Here's my theory on the Soprano finally...

[Atomicchuck3k]

Here is the best explanation of what happened Sunday night...

He was killed....

in fact, the ending was genius if you've paid attention to the show or are just a fan of well developed well thought out plots that all tie together and have the memory of a champ to remember it all the ending was simple, he got killed, but let me tell yall why and explain in detail... There was 3 people in the room total who had a
reason to kill tony.....

the two black guys, they were paid before to kill tony but he was only shot in the ear, this was in one of the earlier seasons, also in the earlier seasons, the trucker who was sitting at the bar stool, who the camera kept focusing in on, is Nikki leotardo, Phil Leotardos nephew, he was in one of the early season episodes where Phil and Tony have a sit down....

heres where the genius comes in....

When tonys walking in the diner,you see the camera focus on him, then it switches to his perspective, and you see him looking @ the booth hes gonna sit at... then the camera switches back to tonys face, then it once again switches to his perspective, and it shows him looking @ the door and looking @ the people come in..... Everytime the door opens the Chimes sound.......Carmela walks in, Chimes, AJ walks in Chimes, this when Meadows parallel parking, still trying to get inside the restaurant....
at this point the camera switches back to the trucker who goes in the bathroom...... Then it goes to a scene where meadow finally parks and starts running in the diner.... the doors about to open, Tony looks up....
and No Chimes......................

No Music............

Everything just goes black...............

In one of the early episodes of the sopranos, tonys talking with bobby about what it must feel like to die.. Bobby says "at the end, you probably dont hear anything, everything just goes black" part of that was revisited in the second to last episode during the last seconds of it, when tonys about to go to sleep and he flashes back to the memory of him and bobby on the boat... "You probably dont hear anything everything just goes black"

so in the end, the Journey song was playing, the chimes on the door sounded but when meadow came in, the guy in the trucker hat came out and killed tony...

its the reason you aint hear, or see ***** when he died.... it was from his perspective.... and everything went black, then the credits rolled.

 

[Bat Attack]

Ahhh, very clever It all makes perfect sense!

 

[AllThingsComic]

I wrote all that in the other Soprano thread about half an hour ago? Not every detail but basically all of it.

 

[TheDemon'sHead]

and there's this to backup the fact NO ONE in the diner ever appeared in the show or had any beef with Tony: http://blog.nj.com/alltv/2007/06/david_chase_speaks.html

 

[AllThingsComic]

Just read that article, pretty good, Chase knew what he was doing when he filmed that scene though, that's for sure.

 

[TheDemon'sHead]

Oh definitely. All those background characters were there for a reason.

 

[Atomicchuck3k]

Ahhh, very clever It all makes perfect sense!

Thanks Battack!

 

[The Shredder]

Thanks for posting that, AtomicChuck3k.

I suddenly feel the need to rewatch the finale again, which I initially found disappointing, due to your well thought out post. Thanks again.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Nice ideas, but....nah.

The guy who went into the bathroom was....just a guy. Tony wasn't killed. No, David Chase did something much cleverer than that with this finale.

The key to the entire scene is that it IS completely harmless, and that Tony is in no danger. But despite that, we're all on the edge of our seat, filled with dread right until the final moment. You're partly right when you talk about this scene being from Tony's perspective, as it gives us an insight into his perspective. The dread we feel in this scene? That's the dread Tony feels in every situation he walks into, no matter how benign. It's the dread he's going to feel for the rest of his life, long after the TV show has stopped telling his story.

There's your "happy ending."

Sheer genius. Bravo, Mr. Chase.

 

[conan69]

Im just copying and pasting what I wrote somewhere else here becuae Im too lazy to rewrite it.


Guys.

Why would NY kill Tony? Butch tried to get Phil to reach out to Tony. Phil says no - so they betray Phil. They finally got what Tony has always know. Its better to keepthe peace and let everyone make money. Tony has always lived by this rule. He took out his own cousin to make peace with Johnny Sack. He went to Phil after beating one of his guys. Tony knows peace = profit.

