Girl Dies, Parents didn't pray hard enough.

[pyromaniac]

Ah, the old "Why would a loving God let this happen?" question. Let me explain it.

Her death will set in motion a necessary chain of events. It's as simple as that. That's what keeps the world going.

Have you seen that Futurama episode where Bender plays God, with consequences?

One of my favourites of all time.

 

[Indie]

That poor girl. Can you imagine what she felt like as she got sicker and sicker, all the while being told it was her own fault because she didn't have enough faith? Not only did she die, but she probably died feeling ashamed, judged and condemned. That breaks my heart.

 

[Hotwire]

Are those serious questions? God also give humans a brain so that they may use them to develop some common sense. God did not let the kid die, her parents did. (He just stood by, watched, and did nothing.) Death is a natural thing. If God were to let everyone live, the world would be overpopulated. Have you thought of the problems that will rise with overpopulation? (That wasn't my point, but yes.)It's always easy for us to blame God for everything instead of taking responsibility for our own dumb actions.

So then death was the best thing for the child? God felt this child should be allowed to die so that the parents may learn from it. OK, but please, explain to me, why an all loving God would allow a young couple to conceive a child, praise him for blessing them with this child, do everything that is asked of them, according to their faith, only to have the child die 2 days after it's birth? What about them? See, I understand that people need to die inorder for the world to go on. I understand that tragedy is always going to happen. (Kinda curious why it can't be all the evil people instead of innocent children, though.) What I don't understand, is how people can put faith into a belief that God will heal their wounds, make them well, and save the lives of those they love, when it is ovious, he doesn't and won't. If God has the ability to do the things that religions claim he can do, and does not use them, what does that tell you about God?

Look, I believe there is a God of some sort, I believe there are miracles (my daughters are two of them), I just feel that God doesn't care, quite as much as some would like to believe.

 

[TNC9852002]

I love it when imperfect Man makes excuses for a perfect God's actions. I take everything as it is and that's it.

-TNC

 

[Halcohol]

So then death was the best thing for the child? God felt this child should be allowed to die so that the parents may learn from it. OK, but please, explain to me, why an all loving God would allow a young couple to conceive a child, praise him for blessing them with this child, do everything that is asked of them, according to their faith, only to have the child die 2 days after it's birth? What about them? See, I understand that people need to die inorder for the world to go on. I understand that tragedy is always going to happen. (Kinda curious why it can't be all the evil people instead of innocent children, though.) What I don't understand, is how people can put faith into a belief that God will heal their wounds, make them well, and save the lives of those they love, when it is ovious, he doesn't and won't. If God has the ability to do the things that religions claim he can do, and does not use them, what does that tell you about God?

Look, I believe there is a God of some sort, I believe there are miracles (my daughters are two of them), I just feel that God doesn't care, quite as much as some would like to believe.

Dude, all God did was start things in motion. Maybe every now and then He intervenes and hits the planet with an asteroid or a plague or entertainment news, but I believe that whatever He's doing up there is far more important than listening to mom and dad who are too helpless and ******ed to go buy some penicillin.

Fairly certain that's why we have the ability to think for ourselves.

 

[Corey]

So then death was the best thing for the child? God felt this child should be allowed to die so that the parents may learn from it. OK, but please, explain to me, why an all loving God would allow a young couple to conceive a child, praise him for blessing them with this child, do everything that is asked of them, according to their faith, only to have the child die 2 days after it's birth? What about them? See, I understand that people need to die inorder for the world to go on. I understand that tragedy is always going to happen. (Kinda curious why it can't be all the evil people instead of innocent children, though.) What I don't understand, is how people can put faith into a belief that God will heal their wounds, make them well, and save the lives of those they love, when it is ovious, he doesn't and won't. If God has the ability to do the things that religions claim he can do, and does not use them, what does that tell you about God?

Look, I believe there is a God of some sort, I believe there are miracles (my daughters are two of them), I just feel that God doesn't care, quite as much as some would like to believe.

Obviously, I don't know this family personally, so I can't even begin to ponder why the eleven year old girl wasn't healed...I mean, God can and will heal the sick. Period. But why are some people healed but not others? Hard to say sometimes...sometimes you know why. I won't get into any of that here. If someone wants to talk about that, they can private message me.

I just know that I've seen people be healed. I know of someone who's been raised from the dead. I've prayed for a kid with cancer and he was healed instantly (not by me, mind you, God did it).

In fact, today I'm hoping I can get out to pray for a few people that need healing. One is in the hospital, the other two are at home, I believe.

I just don't know. I feel so bad for that little girl. Like someone else said above, its heart breaking. But, now she has us to feel bad for. She's the one in heaven right now. If thats any consolation. It probably isn't. I don't know...

 

[Hotwire]

I know of someone who's been raised from the dead. I've prayed for a kid with cancer and he was healed instantly (not by me, mind you, God did it).

How long was this person dead? Had they been burried yet? Did it make the news?

