Black Panther 2018 VS The Batman 2022.

[BMW 224]

Two comic book movies about rich vigilante who goes though transformative arc after realizing he and his family inspired the main villan and that there needs to be change to insure it won't happen again


Both positivity received and transcended the comic book genre.

Which is better ?

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Batmannerism]

Honestly, I don't think either of them transcended the comic book genre

For all the praise heaped on it, there's nothing special about the story of Black Panther - and the idea that the most Technologically advanced nation in the world decides its leadership based on Ritual combat is dumb.

I feel like Chadwick Baseman got the short straw I that one. After an amazing performance in Civil War, probably the standout in the film ( and definitely the best character arc) - he felt like a supporting character in his own film, and thr final fight was let down by mediocre cgi.



However, you have to admire his determination and grit, as he would have been very unwell during filming. I have no doubt he would have gone on to much greater things - probably would have become the next Denzel Washington.

Also, Andy Serkis was wildly entertaining- wish they hadn't killed him off.

As for the Batman, on a rewatch the film's flaws start to become more apparent - mostly that Bruce Wayne is a necessary element of the character, Alfred actually needed some screentime, some plot conveniences were a bit ridiculous, and it's too ****ing long - I say that as someone who just watched all 3 LOTR films in a row on a long haul flight- some movies are long and dont feel like it, others aren't long and feel like they never end ) Some people love it, to me it's probably the 4th or 5th best Batman film. ( TDK, 89, BR, BB, TB, LB, TDKR, BF, BvS, B&R )

So, I'll go with Black Panther. Definitely left more of an impact on me than the Batman - and I'm a huge Batman fan.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Honestly, I don't think either of them transcended the comic book genre

For all the praise heaped on it, there's nothing special about the story of Black Panther - and the idea that the most Technologically advanced nation in the world decides its leadership based on Ritual combat is dumb.

I feel like Chadwick Baseman got the short straw I that one. After an amazing performance in Civil War, probably the standout in the film ( and definitely the best character arc) - he felt like a supporting character in his own film, and thr final fight was let down by mediocre cgi.



However, you have to admire his determination and grit, as he would have been very unwell during filming. I have no doubt he would have gone on to much greater things - probably would have become the next Denzel Washington.

Also, Andy Serkis was wildly entertaining- wish they hadn't killed him off.

As for the Batman, on a rewatch the film's flaws start to become more apparent. Some people love it, to me it's probably the 4th or 5th best Batman film. ( TDK, 89, BR, BB, TB, LB, TDKR, BF, BvS, B&R )

So, I'll go with Black Panther. Definitely left more of an impact on me than the Batman - and I'm a huge Batman fan.

How many tentpole superhero movies do you know that deal with black separatism, black militarism, systematic racism and it's lasting effects?

 

[Gothamsknight]

I like The Batman more, I guess, but I don't think either is as great as people make them out to be. The Batman doesnt crack the top 5 best Batman movies and is currently behind all of the Nolan and Burton movies for me, and Black Panther, while an enjoyable movie with good performances, is not something I'm overly in love with either. It definitely had a bigger impact though.

 

[Pennywise]

Tough choice, I really love both!

 

[metaphysician]

Honestly, I don't think either of them transcended the comic book genre
.

Which is perfectly fine, as there is no such thing and people should stop pretending there is. Its never been anything but an excuse for those with a bias against a particular genre to maintain said bias in the face of evidence to the contrary.

*cough*

Anyway, between these two movies, Black Panther is definitely the better. The Batman is good, really good, but it has a number of holes ( mainly in pacing and the "fourth act" problem ) that drag it down. Black Panther, meanwhile, the worst that can be said about it is "some of the SFX is a little dodgy", it is otherwise an extremely tight movie on every level, but *especially* in writing. Character is King, and every single character in BP serves the purpose of reflecting upon and exploring the ideological conflicts embodied within T'Challa.

 

[Spider-Fan83]

easily, Black Panther, for me

 

[The Joker]

I enjoyed both a lot, but I am a Batman fan so i got a bigger kick out of The Batman.