Phil is gone. Carmine is the rightful heir of the NY organization. Carmine is a dimwit that Tony gets along with and can easily manipulate.

There is nothing there to state Tony gets killed. The people in the diner are suspicious becuase you think they are and are waiting for soething to happaen. Chase knows this!! Look at the credits. Theres nothing there that mentions Nicki Leotardo. The suspicious guy at the counter is simply named Guy In Member's Only Jacket. Since when do hitmen sit down order coffee and leave fingerprints everywhere. Theyre usually in and out with a spotter outside for a quick get away.

The people in the diner are red herrings, just like the terrorism plot(which had peopel specualting could mean a out for Tony, his co-operation. It lead nowhere). Something to get your wheels turning and see something that isnt there. I love the online theory that the 2 black guys were the guys who junior used to put the contract on Tony. Thats just silly. One of those guys died in the attempt and the other one was in his 20s 9 years ago. Those 2 were just kids. Sometimes a cat is just a cat.

This show has been playing with our expectations for a few seasons now. How many of the coming attractions for next weeks episodes raised the anticipation when the Johnny S thing was going on. Had us beleiving a NY/NJ would have happaned 2 years ago. You had a guy who was threatening to testify against Tony and was giving states evidence for 5 seasons only to have it resolved in 30 seconds with a heart attack in the car. Whod of thought the Tony/Christopher storyline would be resolved with a movie and a car wreck.

Chase has said he likes to play with conventional storytelling.

And the finale was the last play on those expectations. He builds a scene up and then abruptly stops it. We dont knwo what happens next. There isnt any evidence there leaning towards Tony dying.

In fact the meaning of the Journey song leans to the opposite("Oh the movie never ends, it goes on and on and on..) - that the story will go on and on and on and on - its Chases choice of a stop point that completely blows. Its a scene where he makes it appear as it somethign is building and then simply stops.

Its a gag on us all. Its also gimicky and cheap and I think these characters deserved abetter ending.




"the two black guys, they were paid before to kill tony but he was only shot in the ear, this was in one of the earlier seasons, also in the earlier seasons, the trucker who was sitting at the bar stool, who the camera kept focusing in on, is Nikki leotardo, Phil Leotardos nephew, he was in one of the early season episodes where Phil and Tony have a sit down...."

I love this. Its going around the internet and everyone considers it some sort of hidden deep meaning. Think for yourself instead of parroting crap on the net.

First of all. One of those guys was killed in the attack. Second those guys were in their early 20s 9 years ago!! The guys who walked into the diner looked like they were just kids. Why would someone who was hired to do a hit 9 years ago come back? Its absolutely ridiculous.

If you look at the credits, Nicki Leotardo isnt mentioned ANYWHERE.

 

[blind_fury]

Who was Paulie supposed to meet at the Bada Bing and why was he missing?

 

[conan69]

Carlo, one of Tony Captains

He took over Vitos crew. His son was busted for selling X and Carlo has gone into hiding because he is going to testify against Tony.
To put a face to him...

Con't from above.....

Anyone who was expecting a clear tiddy ending to this series hasnt been paying attention the past few years. Chase has been bringing in, dropping storylines everywhere and left alot of things unresolved.

I was expecting Sopranos to have a "life goes on" ending but I didnt expect it to be so badly done. I dont need to tiddy nicely wrapped, all the answers laid out for me conclusion. In fact I prefer not to have that. Som eof the best films dont have easy answers. But dammit, make th eending coherent and dont snub your nose at the audience.

This finale was pretentious and self indulgent. And Im glad its over. The Sopranos has been treading water for 3 or 4 years. Moments of greatness and alot of mediocre epsiodes.(no where near the greatness of Deadwood or The Wire). This was WAY overlong. S6 was aimless and wandered. Chase shoudl have stuck to original plan for the show instead of being seduced by HBO money and dragging the show out.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Carlo, one of Tony Captains

He took over Vitos crew. His son was busted for selling X and Carlo has gone into hiding because he is going to testify against Tony.
To put a face to him...

Con't from above.....

