Fringe Thread

[Donut]

But Walternate doesn't know any of that. And if he did, he probably wouldn't care because, unlike Walter, he's hasn't had pieces of his brain removed. So while Walter is rather mellow, forgiving, and guilt ridden, Walternate is none of that (well, he's still guilt ridden, but he doesn't let it control his decisions).

That is true that Walternate has no idea why Walter did what he did. But your right he would not care either way in the end as Walter kept him & on another note

http://www.fox.com/fringe/_ugc/images/extras/Fringe_Wallpaper03_1920x1080_ET.jpg

 

[Siby]

Cool picture. They Olivia on the left doesn't even look like Olivia.

 

[Dave McFly]

that's my new wallpaper

 

[SouLeSS]

A few things I want to touch on;

Walternate is the good guy, Walter is the bad guy. This is especially clear when Walternate is absolutely stern about not experimenting on children.

THe whole Fauxlivia being preggers adds just that perfect twist. Without it, there's no reason that peter would want to save that side over the one he's lived in most of his life. Not that he wants to destroy anything, he's rather adamant about making everything work.

The ending of last episode got me thinking that they're going to start doing a lot of crossover type episodes where a majority of the "cracks" are just weak spots like the 2 people yearning for one another. Back and forth, they'll work together (both sides) to repair the damages.

More.

 

[wiegeabo]

A few things I want to touch on;

Walternate is the good guy, Walter is the bad guy. This is especially clear when Walternate is absolutely stern about not experimenting on children.

I don't think that's quite true. Just not wanting to experiment on children doesn't make him the good gy.

Back in the day, they were essentially the same. One could say Walter is worse because of what he and William did to the kids, but did they ever say that Walternate didn't do the same kind of experiments?

Peter's kidnapping, and the fringe events in his world have made Walternate the hard man he is now. He sort of is the bad guy because he's willing to do pretty much anything to get what he wants. It's just that what he wants is to save his universe, and kids are about his only soft spot because of what happened to Peter.

Walter is good, but it's pretty much his damaged brain that lets his compassion and guilt rule him rather than cold logic.


The writers should be commended because, rather than give us a good guy and bad guy, they've created two complex characters can be defined both ways for different reasons, and yet don't fall neatly onto either side.

Just like how Olivia isn't good and Pholivia evil. Because in their own universes, they're both essentially the same. It's just that Pholivia was a real cold-hearted ***** on this side, except for when it came to Peter.

 

[Donut]

Preview of tonight's episode

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYB_zJzAZbU

 

[Marvolo]

Is it just me or does it look the picture on this episode is fuzzy and the whites are blown out? Like they tried to make the film stock look dated.

 

[Maximus One]

It was meant to since it was a flashback ep. I thought tonight's ep was great. I knew when it happened that young Olivia spilled the beans to Walternate about where Peter had gone but I could understand some people not catching it that quick. They have really created some dense emotional stories here, if this doesn't get at least one more season I'll be so damn pissed

 

[SouLeSS]

It was meant to since it was a flashback ep. I thought tonight's ep was great. I knew when it happened that young Olivia spilled the beans to Walternate about where Peter had gone but I could understand some people not catching it that quick. They have really created some dense emotional stories here, if this doesn't get at least one more season I'll be so damn pissed

Good news is that it's held it's ratings since the move to friday - something almost no other show has done. On top of that, it's one of Foxs' highest rated friday shows, and they don't have much to replace it with.

Bad news is that it's Fox, so who knows what'll happen.

 

[Superfreak]

The writers should be commended because, rather than give us a good guy and bad guy, they've created two complex characters can be defined both ways for different reasons, and yet don't fall neatly onto either side.

Just like how Olivia isn't good and Pholivia evil. Because in their own universes, they're both essentially the same. It's just that Pholivia was a real cold-hearted ***** on this side, except for when it came to Peter.

indeed. At the beginning of the season, we the audience had a solid definition of good and evil. Our universe being good, the other being evil. But over the course of this season, the so called villains have become extremely grey. Likewise, the heroes have also shifted to a grey spot.

Neither Walter is evil, and neither is good. They're both human. One Walter realized his path, and had himself dummed down. The other was deeply injured, and forced onto his current path.

