclops to be blind. He can't do aught but react to the actual or perceived threat because he has no idea of the capabilities the threat possesses. This is a desired piece of the narrative and fitting with what has come before. Presumably, this is all for a supreme pay-off toward the end of the crossover. If that does not happen, that is another matter entirely, and the quality of the narrative has to pay the price.

Otherwise, yes, Cyclops has made mistakes. That he has made these mistakes and will have to pay for those mistakes and answer to them has been the entire point of his building character arc. Well, "mistakes." Whether they truly are is up to debate depending on the reader's views, I suppose.
 
Oh, well that sucks for Utopia lol
Haha, Bastion is like 10 steps ahead of them. Everything they think they have covered, he already has a way to counteract and shut them down. He's becoming one of my favorite villians. He's more badass and intelligent here than he was in OZT, and he was a pretty tough dude back then. One of the reasons he's so effective is bc he isnt donig this on his own. He has a whole cartel of villians who share similar goals that he's been collaborating with. Stephen Lang, Stryker, Cameron Hodge, the Leper Queen, Donald Pierce, Graydon Creed, Boliver Trask... Between all of them, he pretty much has bases covered and they've all provided inputs on how to proceed with things.

Scott should have had his own group to consult and strategize with. Xavier, Magneto, Storm, Emma, Beast, Warren, Iceman, Namor, Nightcrawler, etc... Instead he took the sole responsibility of handling this by himself and kept it all a secret from his closest friends and strongest allies. I will never understand why. Why not warn them; allow them an oppurtunity to provide some input, strategize on the best way to handle things and preventing the villians from having a chance to completely blindside them.

Bleh. I'd have gotten to this sooner, but apparently I have customers at work tonight. Talk about sucky.

Anyway. No, Cyclops had X-Force as a hit squad. They're death-dealers, not infiltrators and espionage experts, even if at least three of the people on the team could have performed admirably at those roles. Furthermore, the title was meant as an action title, not as a thriller or mystery title. And I don't know that Yost and Kyle could have written an engaging thriller/mystery title.
Correct. They were a hit squad and its via this hit squad that they found out about Bastion's return, as well as the techno organic virus and the other villains resurrections. He knew they were planning to strike against them He had X-force kill off the minor threats that the bigger villians were posing. They were killing off minions, not really dealing with the main problem. He should have shared what he learned from X-force wtih the other X-men. Did he know everything? No, but he did know enoug that some of their biggest threats were back, conspiring together and were plotting to take out the X-men. Thats why he had X-force to take them out before they could get a chance to achieve that goal. Didnt quite work out for him how he envisioned it


It is integral to the story of Second Coming for Cyclops to be blind. He can't do aught but react to the actual or perceived threat because he has no idea of the capabilities the threat possesses. This is a desired piece of the narrative and fitting with what has come before. Presumably, this is all for a supreme pay-off toward the end of the crossover. If that does not happen, that is another matter entirely, and the quality of the narrative has to pay the price.
Yes, him being an idiot is integral to Second Coming. Bastion would have never been able to blindside him and exploit the dlaws of his poor decisions if Scott hadnt given him the oppurtunity to do so. From a writing standpoint, his mistakes helped pave the way for them all to be attacked and targeted in the manner that has been depicted
 
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At this point, the argument has spiraled to a point where, for the most part, neither of us can make any sense.

X-Force attacked the threats they knew about and knew the placement of. You can't attack an enemy if you don't know where they are. At first it was the Purifiers. Even when they find out about Bastion, they can't manage to do crap against him. The series branches out and lays some foundations for future issues and arcs. Then comes Messiah War. Then we get the X-23 issues with Kimura while the rest of the team is rescuing Hellion and Surge. And then we spring into Necrosha. And then it's Second Coming.

So where, exactly, did they know where Bastion was so they could hit him? And no, trying to argue that different stories should have taken place is not an argument one can make. Ever.

All else I could possibly argue is your perception of Cyclops, which is meaningless since it's subjective. I, personally, agree with his decisions to keep X-Force a secret. But, hey, I told my Public Relations professor that Ethics is overrated. No shocker which side of the fence I'm going to be on.
 
This is why I think Cipher should be used more. She was set up as Cyclops' personal spy-girl, but nobody ever writes her as such.
 
Don't most people prefer to pretend Young X-Men was never published?
 
At this point, the argument has spiraled to a point where, for the most part, neither of us can make any sense.

X-Force attacked the threats they knew about and knew the placement of. You can't attack an enemy if you don't know where they are. At first it was the Purifiers. Even when they find out about Bastion, they can't manage to do crap against him. The series branches out and lays some foundations for future issues and arcs. Then comes Messiah War. Then we get the X-23 issues with Kimura while the rest of the team is rescuing Hellion and Surge. And then we spring into Necrosha. And then it's Second Coming.

So where, exactly, did they know where Bastion was so they could hit him? And no, trying to argue that different stories should have taken place is not an argument one can make. Ever.
thats bc you are only focusing on X-force. There are other X-men who should have been told that their biggest threats were back and plotting to take them out. I listed some examples of several who should have been consulted, informed and brought in. This threat was too big for him to have handled on his own and that was his biggest mistake. He was limited in his knowledge and how to handle the situation which is why he should have brought in others to help. Did he know exactly where Bastion was? No. Did he tell Beast, Nightcrawler, Storm, etc... that Bastion was back and that it might be a good idea for them to find a way to find and stop him from carrying out his plans? Nope. Did he at least warn them that something was brewing? Nope. And looka t where they are now. Beast and Kurt (before he died) were pissed off bc of the secrets and lies and I can only imagine a few more will be once the dust settles
 
Only the first 5 issues were bad. And they weren't really bad. They were just mediocre.
 

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