Anyone who was expecting a clear tiddy ending to this series hasnt been paying attention the past few years. Chase has been bringing in, dropping storylines everywhere and left alot of things unresolved.

I was expecting Sopranos to have a "life goes on" ending but I didnt expect it to be so badly done. I dont need to tiddy nicely wrapped, all the answers laid out for me conclusion. In fact I prefer not to have that. Som eof the best films dont have easy answers. But dammit, make th eending coherent and dont snub your nose at the audience.

This finale was pretentious and self indulgent. And Im glad its over. The Sopranos has been treading water for 3 or 4 years. Moments of greatness and alot of mediocre epsiodes.(no where near the greatness of Deadwood or The Wire). This was WAY overlong. S6 was aimless and wandered. Chase shoudl have stuck to original plan for the show instead of being seduced by HBO money and dragging the show out.

You clearly know what you're talking about, and are not one of the "I only watch for the whackings" crowd who are disappointed they didn't get a "Scarface" ending. Good ideas about the ending, and what it meant.

But I'm going to have to disagree on your conclusion. I not only thought the ending was great, but I thought the past couple of seasons over the "last 3 or 4 years" have been arguably the best "The Sopranos" has ever done. One of the things that made "The Sopranos" so great was that it seemed to get better with every season.

 

[TheDemon'sHead]

I thought the ending was pretty good. Not the best thing in the world but very fitting to the end of the show.

I wrote this in the other Sopranos thread. It seems relevant here now too.

I think if the show went on for another ten seconds viewers would have been more happy with the ending. The fact that the show went to black mid-cut seems to have ticked people off. After all, we are use to fade aways, wipes and whatever other techniques are used. If we saw Meadow enter and sit down then fade I think people would have felt more satisfied. But since it abruptly went to black, people felt cheated that there was no closure.

 

[conan69]

I think it should have ended wih Tony and Paulie sitting outside the pork store.

Say a delivery kid pulls up and goes in with the car running and that song is playing on the car stereo.

Tony sits contemplating his life staring at the only person he has left - the person who drives him craziest in the world... Paulie.

Now THAT would have driven home the point much beter than the ending Chase made.


That the movie will never end, its will go on and on and on and on.

Tony will always be worried about whos going to flip, whos out to get him. Every italian and black guy he sees is a potential assassin, He will always be depressed, he will always be paranoid,etc

I dont have a problem with the resolution of the show - its what I expected. That life will go on for Tony as it always has and he'll never be happy.

I never thought it would end with Tony dead or in jail.

What I didnt expect was how badly Chase would show it.

 

[Dark Donnie]

I've stated this before:

My theory is it was the audience that got whacked. The whole scene was very tense. We were shown Tony's world through his eyes. What he goes through everyday. Every person is analyzed to see if their a threat. That is the life he lives constantly looking over his shoudler..at the end of the scene when it "Cuts" to black is us getting whacked, the end of The Sopranos. Just like Bobby said it's sudden and you probably don't hear/see it coming.

 

[Dark Donnie]

Here is the best explanation of what happened Sunday night...

He was killed....

in fact, the ending was genius if you've paid attention to the show or are just a fan of well developed well thought out plots that all tie together and have the memory of a champ to remember it all the ending was simple, he got killed, but let me tell yall why and explain in detail... There was 3 people in the room total who had a
reason to kill tony.....

the two black guys, they were paid before to kill tony but he was only shot in the ear, this was in one of the earlier seasons, also in the earlier seasons, the trucker who was sitting at the bar stool, who the camera kept focusing in on, is Nikki leotardo, Phil Leotardos nephew, he was in one of the early season episodes where Phil and Tony have a sit down....

heres where the genius comes in....

When tonys walking in the diner,you see the camera focus on him, then it switches to his perspective, and you see him looking @ the booth hes gonna sit at... then the camera switches back to tonys face, then it once again switches to his perspective, and it shows him looking @ the door and looking @ the people come in..... Everytime the door opens the Chimes sound.......Carmela walks in, Chimes, AJ walks in Chimes, this when Meadows parallel parking, still trying to get inside the restaurant....
at this point the camera switches back to the trucker who goes in the bathroom...... Then it goes to a scene where meadow finally parks and starts running in the diner.... the doors about to open, Tony looks up....
and No Chimes......................

