Discussion: The Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac Situation

Talking about Hugo Chavez, lol, just another one of the many avenues for the the U.S. Government to nationalize America's assets in lieu of the falling artificial dollar...in this case Nationalizing the Mortgage industry. Many others will fall under this umbrella. Capitalist Socialism is what this game is called. American eyes are wide shut. :dry:
 
Talking about Hugo Chavez, lol, just another one of the many avenues for the the U.S. Government to nationalize America's assets in lieu of the falling artificial dollar...in this case Nationalizing the Mortgage industry. Many others will fall under this umbrella. Capitalist Socialism is what this game is called. American eyes are wide shut. :dry:

1. This is only temporary.

2. If the government doesn't do this, the nation's financial system will completely fall apart.
 
1. This is only temporary.

2. If the government doesn't do this, the nation's financial system will completely fall apart.

1. No... i'm affraid it's not.

2. The Nation's Monetary and Fiscal Policies is what dooming the Nation's financial system. Foreign Investors/Governments wants something tangible for the "Paper" money that the U.S. Government consistingly & constantly printing with no backing. So, the U.S asset are being sold out as collateral. Now the U.S. Gov has been for years slowing nationalizing attractive U.S. assets to "try" to prevent the selling off of America. The Government own policies has lead this country to this and they are still making even worst decisions.

Case in point... you remember President Reagan Bankrupt the Great Russian Empire? Well, they have know dept.... they have paid up. They are beholden to nobody. That's good Fiscal Policy. They rule the Commodity Sector.... and Europe and thw U.S. are feeling the squeeze.

One can ignore the messenger, but don't ignore the facts. :dry:
 
1. No... i'm affraid it's not.
Yes it is. It has been stated that the move is temporary so that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac won't go out of business completely dooming our nations financial system (since they hold $5 trillion in people's debt) and are holding them until their situation is healthier.

2. The Nation's Monetary and Fiscal Policies is what dooming the Nation's financial system. Foreign Investors/Governments wants something tangible for the "Paper" money that the U.S. Government consistingly & constantly printing with no backing. So, the U.S asset are being sold out as collateral. Now the U.S. Gov has been for years slowing nationalizing attractive U.S. assets to "try" to prevent the selling off of America. The Government own policies has lead this country to this and they are still making even worst decisions.
The reason why Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in danger of going out of business was because people were spending outside of their limits. People were buying homes that they couldn't afford so we had to deal with foreclosure after foreclosure with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac losing so much money because they weren't getting the money from people that they were supposed to get.

This is the fault of the consumer and the financial institutions for allowing so many loans to happen. Not the government. And now the government has to do something or else the economy was going to get screwed.

Case in point... you remember President Reagan Bankrupt the Great Russian Empire? Well, they have know dept.... they have paid up. They are beholden to nobody. That's good Fiscal Policy. They rule the Commodity Sector.... and Europe and thw U.S. are feeling the squeeze.

One can ignore the messenger, but don't ignore the facts. :dry:
That has nothing to do with the topic :dry:
 
Yes it is. It has been stated that the move is temporary so that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac won't go out of business completely dooming our nations financial system (since they hold $5 trillion in people's debt) and are holding them until their situation is healthier.

This is nothing more than a symptom of a much, much larger problem that Venom's Dad touched on. Our economy is completely based on credit, and with a currency that has no gold standard, and may as well be monopoly money around the world, particularly since we export very little compared to the amount we consume.

Right now, we're about 45 trillion in debt - which is up about 400% since 1980. The reason why 1980 is important is because that is the decade in which we *should* have experienced another great depression. Thanks to Reagan and his (Reaganomics) economic 'changes,' we avoided it, or shall I say we delayed it.

Our country is buckling under the financial pressure, and all of the signs, beginning with the FIRST bank closures a few months ago, and now Fannie/Freddie, point squarely to one conclusion. Do you realize that Fannie/Freddie own more than 50% of all mortgages in the U.S.? How much WORSE do you expect it to get before this thing comes rolling in? The government just SAVED the two largest mortgage companies in the country from BANKRUPTCY.

Think about it.

The reason why Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in danger of going out of business was because people were spending outside of their limits. People were buying homes that they couldn't afford so we had to deal with foreclosure after foreclosure with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac losing so much money because they weren't getting the money from people that they were supposed to get.

