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Discussion in 'Game of Thrones' started by a user, Aug 26, 2020.
I think part of my overall disappointment started when the show botched the AFFC/ADWD storylines in seasons 5/6.
But I’m also kind of fascinated in a horrible way of how/why they included what they did and how the thought process of that adaptation worked. Because the show versions of the Martells and Greyjoys...well, yeah...
HEY NOW! Winds is gonna come out eventually. Dream? (Assuming he can actually keep the ending contained to two books) Well, Dream is far less likely, but I like to think that once he gets everyone back to Westeros it will be easier to finish.
Yep. I could write a freaking thesis about everything that went wrong with the Martells and Greyjoys. I feel so bad for the Dorne cast especially. Some wildly talented actors who got wasted (Alexander Siddig, Jessica Henwick, DeObia Oparei, Kiesha Castle-Hughes) and then the young POC who lost the chance to break out their careers as Arianne, Quentyn or Alleras/Sarella.
The show might have actually been improved with the addition of the missing Greyjoy and Martell characters from the books. The addition of those characters also could have stretched seasons 7 & 8 to 10 episodes each with extended storylines but Benioff and Weiss were in a mad rush to the finish line so it is what it is.
Also, this coming Monday will be ten years to the day since A Dance with Dragons was published. A whole decade of procrastination!
At the very least sticking to the source would have improved the 5th and 6th season, since they were always pretty good when they directly adapted the novels. It was their original content that struggled (outside of individual scenes of dialogue like Varys/Littlefinger, Robert/Cersei).
And you know what's REALLY crazy? It will have been 6 years since that Conan sketch came out. And 4 years since a major Hollywood movie (Logan Lucky) included an extended gag about how TWOW still hadn't been released. And most insane - 10 years and a month since 'Leviathan Wakes' came out, which means George's assistants have written an entire series AND had it adapted into a television show within the time its taken for him to write TWOW
I think the added stress of the show took the wind(s of winter) out of GRRM's sails. He was clearly discouraged about the decision for the show to move past the books but I can't really blame HBO/D&D for that because of all the lost revenue that would have come from the show taking a very extended hiatus after season 5.
Alexander Siddig as Doran was genuinely one of the things I was most excited about seeing and...while he was predictably good, the role itself was really cut down and morphed without Arianne to play off.
I still can't get over his death scene. Like, a lot of the changes they made make logical sense within what they were doing in the show. But there was no reason to not just have Doran reveal his plan to the Sand Snakes and back Daenerys. Instead, they decide to end his story with the exact opposite of where it goes in the books. Show Doran is never more than meets the eye, his disability and concern for peace are ruled as literally making him "weak" and therefore unfit to rule. It feels like willfully spitting in the eye of the source.
Yeah I definitely get a sense of, well, contempt for the source material at times. Certain characters really seem like they’re attacked or undercut by D&D.
And I recall ages back it came out that they often changed their minds quite a bit with what characters they were going to include. The Greyjoys return in season 6 was evidently a late thing that they debated doing.
While I definitely felt like they got full of themselves, I think it was less contempt and more not realizing how to adapt past season 4. That was their goal. To adapt ASOS. One they did that, they didn't seem to care.
Also overall, any attempt at condensing or changing material feels like they don't know what is and isn't important. You get a lot of this with Jon beyond the Wall or Dany season 2 and 5 material. This is before we get into how they handle characters like Stannis, Barristan, all the Greyjoys, and many others.
The whole Sansa issue as well....
Once I started reading the books, it was truly amazing just how much they undermine Sansa's agency from the very beginning. In the books, she's an active participant in her escape from King's Landing. In the show, she just gets dragged off at the last minute. Even things as small as making her just flop around helplessly when Lysa is trying to kill her, instead of fighting back, as she does in the books.
And that's all before getting to the Ramsay disaster
I think I blocked that from my memory.
It’s why I’m not really inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt about anything with this show.
I still really want to know whether they really did intend to adapt the Vale storyline when they shot that final scene of Season 4 and just changed their mind later. Or had they already made their decision but not told Condal? Or was the whole thing just a massively cruel "prank" on Sophie Turner to tell her she was going to get a love interest and learn to play the game like Littlefinger in the next season?
They ran the show so haphazardly and were so petty to the cast that any of the above seem equally possible answers.
Except for individual sequences (The Mountain and the Viper, Hardhome, Red Wedding, the Hound vs. Brienne, the Cercei-Dany summit, Hold the Door, etc.), not very well.
I tend to almost pretend "A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms" is the last episode and if I do, then the series holds up very well. However I still don't think the entire final season tarnishes the whole series for me. I only think Jaime's arc gets hurt a bit with his actions and some of his dialogue in his last 2 episodes but I still will always have love for the series.
I genuinely hope the new prequel series will unite the fandom again.