No Music............

Everything just goes black...............

In one of the early episodes of the sopranos, tonys talking with bobby about what it must feel like to die.. Bobby says "at the end, you probably dont hear anything, everything just goes black" part of that was revisited in the second to last episode during the last seconds of it, when tonys about to go to sleep and he flashes back to the memory of him and bobby on the boat... "You probably dont hear anything everything just goes black"

so in the end, the Journey song was playing, the chimes on the door sounded but when meadow came in, the guy in the trucker hat came out and killed tony...

its the reason you aint hear, or see ***** when he died.... it was from his perspective.... and everything went black, then the credits rolled.

If you watched the previous episodes then you would know that Tony killed one if not both of the wojuld be black assasins.

Also the guy IS NOT NIKKI LEOTARDO. He has never acted before, he owns a pizza place in PA.

 

[Reek]

Here is the best explanation of what happened Sunday night...

He was killed....

in fact, the ending was genius if you've paid attention to the show or are just a fan of well developed well thought out plots that all tie together and have the memory of a champ to remember it all the ending was simple, he got killed, but let me tell yall why and explain in detail... There was 3 people in the room total who had a
reason to kill tony.....

the two black guys, they were paid before to kill tony but he was only shot in the ear, this was in one of the earlier seasons, also in the earlier seasons, the trucker who was sitting at the bar stool, who the camera kept focusing in on, is Nikki leotardo, Phil Leotardos nephew, he was in one of the early season episodes where Phil and Tony have a sit down....

heres where the genius comes in....

When tonys walking in the diner,you see the camera focus on him, then it switches to his perspective, and you see him looking @ the booth hes gonna sit at... then the camera switches back to tonys face, then it once again switches to his perspective, and it shows him looking @ the door and looking @ the people come in..... Everytime the door opens the Chimes sound.......Carmela walks in, Chimes, AJ walks in Chimes, this when Meadows parallel parking, still trying to get inside the restaurant....
at this point the camera switches back to the trucker who goes in the bathroom...... Then it goes to a scene where meadow finally parks and starts running in the diner.... the doors about to open, Tony looks up....
and No Chimes......................

No Music............

Everything just goes black...............

In one of the early episodes of the sopranos, tonys talking with bobby about what it must feel like to die.. Bobby says "at the end, you probably dont hear anything, everything just goes black" part of that was revisited in the second to last episode during the last seconds of it, when tonys about to go to sleep and he flashes back to the memory of him and bobby on the boat... "You probably dont hear anything everything just goes black"

so in the end, the Journey song was playing, the chimes on the door sounded but when meadow came in, the guy in the trucker hat came out and killed tony...

its the reason you aint hear, or see ***** when he died.... it was from his perspective.... and everything went black, then the credits rolled.

my thoughts exactly....very smart ending....its like you read me and my friends minds....one of the best endings ive seen.

 

[conan69]

Yea hitmen usually sit down, order coffee, leave fingerprints everywhere and linger around so everyone can get a good look at his face.

And the black guys must have been the sons of the surviving would be assassin, since they looked about 18 and that assassination attempt was 9 years ago.



Please.

 

[Dark Donnie]

Yea hitmen usually sit down, order coffee, leave fingerprints everywhere and linger around so everyone can get a good look at his face.

And the black guys must have been the sons of the surviving would be assassin, since they looked about 18 and that assassination attempt was 9 years ago.



Please.

Exactly, but it doesn't change the fact that TOny killed one of the assasins as well

 

[blind_fury]

Yea hitmen usually sit down, order coffee, leave fingerprints everywhere and linger around so everyone can get a good look at his face.

And the black guys must have been the sons of the surviving would be assassin, since they looked about 18 and that assassination attempt was 9 years ago.



Please.

So the scene was just the family eating onion rings? We weren't supposed to fear for Tony Sopranos safety?

Then why show Meadow having trouble parking. Why show a guy look at Tony then head to the bathroom just like "the Godfather"?