This is the fault of the consumer and the financial institutions for allowing so many loans to happen. Not the government. And now the government has to do something or else the economy was going to get screwed.


That has nothing to do with the topic :dry:

There is absolutely nothing our government can do to prevent the incoming crash. What we're witnessing RIGHT NOW are last ditch efforts to stop the whole thing from coming down. And it's not going to work this time. Look at the signs.
 
This is nothing more than a symptom of a much, much larger problem that Venom's Dad touched on. Our economy is completely based on credit, and with a currency that has no gold standard, and may as well be monopoly money around the world, particularly since we export very little compared to the amount we consume.

Right now, we're about 45 trillion in debt - which is up about 400% since 1980. The reason why 1980 is important is because that is the decade in which we *should* have experienced another great depression. Thanks to Reagan and his (Reaganomics) economic 'changes,' we avoided it, or shall I say we delayed it.

Our country is buckling under the financial pressure, and all of the signs, beginning with the FIRST bank closures a few months ago, and now Fannie/Freddie, point squarely to one conclusion. Do you realize that Fannie/Freddie own more than 50% of all mortgages in the U.S.? How much WORSE do you expect it to get before this thing comes rolling in? The government just SAVED the two largest mortgage companies in the country from BANKRUPTCY.

Think about it.



There is absolutely nothing our government can do to prevent the incoming crash. What we're witnessing RIGHT NOW are last ditch efforts to stop the whole thing from coming down. And it's not going to work this time. Look at the signs.

But its the irony, under Clinton the debt was greatly reduced and the deficit was gone. Under bush and the GOP the so called party of small government brought the debt and the deficit has greatly increased. So who's fault is this mess?

If the government doesn't spend responsibly, why should companies or even ordinary citizens? The government should set an example to people to promote good stewardship and finical responsible, not promote a reckless, selfish attitude that going into debt has no consequences.

I love how these two big companies get a bail out, but all the regular guys in finical trouble can go screw themselves. This is corporate welfare, the GOP is fine with welfare as long is its for their corporate buddies, not little people. It just shows how corrupt this party has become.
 
But its the irony, under Clinton the debt was greatly reduced and the deficit was gone. Under bush and the GOP the so called party of small government brought the debt and the deficit has greatly increased. So who's fault is this mess?

No, Clinton did not reduce the national debt. And the deficit was paid off by borrowing from Social Security...

If the government doesn't spend responsibly, why should companies or even ordinary citizens? The government should set an example to people to promote good stewardship and finical responsible, not promote a reckless, selfish attitude that going into debt has no consequences.

We are a credit driven society. What is happening is inevitable regardless of which party is in office. Our country consumes far more than it produces. That has nothing to do with politics.

I love how these two big companies get a bail out, but all the regular guys in finical trouble can go screw themselves. This is corporate welfare, the GOP is fine with welfare as long is its for their corporate buddies, not little people. It just shows how corrupt this party has become.

This 'bail out' is preventing an economic CRASH. You don't get that? Whether it's 'right' or not, who knows. These two companies OWN 70% of the mortgages in the COUNTRY. If they go down, the depression begins. However, I believe the crash is inevitable. All the feds are doing right now is delaying it ... perhaps until the election is over. Hmm...
 
No, Clinton did not reduce the national debt. And the deficit was paid off by borrowing from Social Security...

Wouldn't economic conservatives luadf Clinton for raiding Social security, to pay off the national deficit, so why would you have a problem with that?

Also at least under Clinton the debt and deficit didn't sky rocket.

We are a credit driven society. What is happening is inevitable regardless of which party is in office. Our country consumes far more than it produces. That has nothing to do with politics.

In Canada there is no real credit crisis, because our society promotes finical responsibility, the government tries to avoid debt and deficit and our banks don't have ******ed lending policies where they will give someone loan or a second mortgage because they spent too much at the casino. If the government had the political will to avoid this situation, they could have done it.

This 'bail out' is preventing an economic CRASH. You don't get that? Whether it's 'right' or not, who knows. These two companies OWN 70% of the mortgages in the COUNTRY. If they go down, the depression begins. However, I believe the crash is inevitable. All the feds are doing right now is delaying it ... perhaps until the election is over. Hmm...

