Episode 3 - 'Evil Under the Sea!' Discussion Thread

[DOG LIPS]

Haha How many times has Batman fought sharks in TV and film? It never gets old. This is such a great series, I look forward to next week.

In the wild, sharks are natural enemies of the bat.


This episode rocked, I really like this series. Aquaman was awesome, and Manta was perfectly done.

 

[Cain]

The intro with Batman & The Atom vs. Felix Faust was also first class

 

[theMan-Bat]

Finally got a chance to see the show and was quite satisfied with what I saw. The Batman/Aquaman dynamic on the show was great. I loved the names he gave to his adventures like "the time I wore an eye patch to infiltrate a pirate ship" lol.

Yeah, I was pessimistic about this show but this episode won me over!

 

[Cain]

Yeah, I was pessimistic about this show but this episode won me over!

I was never pessimistic about it actually quite the opposite but I never did get a chance to watch it until last night glad I finally did. It's good to see you decided to give it a fair shot regardless of your prior judgement and it's also nice to see you ended up enjoying it.

 

[Hush]

Yeah this episode was amazing my 17 and soon to be 12 year old brother walked away saying that aquaman was bad ass! That just made my day, maybe this episode should be shown on the front page! I mean seriously he threw like 30 bad guys at once!

 

[Holiday]

Finally got a chance to see the show and was quite satisfied with what I saw. The Batman/Aquaman dynamic on the show was great. I loved the names he gave to his adventures like "the time I wore an eye patch to infiltrate a pirate ship" lol.

Haha. Yeah I was going to mention that line. I laughed pretty hard when I heard that.

 

[SHADOWBAT69]

I have to say that this episode had me watching with a raised eyebrow. I absolutely loved the intro segment with Faust. The main story with Aquaman caught me completely off guard with the way they did good ol Arthur. I did not expect this wise cracking, muscle flexing King of Atlantis. I was so use to the JL animated version where he was a pr!ck. Even in S:TAS he was not a very nice guy. He pretty much hated the "surface dwellers" and wanted nothing to do with them unless absolutely necessary, and even then he needed convincing to do so. Same goes for Superfriends and his single adventures, Aquaman was pretty much a straight laced guy. This show, actually gave him a personality that fit in perfectly with this series tone. At the end of the episode I actually had an interest in this version of Aquaman. I looked at him as an actual hero. Black Manta I always thought was a cool villain, and they didnt disappoint in this episode. Manta was a bada$$.

I havent been disappointed in any of the 3 episodes, and I look forward to the future of this series.

 

[Mikelus]

Another fantastic episode! My son and I watched together and we loved it! He thinks Aquaman is cool, how many people out there believe so, not enough unfortunately. Great action, Black Manta was hyper cool, the jokes between Aquaman and Batman were really funny, Aquaman's family story gave the episode depth, the animation... everything was really well done. This is IMO the second best animated series after BTAS, and it blows The Batman away, better design and animation, better dialogues, action, humor that is even better than some sitcoms, the whole family can enjoy it. Is going to become a classic and fan favorite if they can keep this level up, hope they will.

 

[Captain Planet!]

I've been entertained by all 3 episodes so far. And people shouldn't forget that the first 3 episodes of TAS weren't exactly mind blowing or amazing. They were good, but they were not an indication of how good the show would become IMO.

 

[Doc_OCK_4MUGEN]

Man! Aquaman freaking rocks! (I never thought I would ever say that... Never been much of an Aquaman fan... blame the Superfriends TV show...) I definetely added Batman: the Brave and the Bold to my favorite TV shows...

 

[Ceb-Man]

The intro with Batman & The Atom vs. Felix Faust was also first class

I agree. More of The Atom

 

[Ceb-Man]

I loved this episode.Aquaman was awesome. i like him having the classic costume with the beard. Black Manta was also awesome.

 

[Galvanize]

Another excellent episode. This show has been the biggest surprise. Aquaman and Black Manta could not have been more cool. Cant wait for the next episode.