The scene was supposed to build up tension and paranoia. If you felt no tension then you missed the point of the scene.

 

[Dark Donnie]

So the scene was just the family eating onion rings? We weren't supposed to fear for Tony Sopranos safety?

Then why show Meadow having trouble parking. Why show a guy look at Tony then head to the bathroom just like "the Godfather"?

The scene was supposed to build up tension and paranoia. If you felt no tension then you missed the point of the scene.

The point of the scene was to show us how Tony lives each and everyday...analyzing every single person to tell if there a threat.

As for the Godfather reference granted its there but still pointless why would he go to the bathroom to get a gun? In the movie he gets patted down by the cop.

 

[blind_fury]

The point of the scene was to show us how Tony lives each and everyday...analyzing every single person to tell if there a threat.

As for the Godfather reference granted its there but still pointless why would he go to the bathroom to get a gun? In the movie he gets patted down by the cop.

He looks at Tony then goes to the bathroom.

It's enough to make anyone who's seen the Godfather nervous.

When I saw the guy go to the bathroom I was on the tip of seat. I wasn't thinking, "hey in the Godfather he was padded down first". So the scene works.

It's wasn't pointless. It was paying homage to the Godfather and creates a great deal of tension at the same time.

 

[conan69]

"So the scene was just the family eating onion rings? We weren't supposed to fear for Tony Sopranos safety?

Then why show Meadow having trouble parking. Why show a guy look at Tony then head to the bathroom just like "the Godfather"?

The scene was supposed to build up tension and paranoia. If you felt no tension then you missed the point of the scene."


NO you did. Because it was a play on our expectations! Yes you were supposed to fear for Tonys safety. Tony is always afraid for his safety. Every italian stranger, every black guy he doesnt know is a possible killer. And thats the point. That will he go through his life feeling that way. He will nevr find peace. He will always be worried baout whos out to get him. He will always be depressed,etc

The show was always about Tony balancing out his 2 families. So whats he doing while one of his Capos is turning evidence and preparing to testify against him. Hes having dinner with his family. Family life is why these guys do what they do. Tony has said it many times they do what they do to provide for their familes.

You have NO proof the guy was looking at Tony. YOU JUST THINK HE WAS. And thats the point! Once again this is playing with your expectations - which is what Chase wanted and you fell for it.

Yes the scene built up tension and paranoia. So did alot of the coming attractions to next weeks epsiode only to find out it was about Tonys fathers gumare,a whole episode of Tony dreaming,etc.
How many times during season5 did you when Tony was having problems with Johnny Sack did you think that a war with NY was coming?? And the previews hightened your expectations for that. And guess what - IT NEVER HAPPENED (until the last 2 episodes of the shows run). How long was everyone waiting for the russian to return? Never happened.


Your the one missing the point.

And how much clearer does it have o be fore you - you have Chase and the guy who was assured Tony isnt killed when his music is used both saying the same thing - Tony doesnt die.

If you wont take our word it, take theirs.

Accept it instead of insisting on theories of 1/2 assed assassins(one of whos dead) whove been waiting around for 9 years.

As for "So the scene was just the family eating onion rings?"

Remember how season 1 ended? How about 3? With family gatherings around food.

Sorry if Im sounding harsh, but when I heard this theory going around the first thing I thought of was "Thats completely stupid" And i dont understand how people can actually believe such a ridiculous theory. What show have they been watching the past 9 years? Id expect that ending in a comic book not The Sopranos.

 

[Dark Donnie]

He looks at Tony then goes to the bathroom.

It's enough to make anyone who's seen the Godfather nervous.

When I saw the guy go to the bathroom I was on the tip of seat. I wasn't thinking, "hey in the Godfather he was padded down first". So the scene works.

It's wasn't pointless. It was paying homage to the Godfather and creates a great deal of tension at the same time.

I completely agree that the tension rose as he got up and walked towards him. I as well was on the tip of my seat as well....that's why the scene works. But I don't get why he would go into the bathroom then come out and shoot him. I don't think it makes sense that "Members Only" shot Tony.