Is Thunderbolts a scam?

[littleredhat]

Anyone who's read the last two issues of Thunderbolts can see that the team isn't very effective.

But they are also not being pushed to improve. They seem more focused on selling their image than actually doing thier job.

Why is this?

My thoughts. Its all a scam. Somone saw all the fat government checks that the government was handing out for the SRA and FSI and wanted a cut.So they take a well known but defunct team,fill it up with villians no one will really miss,promise them a big payday,and put a con woman and a mentally ill man in charge.

You don't train them. It doesn't matter how effective they are.

Instead you hype up and merchendise the hell out of them getting as much money as you can out off them.

Then when they've reached thier peak you arrange an "accident". Tragedy sells and now you don't have to pay them. Then you bring out the new "team" that you started picking even before the first one went on it's first mission.

I bet they already have the Doctor Octopus toys stocked and ready.


Someone very corrupt is going to get alot of money.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Tony Stark likes money. And he organized the new--sorry, the new new--T-bolts. And he's corrupt. You may have something there.

 

[Darthphere]

Its a scam, because somehow Marvel is getting people to buy such a crappy comic.

 

[Willowhugger]

I think the point is that the Thunderbolts are a group of psychopaths and self centered lunatics so the idea that they could work together as a team is just ridiculous.

Seriously, you honestly think its possible for BULLSEYE to work as a team?

Songbird can't trust these people and there's a reason. BECAUSE THEY CAN'T BE TRUSTED.

 

[PhotoJones]

Its a scam, because somehow Marvel is getting people to buy such a crappy comic.

word up, man.

 

[Willowhugger]

hey, I like the Thunderbolts new version.

I just want less Osbourne, more Songbird.

 

[Artistsean]

I don't know if it is a scam now, might be. But I do see some possible outcomes:
The techno virus thing that is meant to control them suddenly doesn't work (maybe because Osborne cured them or something.)
and/or
The team breaks free of its control and goes an a rampage, making their government employers looks horrible.
I also see the scam you are pointing out, happening. It is possible.

In any event I don't see it ending well at all, to have such evil and horrible psychopaths working as a hero team for the government, not smart at all.


By the way, I haven't read it yet so I am not sure about this, doesn't the public already know who they are? How can they work as heroes?
How can Green Goblin and Venom work as heroes and be advertised as such? I mean do they have new super hero identities?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

No, they have the same identities. The populace of Marvel's United States are just that stupid.

 

[Willowhugger]

Well the Green Goblin has Lex Luthor's publicist. I.e. He denies he was ever the Green Goblin and that he was framed.

Everything was Spiderman's fault!

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Wasn't the first arc of The Pulse all about how Norman was proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, to be the Green Goblin with some iron-clad evidence?

 

[Willowhugger]

Wasn't the first arc of The Pulse all about how Norman was proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, to be the Green Goblin with some iron-clad evidence?

Specifically, Norman Osbourne exploded out of the limousine while he was in not wearing his costume. He then proceeded to get beaten up by Luke Cage despite the fact that he was throwing pumpkin bombs.

In other words, yes. Pretty damning evidence. There's also the fact that people believed he was the Green Goblin for about a decade in Spiderman time anyway.

So, no, it makes no sense whatsoever but it's not like the people HAVE to believe it. It's only that the LAW has to.

I think Quesada said that Norman Osbourne is equivalent to an Enron executive in Washington D.C. right now. He's so disgustingly rich that it doesn't matter that he's guilty as sin and everyone knows it, they still let him do what he wants.

He also compared his public image to people like Michael Jackson and OJ Simpson.

 

[Sebastos]

Its a scam, because somehow Marvel is getting people to buy such a crappy comic.

Mr. Darthphere is right!

 

[Tropico]

If it doesn't say that he's the Green Goblin in Myspace then he isn't. Because, y'know, that's the way America rolls now.

 

[Red Mask]

I thought Freedom Force was a bad group. This one is worse.

 

[Willowhugger]

I think the idea behind the comic is to illustrate how utterly corrupt and loathsome the Marvel government really is. The government thinks that by paying these criminals enough money and wielding a big enough stick, that they can manufacture the heroes that came naturally to the world.

That, of course, utterly misses the point and makes it a wonderful contrast to the REAL heroes. It also shows why the TRUE Thunderbolts were honest people versus these guys using their name.

 

[Tropico]

I think the idea behind the comic is to illustrate how utterly corrupt and loathsome the Marvel government really is. The government thinks that by paying these criminals enough money and wielding a big enough stick, that they can manufacture the heroes that came naturally to the world.