As for the kid with cancer, get real. I've lost too many members of my family to that disease to believe this one. You cannot fathom the amount of prayers I made to try and save the life of my best friend. He was diagnosed with an agressive bone cancer at age 17 and was dead before his 19th birthday. I was in church praying, I was home praying, I even remember begging God to take me instead. Nothing. I guess I didn't pray hard enough, and you did. This was the momment in my life when I began to lose faith in God caring about everyone.

 

[Corey]

How long was this person dead? Had they been burried yet? Did it make the news?

As for the kid with cancer, get real. I've lost too many members of my family to that disease to believe this one. You cannot fathom the amount of prayers I made to try and save the life of my best friend. He was diagnosed with an agressive bone cancer at age 17 and was dead before his 19th birthday. I was in church praying, I was home praying, I even remember begging God to take me instead. Nothing. I guess I didn't pray hard enough, and you did. This was the momment in my life when I began to lose faith in God caring about everyone.

I'm not naive. I realize I'm an anonymous person on the internet, and you have no reason to believe me. I don't blame you. All I can do is tell the truth. He had a mass behind his sinuses the size of a grapefruit. He was in the newspaper. I'll scan the clip if I have to. Not that that automatically proves anything, really, but, its something I guess. It wasn't just me praying, btw. Its a long story...

I'm really sorry about your best friend. I can't imagine what it'd be like to lose mine. We're like brothers, and I imagine thats how you two were. It has nothing to do with praying hard enough. If I could, I would pray with ya. Seriously. I know that you're making a point with the "I guess I didn't pray hard enough, and you did." thing, but just so this is clear, that is not true....ya know, just in case part of you ever blames yourself for his death. (I doubt this is the case, but I'm just making sure.)

I hope you don't feel disrespected, or like I'm pretending to understand your scars.

 

[Super Kal]

I'm with you on this one, Corey.... Mal'Akai, I am so extremely sorry for your loss. Like Corey said, I can't even imagine how you felt when you went through that. I have two friends who have lost someone close to them, one was his newborn boy.

 

[Hotwire]

I'm with you on this one, Corey.... Mal'Akai, I am so extremely sorry for your loss. Like Corey said, I can't even imagine how you felt when you went through that. I have two friends who have lost someone close to them, one was his newborn boy.

Thanks for the condolences, both of you. That was almost 13 years ago. After my last post, my wife and I got to talking about this topic, and I've come to the following conclusion on this issue.

God is not all powerfull. If he were, we would not have free will. This does not mean he has no power, but rather that he is willing to relenquish some of that power to us. By granting us free will, he is allowing us to make our own choices and not interfere. And while this sucks, it is really the only conclusion, because if he is, in fact, all powerfull, than he cannot be all loving. Because someone who is all loving and all powerfull, would not let things like this happen. I've said my piece.

 

[Spider-Who?]

How long was this person dead? Had they been burried yet? Did it make the news?

As for the kid with cancer, get real. I've lost too many members of my family to that disease to believe this one. You cannot fathom the amount of prayers I made to try and save the life of my best friend. He was diagnosed with an agressive bone cancer at age 17 and was dead before his 19th birthday. I was in church praying, I was home praying, I even remember begging God to take me instead. Nothing. I guess I didn't pray hard enough, and you did. This was the momment in my life when I began to lose faith in God caring about everyone.

I'm sorry for your loss, I really am. My uncle died of cancer a few years ago. Its a terrible thing to deal with, not just the death itself, but being forced to watch your loved ones succomb to a terrible disease.

However, I am grateful for the two lives that God did save in my life from cancer. My sister was diagnosed with cervical cancer years ago. She had a massive tumor that they were going to take out prior to any chemo. But when they opened her up, the tumor was gone. Completely.

Another is my pastor's wife, she's like a second mother to me. She's been battling breast cancer for the past few years. When the diagnosed her 3 years ago, she was at stage 4 (which is pretty much a death notice). Just last month she was given a clean bill of health.

Its hard to say why God doesn't save everyone. I wish he did. But I guess if miracles such as these happened every day to every living person, they wouldn't be miracles any more.

 

[Spider-Who?]

oh, and The Unnamed Feeling is a GREAT song.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

That poor girl. Can you imagine what she felt like as she got sicker and sicker, all the while being told it was her own fault because she didn't have enough faith? Not only did she die, but she probably died feeling ashamed, judged and condemned. That breaks my heart.

Yes, my brother has cerebral palsy. Literally thousands of people all over the world prayed for him to be able to walk, and my family encountered quite a few Christians who told us that with that many faithful Christians praying, in light of Jesus promises:

Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst. (Matthew 18:19-20 NAS)

And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14 NAB)

If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. (John 15:7 NAB)

(all lies, btw...)


- it meant that my brother was consumed by sin and wickedness, probably possessed by multiple demons...so they had to cast out the crippling demons.

But, they cast out the demons, and...d'OH!...he still couldn't walk!

So, their only conclusion was that he was not truly a believer, and would not accept Jesus' blessing...even though thousands of people were asking Jesus to heal him.