Yeah they spending more money to solve a crisis they created by spending too much money, a few preventive measures could have avoided this problem all together. The government had to bail these companies out because of the crisis they ultimately created.
 
First economic stimulus checks... then fannie and freddie need to be bailed out...
 
1. This is only temporary.

2. If the government doesn't do this, the nation's financial system will completely fall apart.

The government is just prolonging the inevitable and the longer they prolong it, the worse it's going to get.

The government's hand in the economy should always be minimal and let the chips fall where they may.
 
The government is just prolonging the inevitable and the longer they prolong it, the worse it's going to get.

The government's hand in the economy should always be minimal and let the chips fall where they may.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for the free market and I believe that the government should stay out of the economy as much as possible, but this was a case of impossibility.

Without the government bail out, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac would have been ruined. And considering how much debt they hold over in this country, our financial system would have been ruined completely.

And the government is not prolonging anything. They are going to run the two companies to get them back on their feet so they can run on their own again.
 
Don't get me wrong. I'm all for the free market and I believe that the government should stay out of the economy as much as possible, but this was a case of impossibility.

Without the government bail out, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac would have been ruined. And considering how much debt they hold over in this country, our financial system would have been ruined completely.

And the government is not prolonging anything. They are going to run the two companies to get them back on their feet so they can run on their own again.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want what is coming. It would be nice if government interventions would work, but they don't. Politicians, who only care about having during their terms, as opposed to actually solving problems are part of the problem.

The government made it impossible, by too many bail-outs in the past. As painful as it is, the only way to fix it is to allow the whole thing to fail, if need be.

And it's going to hurt.
 
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Don't get me wrong. I'm all for the free market and I believe that the government should stay out of the economy as much as possible, but this was a case of impossibility.

Without the government bail out, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac would have been ruined. And considering how much debt they hold over in this country, our financial system would have been ruined completely.

And the government is not prolonging anything. They are going to run the two companies to get them back on their feet so they can run on their own again.

Its their own fault for having stupid lending practices, if these companies didn't lend to morons who won't have the means or desire to pay them back, they wouldn't be in this situation.

I know are you for small government, but really, a few regulations to make lending practices more strict would have avoided this , a ounce of prevention to avoid a lot of pain in the future. If the way the these companies run their affairs doesn't change, this bail out will mean nothing,it will be a waste of tax payers money because the root cause of the failure has not been addressed
 
Its their own fault for having stupid lending practices, if these companies didn't lend to morons who won't have the means or desire to pay them back, they wouldn't be in this situation.

I know are you for small government, but really, a few regulations to make lending practices more strict would have avoided this , a ounce of prevention to avoid a lot of pain in the future. If the way the these companies run their affairs doesn't change, this bail out will mean nothing,it will be a waste of tax payers money because the root cause of the failure has not been addressed

That's more or less the problem. What we're witnessing today is the beginning of what will be the world's most devastating economic depression ever.
 
That's more or less the problem. What we're witnessing today is the beginning of what will be the world's most devastating economic depression ever.

I'm scared.

Can I live with you?

Just for a time?
 
Today is going to be a bad day on the market.....
My stocks are going to get hammered
 
Actually the market is up quite a bit...
 
The British Goverment has nationalized Morgage lender Northern Rock a while ago. We are still waiting to see how that goes.

The banks shouldn't of lent money to people who look like they belong on the jerry springer in the first place.
 
There is going to be a financial uptick for a time, till the govt really starts paying out...
Then you will see the downside.
 
The reason why Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in danger of going out of business was because people were spending outside of their limits. People were buying homes that they couldn't afford so we had to deal with foreclosure after foreclosure with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac losing so much money because they weren't getting the money from people that they were supposed to get.

This is the fault of the consumer and the financial institutions for allowing so many loans to happen. Not the government. And now the government has to do something or else the economy was going to get screwed.


Well let's not forget about all of the unethical practices of mortgage lenders. It is true that many consumers purchased above their means despite recommendations, but alot of them were talked into taking loans that appeared attractive, but were unsuitable in the long run. Not only that, but you had people with low credit scores who bought into predatory lending scams that allowed them buy a home without qualifying for a mortgage loan to purchase one.

If we had an "SEC"-an organization of the federal government, geared towards the regulation of investing- for the mortgage industry from the beginning, then many homebuyers would have had the same protection investors have against these kind of practices.
 