 

[Dread]

Considering all the hoopla about Aquaman that seems to exist these days, as well as a delay between episodes, there was some minor hype before this episode for me. Aquaman is a DC mainstay, but since the 70's it has appeared for all the wrong reasons. SUPERFRIENDS, and some of the hammy solo shows beforehand, didn't do the best job in flattering Aquaman, and that is the vision that several generations of readers and writers have had with Aquaman. Created about 1-2 years after Marvel's Namor the Sub-Mariner, many people see Aquaman as a "nicer" kid brother character; someone who isn't quite as interesting or memorable unless he is being goofy. His telepathy and rapport with sea creatures is infamously mocked for "talks to fish" from SUPERFRIENDS and in some appearances it seems writers have gone the OTHER direction to make Aquaman stand out; make him either a "bad-ass" or a jerk. The problem is that "Aquaman as a jerk" is basically Namor.

Bruce Timm had Aquaman appear in the last few episodes of SUPERMAN: TAS in "A FISH STORY". He had his iconic design and was voiced by Miguel Ferrer, but he borrowed heavily from the Namor archetype of an underwater king who was angry with the surface world's pollution of the oceans and often seemed a hair trigger away from invasion, and was a loner. While Aquaman would appear in the first three seasons of JUSTICE LEAGUE/JLU (with a new design and voice actor), this persona generally remained, as well as the 90's hook hand. While the show did much to make Aquaman into a feared water warrior, some dismissed him as basically being Namor Lite instead of his own character.

Of course, it does not help that the comic book Aquaman has not had a defining, stable run that sold well in a good decade, with his series finally seeing cancellation after a while recently. DC EIC Dan DiDio claims to want to wait for some definitive angle before relaunching the sea-hero again. Aquaman probably has some of the worst rep ever due to SUPERFRIENDS; while many of the other heroes from that show now have more modern understandings with mainstream audiences (EVERY hero was cheesy in SUPERFRIENDS), Aquaman has virtually never recovered. In a JLA featurette in the NEW FRONTIER disc, even some professional DC writers were mocking him or did not see him seriously.

SPOILERS!!

Enter into this murky water BATMAN: BRAVE AND THE BOLD, which has set out to basically take the Dick Sprang era of Batman and retell it for a new generation with some modern animation and fight sequences. In many ways the show seems as if it would have fit in better in 1988 rather than 2008, but I can appreciate it's energy as well as it's lack of pretension. It never tries to be more than a fun filled 22 minute fluff session, and Batman has been a character taken VERY SERIOUSLY for so long, sometimes I am in the mood for something lighter. Pairing Batman with a hero who has been infamously mocked in this set-up of bright, happy, almost goofy superheroism was naturally a bold move.

The plot is basic. After an excellent showdown alongside the Atom against magician Felix Faust, Batman detects strange underwater tremors beneath the seas. Faster than you can say, "Form of water!", Batman's converted the Bat-Plane to a sub and has his own breathing mask and bat-flippers. Foiling an attempt on Aquaman's life, Batman becomes involved in a plot by Black Mantra to destroy & plunder Atlantis, which involves manipulating Aquaman's estranged half-brother Orm, who soon goes by Ocean Master.

It should be noted that JUSTICE LEAGUE went through a similar storyline, where the League got involved in a plot against Aquaman's life set up by Orm to grab power. Only this was done in 22 minutes rather than 44, and did not take itself nearly as seriously. This show is also embracing some of that "corny" past rather than feeling the need to apologize for it, thus Orm proudly calls himself Ocean-Master and cackles in a, have to be honest, pretty cool looking costume; more unique than in JL.

Speaking of forming water, this version of Aquaman has the ability to control water, and can shape it into objects such as shields or swords. Normally this power was limited to Aqualad/Tempest and others in his kin, or required a magical "water hand" to do so. Honestly, I don't mind this as I see this as a normal extention of things; if other Atlantians have been shown able to manipulate water, why not their King? Imagine if Superman were the only Kryptonian without heat-vision in the Super-Family.