 

[Batmannerism]

Which is perfectly fine, as there is no such thing and people should stop pretending there is. Its never been anything but an excuse for those with a bias against a particular genre to maintain said bias in the face of evidence to the contrary.

To be clear, are you saying there is no such thing as a comic book-based film genre ?

If so, I couldn't agree with you there. Given the sheer number of MCU and DC films based on comic book characters...to me that suggests that it actually is a genre, in the same way that Westerns or Sword and Sandal are sub genres of action films.

*cough*

Anyway, between these two movies, Black Panther is definitely the better. The Batman is good, really good, but it has a number of holes ( mainly in pacing and the "fourth act" problem ) that drag it down. Black Panther, meanwhile, the worst that can be said about it is "some of the SFX is a little dodgy", it is otherwise an extremely tight movie on every level, but *especially* in writing. Character is King, and every single character in BP serves the purpose of reflecting upon and exploring the ideological conflicts embodied within T'Challa.

I still struggle with the most advanced country in the world deciding its leadership via Ritual combat - to me that's just ridiculous, so not great writing. There are plenty of other ways to have Kilmonger challenge Tchalla's reign and take control of Wakandan government.

That and Kilmonger's big supervillain plan, to arm random folks around the world to achieve..... something.

As for all the characters exploring ideological conflicts within Tchalla..... well, okay, guess you're seeing different things in the film than I am.

Still we agree that it's better than the Batman.

 

[Batmannerism]

I enjoyed both a lot, but I am a Batman fan so i got a bigger kick out of The Batman.

What did you think of the Barry Keoghan Joker deleted scene ? I thought it was dreadful, worse than the Jared Leto Joker. What a terrible miscast.

 

[The Joker]

What did you think of the Barry Keoghan Joker deleted scene ? I thought it was dreadful, worse than the Jared Leto Joker. What a terrible miscast.

I didn't think it was worse than Letoker because just about everything with Letoker makes me cringe. From his dialogue, to the characterization, to his appearance.

The Keoghan Joker scene was ok. I wasn't as jazzed by it as some were. I didn't like how he was missing most of his hair, and I thought they went a bit overboard on his facial disfigurement. But that might grow on me if they do the clown make up well. Jury's still out for me as this wasn't the Joker but pre Joker. I'm willing to give Reeves the benefit of the doubt and see what he has in store. It could be good.

 

[Batmannerism]

I didn't think it was worse than Letoker because just about everything with Letoker makes me cringe. From his dialogue, to the characterization, to his appearance.

The Keoghan Joker scene was ok. I wasn't as jazzed by it as some were. I didn't like how he was missing most of his hair, and I thought they went a bit overboard on his facial disfigurement. But that might grow on me if they do the clown make up well. Jury's still out for me as this wasn't the Joker but pre Joker. I'm willing to give Reeves the benefit of the doubt and see what he has in store. It could be good.

Fair enough. I hope you're right.

 

[psylockolussus]

Black Panther for me.

The Batman couldn't keep my attention.

 

[Blade Hoarder]

Black Panther. The Batman is just a remix of everythang I’ve seen in a Batman picture before. Panther was genuinely something new, with its all black cast, afrofuturism, and great political themes.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

While I understand it's cultural impact and did enjoy the movie, I was never as high on Black Panther as most. Boseman is a big loss though and will be terribly missed.

The Batman was a movie by a very good director at the top of his game that I just loved. I loved this Gotham, I loved this Batman and how the cops were mostly against him, and I loved his arc of beginning in darkness and ending in light, going from vengeance to the beginnings of a true hero. So The Batman for me.

 

[obredaan]

Black Panther. The Batman is just a remix of everythang I’ve seen in a Batman picture before. Panther was genuinely something new, with its all black cast, afrofuturism, and great political themes.

I feel the same way. The Batman checks all the boxes for what I want in a Batman movie. Unfortunately it just feels like a remix of what we've seen before in other projects(Netflix Daredevil - Nolan's Batman). And its another missed opportunity to have Batman in a shared DC universe. I still want to see the World's Finest on the big screen in all their glory.

