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Ken Ham vs Bill Nye (Is creation a viable model of origins?)

So you believe that we as a race are born of incest and that the Bible supports incest? Gross. I am sure the Creationist model takes into account the non existent gene pool of the human race.

We get our morals from god. So if he says incest is ok, it’s ok. And if he changes his mind later, well... His sandbox, his rules.

Also: genetic problems due to inbreeding would be non-existent at the time. God has superpowers. :cwink:
 
I suppose Peace Warrior believes that written Hebrew predates Cuneiform, as well?
 
Ken Ham because it's not like virtually every University/Bioscience institute supports Evolution.

Oh wait they actually do....
 
I really don't understand how someone can think these things in a world with... electricity.

This is just some radical miseducation.

It boggles the mind. Evolution is false, and all languages came about because.... God got upset about people building a great big tower.

I never realized that creationists would deny the evolution of language as well.
 
I really don't understand how someone can think these things in a world with... electricity.

This is just some radical miseducation.

It boggles the mind. Evolution is false, and all languages came about because.... God got upset about people building a great big tower.

I never realized that creationists would deny the evolution of language as well.

They take it literally...all of it. I work for a man who believes sincerely that dinosaurs are a hoax. All dinosaur bones. The only kind he believes in are the leviathen and the behemoth mentioned in the bible. If it isnt in the bible he doesnt believe it. That goes for everything.

My old doctrines teacher used to tell us it was all or nothing. The biblrnisbeither all true or all false. Incredibly narrow minded man.
 
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But why the hell would you do that? Even in the Dark Ages, most knew to take it with a grain of salt.

I mean, it's one thing to take the... commands seriously, i.e. "kill so and so for this and that", but even in the Middle Ages, they understood what parables were.
 
But why the hell would you do that? Even in the Dark Ages, most knew to take it with a grain of salt.

I mean, it's one thing to take the... commands seriously, i.e. "kill so and so for this and that", but even in the Middle Ages, they understood what parables were.

My doctrines teacher used to tell us:

"The bible tells us that it is the word of god. If it is a parable or allegory or metaphor god would have told us. These stories like the tower of babel and noah's ark say no such thing about them being parables so we should take them literally. And who are we to decide what is literal or not? Do we take that decision into our own hands? That opens the door for error."

And my fellow students ate this **** right up. This kind of stuff is really being taught in private schools. Only me and a handful of others called BS on it.
 
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I still don't see how you can take them literally.

I can understand some pretty strange mind sets, but this takes the cake.

I don't even think this is a religious thing per se. That level of cognitive dissonance must be something mental.
 
I still don't see how you can take them literally.

I can understand some pretty strange mind sets, but this takes the cake.

I don't even think this is a religious thing per se. That level of cognitive dissonance must be something mental.

Nah they were sain they were just heavily indoctrinated.

There is a scientist mentioned by Dawkins in his God Delusion book. The scientist had a PHD and everything and converted to fundamentalism chilristianity late in his career and walked away from his career. He said he knew the facts of physics and biology, but couldnt reconcile them with the Bible. As a christian who was faithful to god he would always choose god and the bible regardless of what the facts of the universe were.

For some thats what it comes down to. They trust god so much that they will always take his word over science regardless of the compelling evidence of science.
 
I still don't see how you can take them literally.

I can understand some pretty strange mind sets, but this takes the cake.

I don't even think this is a religious thing per se. That level of cognitive dissonance must be something mental.

I was once told I should read a book about the "truth." The book had a 10 page warning about how Satan was going to trick me into not reading this book with spells to make me fall asleep and not understand the text, and whatever.

Turns out it was just a really boring book.
 
I still think it requires a certain kind of mentality only some people have to take a book literally.

No matter what culture, some people are just going to be atheists, some people are going to be religious... and some people are going to be young Earth creationists.
 
I was once told I should read a book about the "truth." The book had a 10 page warning about how Satan was going to trick me into not reading this book with spells to make me fall asleep and not understand the text, and whatever.

Turns out it was just a really boring book.

I wish more people would read the bible. The Easiest way to make somebody atheist is have them read the bible. Once you read the Old testament you will realize there is tons of contradictions and God really isn't that loving, problem is most people get spoonfeed the bible from their pastor

I think their is a reason the Roman Catholic Church made owning a bible a burnable at the stake offense, they basically didn't want the followers to realize what a load of crap it was.
 