 

[Hotwire]

oh, and The Unnamed Feeling is a GREAT song.

Yes it is. it sums me up pretty well.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

That poor girl. Can you imagine what she felt like as she got sicker and sicker, all the while being told it was her own fault because she didn't have enough faith? Not only did she die, but she probably died feeling ashamed, judged and condemned. That breaks my heart.

Yes, my brother has cerebral palsy. Literally thousands of people all over the world prayed for him to be able to walk, and my family encountered quite a few Christians who told us that with that many faithful Christians praying, in light of Jesus promises:

Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst. (Matthew 18:19-20 NAS)

And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14 NAB)

If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. (John 15:7 NAB)

(all lies, btw...)



- it meant that my brother was consumed by sin and wickedness, probably possessed by multiple demons...so they had to cast out the crippling demons.

But, they cast out the demons, and...d'OH!...he still couldn't walk!

So, their only conclusion was that he was not truly a believer, and would not accept Jesus' blessing...even though thousands of people were asking Jesus to heal him.

 

[Mee]

Tell us again Papa Wilhelm!

 

[Corey]

Yes, my brother has cerebral palsy. Literally thousands of people all over the world prayed for him to be able to walk, and my family encountered quite a few Christians who told us that with that many faithful Christians praying, in light of Jesus promises:

Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst. (Matthew 18:19-20 NAS)

And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14 NAB)

If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. (John 15:7 NAB)

(all lies, btw...)


- it meant that my brother was consumed by sin and wickedness, probably possessed by multiple demons...so they had to cast out the crippling demons.

But, they cast out the demons, and...d'OH!...he still couldn't walk!

So, their only conclusion was that he was not truly a believer, and would not accept Jesus' blessing...even though thousands of people were asking Jesus to heal him.

I'll pray for your brother. Whats his name? If God tells me to, I'll do it in person.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I'll pray for your brother. Whats his name? If God tells me to, I'll do it in person.

Do you have a more direct "in" with God than all of the members of the congregations of every church my family attended from the years 1974 to 1991, and the the thousands of people in the prayer chains?
Impressive.
Anyway, you don't need his name.
You can say, "Wilhelm from the Hype's little brother".
Since God is omnipotent, I'm sure he'll figure it out.

If he starts walking, after all of these years, I'll be sure to put video of it on youtube immediately!

 

[Corey]

Do you have a more direct "in" with God than all of the members of the congregations of every church my family attended from the years 1974 to 1991, and the the thousands of people in the prayer chains?
Impressive.
Anyway, you don't need his name.
You can say, "Wilhelm from the Hype's little brother".
Since God is omnipotent, I'm sure he'll figure it out.

If he starts walking, after all of these years, I'll be sure to put video of it on youtube immediately!

Oh, wait, you're right. Ya know, praying for your brother really was an absurd idea when you put it that way.

I told you I would pray. Telling me that thousands of people have prayed before doesn't change anything. But seriously, a name helps. Well, it helps me, anyway. If you wanna PM it to me, that'd be great. If not, thats fine as well.

 

[Jerry!]

I think the point is that praying doesn't help, whether you know the name or not.

 

[Corey]

I think the point is that praying doesn't help, whether you know the name or not.

I knew his point, Jerry.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I think the point is that praying doesn't help, whether you know the name or not.

A perfect example of how you can't ever win with a believer, is the Sago mine in West Virginia, back in 2006.

Remember?
The miners were trapped, their families were out of their minds with grief and fear.
And then!...miracle of miracles!!
The news reported that all but one of the miners had been FOUND!
It was even on CNN, so we "knew" it was true.


At this point, I actually saw family members weeping with joy, being interviewed, saying that this was solid proof there was a God, because people all over the world had been praying fervently for the safe rescue of the miners, and now, they were almost all found alive.



Then, the news reported, "erm...sorry, we mistakenly reported that 12 of the miners had been found. Actually, 12 BODIES were found. Sorry 'bout that. "


And then, you could see the people being interviewed, saying, "Well, we're devastated, but we know this was God's will. We can't understand it, but he has a good purpose for this, and they're in a better place now, Hallelujah!"



Wait a minute...finding the miners was proof that God cares about us...but not finding them, is confirmation that we just have to accept that God knows best???

The same happened with 9/11.
Some people were in the building, and they survived.
And of course, everyone there didn't want to die, so they were begging god to help them.

But, the people who were L.U.C.K.Y. enough to "miraculously" survive being crushed and suffocated, often say, "It's proof that there's a God, because I prayed and I know he sent his angels to protect me and to lead the rescue workers to me! Praise Jesus!"




What about the 3,000 people who were ALSO praying for a miraculous rescue, who died horribly.
Were they sinners, homosexuals, witches, adulterers, blasphemers...all?
Or, it was just "their time".

Well it's being dishonest and willfully blind to act as if a good thing is to God's credit, but a bad thing isn't as well...to act like a narrow escape for one is "proof", but the WAY more common demise of many more (who weren't as L.U.C.K.Y.) ISN'T DISproof.