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Well let's not forget about all of the unethical practices of mortgage lenders. It is true that many consumers purchased above their means despite recommendations, but alot of them were talked into taking loans that appeared attractive, but were unsuitable in the long run. Not only that, but you had people with low credit scores who bought into predatory lending scams that allowed them buy a home without qualifying for a mortgage loan to purchase one.

Exactly.
Dont forget the Lenders that lied about families income levels so they could receive the loan as well.
This shouldn't even be viewed as bailing out Fannie and Freddie.Just look at it like you're saving more people from losing their homes.

Besides- For those of you doing it "right" and not living beyond your means...Hows your home value lookin right about now?
Why should we all drown together because the lenders put a hole in the boat.
 
http://townhall.com/Columnists/Fred...government_guarantees?page=full&comments=true



The Dangers of Government Guarantees
by Fred Thompson

’ll bet it came as a surprise to most folks that the financial stability of the world as we know it depends upon the survival of a couple of outfits called Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Yet that’s what the so-called experts are telling us. Moreover, we taxpayers are now being asked to guarantee Fannie and Freddie’s tab, one that could make the $124 billion S&L bailout of the late 1980s look cheap.

So how did we get stuck with this bill? Well, Congress wanted to “do something” about what it saw as a “housing problem.” To them that meant that they should create an even bigger problem.

So Congress passed laws that made it easier for hopeful home-buyers to buy houses … even when they couldn’t afford them. Then the Fed and other regulators helped, in the form of easy money and loose credit standards for mortgages.

Not surprisingly demand for houses grew, home prices rose, lenders financed additional questionable mortgages, fueling even higher prices and so on. You get the picture. This is called a bubble.

Then an amazing thing happened – apparently impossible to foresee. Home prices did not continue to rise forever! Home prices came down and easy money dried up, causing the above mentioned cycle to reverse. In other words, the bubble burst.

So you’d think the in-over-their-heads homebuyers and the mortgage bankers would take the hit, and the market would right itself. No reason for an international meltdown here, right?

Not so fast my friends. Years earlier Congress established Fannie and Freddie as purchasers of these mortgages, which they could bundle up, repackage and sell to investors, freeing up more mortgage money. As government creations tend to do, the two companies grew until they either owned or guaranteed about half the nation’s $12 trillion dollars in mortgages.

Fannie and Fred were “government sponsored enterprises” which means heads they win, tails you lose. If they make money stockholders, creditors and Fannie and Freddie employees – some making millions annually – get the benefit. But now that mortgages have hit the skids, with mounting losses, the taxpayers potentially face trillions in exposure. This is because there is an “implicit” (read “actual”) government guarantee of Fannie and Freddie’s obligations and both are now too big to be allowed to fail. This is called the “bailout phase,” which will probably lead to a bigger bubble in the future.

Lost in this immense, complex mess is the root problem most people are missing: the government is gradually becoming the guarantor of seemingly every important aspect of American secular life, creating incentives and bureaucracies that cause failure and invite fraud.

In Fan and Fred’s case, it was in no one’s interest to turn off the bubble machine. Just the opposite. The system induced borrowers to take on financial obligations they could not afford and lenders to lower lending standards. Fannie and Freddie went along because their managers’ compensation depended on the firms’ short term financial performance. And investors continued to buy complex security packages they didn’t understand, because the securities were viewed as government-backed.

Heavy campaign contributions by those benefiting from this scheme induced Members of Congress to avert their gaze from the ugly mess that was unfolding.

You’d think we’d have learned by now: when the backstop of the federal treasury makes it easier for politicians, lenders, borrowers, welfare recipients, government contractors, or anyone else, to serve their own self interest at the expense of the taxpayer, many will do just that.

That is why we continue to see self-dealing, moral lapses, outright fraud and lack of management and oversight in a wide array of programs and government-sponsored entities, from housing to Medicare, education and the Small Business Administration, all costing taxpayers billions, even trillions of dollars.

Our Founding Fathers knew more than a little bit about human nature. It is one reason why in the Constitution, the federal government was given certain delineated powers and no others. I hate to burst another bubble, but our government simply doesn’t have the authority or the capability to be the guarantor or insurer of our every need or desire. Isn’t it time we started sending that message loud and clear to the big enablers in Washington?
 

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