It's all very interesting, and well put together.


lastly, seeing the way the two universes interacted to bring us where we are now was really interesting to see last night.

 

[wiegeabo]

I loved last night's twist. I was honestly not expecting that. I was just rooting for Olivia because she was finally asking for help and her stepdad was going to get what he deserved.

And then Walter asked what she was doing from behind her, and for a couple of seconds I felt the same confusion Olivia did. And then my jaw hit the floor as my brain clicked into place.

 

[elgaz]

Fantastic episode last night, one of my favourites.

Loved all the 80s touches - the revised theme tune & intro, the Battlestar Galactica and GI Joe toys in the store, the clothes and hairstyles, etc.

Great acting from all around - thought Walt/Walternate's wife was very good, and of course Walt/Walternate himself - as usual.

 

[Forever Rud]

I loved last night's twist.I was honestly not expecting that. I was just rooting for Olivia because she was finally asking for help and her stepdad was going to get what he deserved.

And then Walter asked what she was doing from behind her, and for a couple of seconds I felt the same confusion Olivia did. And then my jaw hit the floor as my brain clicked into place.

Now that your brain is in place, would you mind explaining it to me? Sorry to be dense . . but it looked like exactly the same building (the day care center) both before and after Olivia went into Walter's office.

And 'Olive' didn't have a malevolent stepdad on the other side, did she? So how did her drawing get on Walternate's desk, and why did he immediately realize Peter was in our universe??

I must have had my brain on idle -- I just didn't understand how it all fit together.

 

[wiegeabo]

Now that your brain is in place, would you mind explaining it to me? Sorry to be dense . . but it looked like exactly the same building (the day care center) both before and after Olivia went into Walter's office.

And 'Olive' didn't have a malevolent stepdad on the other side, did she? So how did her drawing get on Walternate's desk, and why did he immediately realize Peter was in our universe??

I must have had my brain on idle -- I just didn't understand how it all fit together.

Firstly, it's the same place in both universes. It's Walter's lab, and Walternate's corporate headquarters.

Olivia ran into Walter's office with the picture of her and Peter, ready to finally tell Walter that her dad beats her and ask for his help.

But her emotions are so churned up, she ports over to the other universe without realizing it (because it's the same building) and runs into Walternate's office instead. So she tells Walternate about her dad, handing him her coloring book with the pictures that prove she had transitioned over to Walternate's universe.

Inside her coloring book was also the picture she had drawn with her and Peter standing in the field of tulips (which weren't in Walternate's universe). With Olivia talking about crossing universes and the picture of her and Peter together, Walternate put two and two together and figured out what happened to Peter.

 

[Forever Rud]

Thanks for laying it out, Wiegabo. It's kind of what I suspected, but . . .

Firstly, it's the same place in both universes. It's Walter's lab, and Walternate's corporate headquarters.

When Walternate pulled up to Bishop Dynamic in a limo and walked inside, wasn't there a huge 2-story foyer and half a dozen hallways? The Day Care center didn't look anywhere near that big. And I don't believe it was within sight of a rocket launchpad either!

. . . So she tells Walternate about her dad, handing him her coloring book with the pictures that prove she had transitioned over to Walternate's universe.

So which 'Walter' was it that threatened her stepdad? Did Olivia come back to this universe off-screen somehow, and then came out of our Walter's office to confront the step-dad?

Inside her coloring book was also the picture she had drawn with her and Peter standing in the field of tulips (which weren't in Walternate's universe). With Olivia talking about crossing universes and the picture of her and Peter together, Walternate put two and two together and figured out what happened to Peter.

Well, he has amazing powers of deduction then, because a field of tulips could just be taken as a child's interpretation of flowers in a meadow any old place. But I take it Olivia had another emotional moment in front of Walternate and crossed back into the Day Care center with our Walter not being shocked enough by the crossing in front of his eyes to just march her out to her stepdad??

 

[Kii]

I think Olivia is able to be in two places at the same time, as evidenced when Olivia tried escaping from the alternate universe and the soldiers were able to pull her out of the water thereby bringing her back.