John DiMaggio voices Aquaman here and he gives him a bigger than life heroic voice. His Aquaman, as written by Joseph Kuhr, is king of Atlantis but also a bragging adventurer. He regails all present with duely documented, and NAMED, past adventures he has had (and was that Garth writing them down at the beginning?). To compromise between the 90's and classic designs, this Aquaman has more of his iconic 60's outfit, but has a short beard so he doesn't just look like "blond Superman". I honestly was a bit of a loss because Aquaman's so darned NICE here, I really hadn't seen much of that in cartoons or even some of the comics I read with him in it. He's all giving Batman bear-hugs and inviting him to feasts. Thankfully, Aquaman doesn't ride a giant sea-horse, but he is awfully friendly with dolphins...and sharks, so that makes up for it. Dolphins aren't manly, but sharks are. No one will ever fear a team called the Miami Dolphins (least for a NY Giant fan), but the Sharks are cool in hockey.

Of course, Aquaman's "niceness" is not endless. He does perform kingly duties, and when Batman mistakes Orm's spicing of a drink to poison, has Batman ordered out of the kingdom for assaulting Orm (but it all worked out). When Aquaman has to, he can fight it out against two narwhals or over a dozen of Black Manta's minions (at once). He doesn't even need his telepathy to communicate with sea life, and has "spies" everywhere, from the biggest whale to the smallest critter. Rather than appearing like a version of Namor, this Aquaman at the very least could be believed as a superhero who has adventures with a Justice League for something beyond Atlantis' self interest. It was also odd seeing Aquaman as a braggart about his adventures, but not in a nasty way (played for laughs). It reminded me of some bits that have been done with Marvel's Hercules (or even Thor in ULTIMATE AVENGERS 1 & 2). Of course, this is a cartoon universe where fun is poked at even the almighty Batman, so having a gag at Aquaman's expense isn't so bad. Having a hero who feels the need to document and recite all of his adventures isn't as hammy as riding a seahorse, especially for a king who, as a statesman, kind of HAS to have something left for other generations as well, including "legends". Aquaman is also not as vengeful here, willing to give Orm another chance when he aids against Black Manta, although he does still imprison him (just doesn't banish him from Atlantis).

What didn't work were some of the fish-themed pun's. While I normally like the humor of this series, I thought some of them were a bit much, used too often in a row, and seemed more predictable and obvious. The jokes I thought worked better was Batman's grumbling about Fluke the Dolphin (who kind of saves him later) and Aquaman's tales of adventure (especially as they were seen as "rehab" for Orm).

Mera, Aquaman's wife, appears but has no dialogue; it should be noted that Aquaman was one of the first family men in comics, having a wife and son when most heroes were swinging bachelors.

Kevin Micheal Richardson voices Black Manta, who is called that and not Devilray due to any Aquaman Embargoes from aborted WB TV pilots. Not that I minded Devil-Ray; I thought it was a cool name. Wallace Langham voices Orm/Ocean Master and I will say this version was probably more memorable than the JUSTICE LEAGUE version despite this show being less serious in tone. It was a shame that Batman, not Aquaman, takes down Manta, but it is Batman's show, and at least Aquaman was busy saving Atlantis with Orm by smashing a large machine.

It is a minor thing, but some of the Atlantian citizens were seen wearing clothes made of scales, thus making Aquaman's costume more like a design of the same material, rather than something that clashes with the rest of his people. I would say that Aquaman here acted more like a PC Hercules than Namor at least, which is closer to his actual persona (whatever that is).

The bottom line, I think this version of Aquaman is a good gateway Aquaman. He isn't the vengeful sea-lord that Namor is. He's lighthearted and noble, sometimes bordering on overconfident. But when the time comes, he can throw down with the best of them, whether alone or without his powers or alongside some sharks & whales. I got more of a feeling of adventure from this version of Aquaman; he had a zest for exploration and thrills, which is probably a good quality in a guy who has 75% of the planet to look after. Compared to the rookie Blue Beetle or the reformed thief Plastic Man, Arthur was the first superhero on the show who felt like a traditional "super hero" for a Batman team up. More of an equal to Batman rather than a somewhat overglorified side-kick. And a master of his domain; much as Batman is able to call forth any skill or gadget he needs in his battles, Aquaman could call forth pretty much any creature to help him underwater. I would be interested in Aquaman & Batman having a more surface based adventure, just to see how this version of Aquaman fares outside of his element. Which of course means the episode did it's job, if I wouldn't mind another team up.