 

[Gothamsknight]

I feel like The Batman was being hyped up as this wildly different version of the character but just ended up riffing on the themes Nolan tackled except with a more grunge/emo aesthetic. I think that's one of the reasons the films impact wasn't that big.

 

[mclay18]

BP gets the edge because of the newness and novelty on screen -- although the ritual combat to determine the leader felt backward for a technologically advanced country. The cast is fantastic--Boseman, Nyong'o, Bassett, Jordan and all these other Black actors on their A-game. Felt too Marvelized, especially the shoddy VFX in the climax, and too long in places.

I thought The Batman not only paled to what Nolan did better, it went too far with the grunge and gritty tone -- hardly any humor apart from a few one-liners. Nor did it have the emotional catharsis of the Nolan movies. There was stuff that was done well (Pattinson is a GREAT Batman and Zoe Kravitz is a sizzling Catwoman), in addition to scenes never before depicted in a live-action Batman movie. I felt kinda "meh" at the end of the movie and not excited for a second movie.

 

[metaphysician]

To be clear, are you saying there is no such thing as a comic book-based film genre ?

If so, I couldn't agree with you there. Given the sheer number of MCU and DC films based on comic book characters...to me that suggests that it actually is a genre, in the same way that Westerns or Sword and Sandal are sub genres of action films.

Oh, no, my argument is that the very idea of "transcending genre" is nonsense. It doesn't matter how good a movie is, it is still the genre that it is, and *every* movie has a genre- "contemporary realistic fiction" is absolutely a genre, not a lack of one. When people talk about "transcending genre", what they mean is "I irrationally consider a given genre to be inferior, but since I really like this particular movie I want to give it a pass, so I will claim it isn't really the genre that it is". Its not a thing that actually happens, and the whole mindset shouldn't be placated in the first place.

( And no, adding elements from some other genre doesn't make a movie "transcend its genre", it just means it mixes two or more genres. Add enough elements, and maybe you make a movie that is really a *different* genre then its premise might indicate, but it still has a genre. A movie that mixes Western and Sci-Fi doesn't somehow leave genre behind, it just adds more of them. )

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Black Panther was the first afrofuturistic blockbuster and the first blockbuster to glorify Africa.

That was a big deal to me and clealy alot of other people.

Execution wise it's effective also with a great villain, great cast, great costumes, great themes/message, etc.

The concept of a futuristic society with tribal traditions is not dumb. Look at the first Predator movie. It's a straight up classic character/movie.

Also look at the Amish. They could probably build a rocket if they wanted to but they choose an agrarian lifestyle.

I remember people arguing that audiences could never believe in Wakanda, that the concept needed to be changed. Well they didn't change it. And it was one of the biggest solo projects from Marvel, only bested by Spider-man.

 

[Filmfreak]

In terms of cultural impact Black Panther is hands down the most important movie. But in terms of filmmaking there are not many things that I personally appreciate in it. I think it's a much weaker film both in technical aspects and narrative-wise.

 

[KBX]

The Batman is a really good movie from top to bottom

Black Panther will be remembered 100 years from now.

 

[Deck Rickard]

Yeah I have a hard time picking a favorite. BP is one of the most important superhero films ever made, and perhaps one of the most important films ever made, period. On the other hand, from a technical standpoint, I feel The Batman was a stronger movie. Batman is also my favorite superhero character, and TB was the first Batman film that I feel nailed everything I wanted to see in a movie about said character. So it’s a tough call for me.

 

[Elayis]

BP has a clear emotional arc that with Killmonger & T'Challa that is pretty much perfect. The rest is a little shaky at times (the typical X-Men problem with too many characters, and the action sucks), but Coogler nailed what mattered. I'm concerned about Wakanda Forever with Boseman gone, but I'm still cautiously optimistic.

The Batman's "theme", on the other hand, isn't made clear until the final sequence of the movie and feels like an afterthought. In general the film's also bloated, with paper-thin characters and not much new that justifies its existence. Here's hoping the sequel's much better.