 

[wiegeabo]

When Walternate pulled up to Bishop Dynamic in a limo and walked inside, wasn't there a huge 2-story foyer and half a dozen hallways? The Day Care center didn't look anywhere near that big. And I don't believe it was within sight of a rocket launchpad either!

Both buildings were in Florida. They don't have to be exactly the same, nor do they both have to be outside of launchpads, because they're in two different universes. Similar, but not the same.

So which 'Walter' was it that threatened her stepdad? Did Olivia come back to this universe off-screen somehow, and then came out of our Walter's office to confront the step-dad?

Walter threatened the stepdad. Watch the scene again. Olivia runs into the office and cries to Walternate about her dad. But then Walter, standing behind Olivia, says her name. She turns around, and Walter's standing there confused as why she's crying. When she looks back at the desk, there's no one sitting there. And the room is completely different, back to being Walter's office. (she hadn't noticed it was Walternate's office when she ran in).

Well, he has amazing powers of deduction then, because a field of tulips could just be taken as a child's interpretation of flowers in a meadow any old place. But I take it Olivia had another emotional moment in front of Walternate and crossed back into the Day Care center with our Walter not being shocked enough by the crossing in front of his eyes to just march her out to her stepdad??

It wasn't just the tulips.

Olivia: "My stepfather did this. He hits me. That's when I crossed over into the other universe. That's where I saw the blimps, just like you said. They were in the sky in the other universe."

Watch Walternate's face when she says that last line. It's the subtle realization of just what she's saying. She says she's crossed universe. She says that the blimps are in the other universe, but for Walternate, there have always been blimps in the sky, which means she has to be from the other side. And she says that he had told her about the blimps. Since Walternate has never met Olivia, he concludes that there must be another Walter in another universe.

Which would explain how, as he was trying to figure out earlier, a man that looked and sounded exactly like him was able to kidnap Peter. The picture of Olivia standing with Peter was the final bit of proof he needed.

 

[Forever Rud]

^^^
Thank you very much for being patient with me! The light is starting to dawn.

I guess I need to listen more closely to the dialogue.(I'm more of a visual guy and tend to look more than listen!)

Just one more thing that bugged me a bit ---- how is it that both Walters have identical wives, if things in the two universes, like marriages, are 'similar but not the same', as you pointed out?

 

[wiegeabo]

Just because the people are counterparts to their versions from the other universe doesn't mean they're they same. Pholivia had a very different childhood from Olivia. And, before Peter's kidnapping, even though Peter was sick, Walternate's family was different from Walter's. In our universe, Walter was home more often and with Peter when he died. In Walternate's universe, he was never home, and his Peter held out longer against the illness than our Peter. And Alt-Astrid is definitely very different. She sort of comes across as autistic in the other universe.

 

[Kii]

Yeah, Jasika Nicole said in an interview that Alt-Astrid has Asperger's.

 

[Paradox1]

Great episode but it's crazy how Olivia and Peter remember nothing from Jacksonville. I guess the trauma they both suffered made them repress those memories.

 

[GhostPoet]

Yeah, Jasika Nicole said in an interview that Alt-Astrid has Asperger's.

ah ha. I suspected, but I never knew for certain until now. Nice.

On a side note....does it seem like Walter is gradually becoming more and more coherent? It seems like it to me that the drug he injected himself with his growing back those missing parts of his brain.

 

[Wyrminarrd]

I've actually wanted him to get his faculties back for some time now. Though I have to say that from these flash backs he appears to be a much nicer person than originally hinted at.

 

[Siby]

Great episode but it's crazy how Olivia and Peter remember nothing from Jacksonville. I guess the trauma they both suffered made them repress those memories.

This part drives me crazy. Both should be able to remember their time together in Jacksonville given their age. Not to mention that Peter should not have forgotten that he was from the other side. He may have accepted his fate in this universe but deep down he still knows he is from somewhere else. For example what he says when playing with the airplane, roughly paraphrased, "flight XX coming in for docking." Airplanes don't dock but dirigibles do. At the very least his memories from childhood should have come flooding back when he found out he was from another universe as an adult. Maybe they did, I don't remember that episode now.

I freaking love this show. It is written and the actors perform on a high level.

 

[Kii]

Wasn't it established though, that Olivia didn't remember much of anything when she was in Jacksonville?