People who are more fans of Aquaman from the comics have their own measuring stick for him, and this episode may either please them or remind them too much of the ham from SUPERFRIENDS. I for one didn't mind having a sea-hero who wasn't hammering us with CAPTAIN PLANET esque guilt for being polluters. At least being an overzealous adventurer is more original for Aquaman than reading from Namor's script of reckless, loner rage. Here is a king who the Aqua-Mom's probably wouldn't mind having their kids meet, vs. the brooding vengeance of the JL Aquaman.

Oh, and two words: Water-Hadou-kens.

Overall, a fine episode on the show's terms and a fun outing for Aquaman. Being a nice water hero may not make him stand out to people who prefer Namor, but at least it is more unique to me. Does every superhero have to be a *****ebag? Not here. I also enjoyed DiMaggio's take on the role, more bold and adventurous than some other Aquaman actors, without sounding too "young" either, like Thor sometimes does. The modern take on the "A" on the belt actually helped the design for me, even if he still has the dishwasher gloves. Being an underwater adventurer works fine for Aquaman.

For the first time in ages, an Aquaman who isn't pretending to be Namor. Enjoy it while you can.

 

[BlueLightning]

I really enjoy your reviews Dread. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Dread]

I really enjoy your reviews Dread. Thanks for sharing.

No prob.

 

[Doc_OCK_4MUGEN]

Dread: I loved your small analysis of Aquaman and Review of the Episode... It made me love Batman: TB&TB's Aquaman even more... (I wish we could see more Bats/Aquaman teamups)

 

[CaptainClown]

The fact it was written by Joseph Kuhr speaks wonders to me

 

[CaptainClown]

Also Aquaman as the Ghost of Christmas Present is awesome.

 

[GamerSlyRatchet]

The fact it was written by Joseph Kuhr speaks wonders to me

I'm surprised too, but he won my respect the moment he wrote "Strange New World" for The Batman. That episode was pure genius!

 

[tomstoyz2]

I think this was the BEST Brave & The Bold story so far. It seemed wayyyy more complex than the others. I guess the one with Plasticman is my 2nd favorite.

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

Just watched the episode and it is my favourite so far, which says a lot. I can't believe I ever doubted this show even for a second.

Black Manta's portrayal was the best villain so far, such an awesome badass, a great step up from the JLU portrayal. His voice was great too, whoever chose that muffly radio sound gets my props.

Aquaman was also an awesome portrayal, he has so much surprising depth here, I love how despite his self interest and boasting he still deeply cares for his villainous brother and Atlantis.

Of course, so much laughs here too, from the most obnoxious dolphin in the ocean to punching sharks that would make Adam West proud.

Also, that opening was very cool. How was Bats flying though? Was it The Atom? Because I had no idea he could do that.

 

[Bathead]

^^The only thing I can think of is that Atom ,IIRC, not only has control over his size, but his weight and mass too, so I imagine he possibly shrunk himself down, reduced his weight to almost weightlessness and somehow transferred that to Bats and the other objects that floated about.

*shrugs*

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

^^The only thing I can think of is that Atom ,IIRC, not only has control over his size, but his weight and mass too, so I imagine he possibly shrunk himself down, reduced his weight to almost weightlessness and somehow transferred that to Bats and the other objects that floated about.

*shrugs*

He can shrink people with him as well, so I'll just accept he shrunk Bats to avoid the lightning (a given) and also did what you said to him.

 

[Superman]

I hated the way they portrayed Aquaman in this one. He seemed like a jackass to me. If I was Orm I'd hate Aquaman too if I had to listen to him brag about himself all the time.

Aquaman should be a humble King, Not a bragging jackass.




One more thing. How the heck do you have Batman fighting a shark and not have Bats pull out a can of Shark Repellent? It's just not right.