That, of course, utterly misses the point and makes it a wonderful contrast to the REAL heroes. It also shows why the TRUE Thunderbolts were honest people versus these guys using their name.

The funny thing is that the "true" Thunderbolts weren't that honest. Even Songbird was duplicitous before the title got re-made. Moonstone is acting like a heinous b!t¢h/**** and she's been with the team from the start. Beetle/MACH IV was pretty shady for a while after finding "redemption". And so on and so forth. You're aware that they were villains playing the role of heroes so they could take over the world, right? But I guess what you mean is that at least these other villains were actually seeking redemption as opposed to working off their sentence like the new New Thunderbolts.

 

[Willowhugger]

The funny thing is that the "true" Thunderbolts weren't that honest. Even Songbird was duplicitous before the title got re-made. Moonstone is acting like a heinous b!t¢h/**** and she's been with the team from the start. Beetle/MACH IV was pretty shady for a while after finding "redemption". And so on and so forth.

You're aware that they were villains playing the role of heroes so they could take over the world, right? But I guess what you mean is that at least these other villains were actually seeking redemption as opposed to working off their sentence like the new New Thunderbolts.

I read Thunderbolts from issue 1# (oddly, I was about ready to ditch Marvel after the Onslaught saga)

Yeah, you can't seriously have a story about the Thunderbolts as "crimminals seeking redemption" in the same way that you have Azrael as Batman or US Agent as Captain America. The Thunderbolts were thieves at their best and often very self centered/greedy people. Nevertheless, their hearts were in the right place (for the most part). It made moments like Atlas beating Captain Mar-vell to near-death all the more powerful.

In many ways, the New New Thunderbolts seems like a reverse of the Thunderbolts manifesto. Instead of "criminals seeking redemption" with society against them and refusing to pardon them. Songbird and the rest of the Toyetic folk on the team are ostenibly beloved by the public.

But the fact is that you have guys who would as soon kill you as look at you.

 

[Tropico]

I read Thunderbolts from issue 1# (oddly, I was about ready to ditch Marvel after the Onslaught saga)

Yeah, you can't seriously have a story about the Thunderbolts as "crimminals seeking redemption" in the same way that you have Azrael as Batman or US Agent as Captain America. The Thunderbolts were thieves at their best and often very self centered/greedy people. Nevertheless, their hearts were in the right place (for the most part). It made moments like Atlas beating Captain Mar-vell to near-death all the more powerful.

In many ways, the New New Thunderbolts seems like a reverse of the Thunderbolts manifesto. Instead of "criminals seeking redemption" with society against them and refusing to pardon them. Songbird and the rest of the Toyetic folk on the team are ostenibly beloved by the public.

But the fact is that you have guys who would as soon kill you as look at you.

You know what character I was thinking about a couple of weeks back? Jolt. To me, she will always be the one that turned the team around. Even though some of the "oldbies" of the team have enough of a "good streak" in them after she left it has never felt the same without her. Of course, she'd get massacred if she was in the team right now. But it just struck me how different the team, and even Marvel, was back then.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Its a scam, because somehow Marvel is getting people to buy such a crappy comic.

I don't think that Thunderbolts is a badly written comic. It's problem is that it completely bastardizes the concept of the Thunderbolts by turning them into a psychotic rip-off of the Suicide Squad.

And there is nothing worse that you can do to a concept or character than bastardizing them.

 

[Willowhugger]

You know what character I was thinking about a couple of weeks back? Jolt. To me, she will always be the one that turned the team around. Even though some of the "oldbies" of the team have enough of a "good streak" in them after she left it has never felt the same without her. Of course, she'd get massacred if she was in the team right now. But it just struck me how different the team, and even Marvel, was back then.

Yeah, the whole fun dynamic of Jolt was (even when she knew that they were ex-villains) she was under the impression that she was a superhero and they should all fight for GOOD because GOOD IS GOOD.

The current line up would eat/kill/rape her. Osbourne might have her bear kids in France to avenge himself against Spiderman.

But I'd love to see a "Mighty Thunderbolts" with her and Mach IV back in action.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Shouldn't he be up to Mach IX by now?

A Mighty Thunderbolts would be great. Have Baron Zemo lead them again and get Atlas back on there as well, and you'd be set.

 

[Willowhugger]

Yeah, though I hope that Baron Zemo returns once more as a villain. Oddly, the nicer they make him, the better a villain I think he is. He works for me more when he utterly seems to miss how much everyone despises him on his own team and distrusts his motives.

But yeah, while I'm loving the Suicide Squad version of the Thunderbolts. I don't think it can last very long.