Well that, and it would make every single person as much an authority as the priests. Sola scriptura and all that.
 
Well that, and it would make every single person as much an authority as the priests. Sola scriptura and all that.

Yep. The catholic church wanted to tell people what they should believe. If everyone has access to the bible then youve got a bunch of different people believing different things and starting little off shoots and small denominations...pretty much whats been happening more and more for the past 500 years.
 
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Yep. The catholic church wanted to tell people what they should believe. If everyone has access to the bible then youve got a bunch of different people believing different things and starting little off shoots and small denominations...pretty much whats been happening more and more for the past 500 years.

Pretty much what Christianity and the Bible was until Constantine compiled and funneled it into a more convenient singular package.
 
Pretty much what Christianity and the Bible was until Constantine compiled and funneled it into a more convenient singular package.

Personally I prefer a singular package. Keeps things neat and tidy. With all these off shoots running around you never know what to expect. Anymore, I only pay attention to the Catholic Church and the Greek Orthydox. The rest I just file under cults.
 
Personally I prefer a singular package. Keeps things neat and tidy. With all these off shoots running around you never know what to expect. Anymore, I only pay attention to the Catholic Church and the Greek Orthydox. The rest I just file under cults.

Those clever Romans....the ones who killed the Messiah were ironically the ones who eventually streamlined the faith. Funny how these things work out.
 
Personally I prefer a singular package. Keeps things neat and tidy. With all these off shoots running around you never know what to expect. Anymore, I only pay attention to the Catholic Church and the Greek Orthydox. The rest I just file under cults.

Quite honestly the only differences between a religion and a cult are time, size and tax breaks.
 
Quite honestly the only differences between a religion and a cult are time, size and tax breaks.

If Lucas opened Jedi Temples all over the US, and sold votive Yoda candles, books with Yoda'isms, Jedi robes, offered Jedi mind control and force balance lessons, and other merch and training, could he do it tax free?
 
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If Lucas opened Jedi Temples all over the US, and sold votive Yoda candles, books with Yoda'isms, Jedi robes, offered Jedi mind control lessons, and other merch and training, could he do it tax free?

Maybe...but he'd sure as hell take all your money.
 
If you and or you're sources have dated the Sumerian references by way of the "King's Lists'" (e.g., The Egyptian Kings' list versus/compared to the Sumerian Kings' list.) then that may explain the error in your personal studies/research. You see, when making the lists noting the genealogies, and more importantly the duration of reigns for individual kings, a lot of times the reigns overlapped one another, and yet they were listed as occurring sequentially.

A simple way to explain this is to use an example from the history of America. We both of course know that we've been around as a nation since 1776, which means America has been a nation for ~238 years; however, let's say the only records we had were today were records of the governors' terms of office from Georgia and from Virginia since we were founded in 1776.

If we listed those terms of office from both Georgia and Virginia sequentially, instead of how they actually occurred, which was concurrently, we could extrapolate an age of over 450 years for the nation of America. We'd be wrong, but if all we had were the durations of each respective governors' term of office, "we would believe we were right in our wrongness."

IMHO, if the ~3000 year age your referring to comes from extrapolations based on using the Kings' Lists, then they are in error due to how the record keeping was done back then. As far as the Holy Bible's record is concerned, the languages were divided sometime between the Flood account and the details concerning Abram (whom became Abraham) being recorded in the book of Genesis. Since the Flood occurred ~4,450 years ago, based on extrapolating the years from the genealogies listed, according to the Holy Bible the Hebrew language has existed since the Creation event, or ~6,000 years ago.


-PW

The important part here is 'If' there was a massive flood event centuries ago. There are records in various places about floods in various areas and some some were extreme flooding but there is very little evidence that would show a total global flood at any time, unless it's going much further back and they mean the Ice Age which was a flood event, just with a solid instead of a liquid. Otherwise it's just various records which fail to show a complete picture and a story in the holy books.


Also Kal, I'm not sure if it's an accident or just a Freudian slip but every now and then you write Bible as Bile. :p
 
Purely a typo...and one I apologize for. :csad:
 
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Maybe...but he'd sure as hell take all your money.

Well no kidding, that's my point, what would be the difference between what he'd be doing and those others who get tax breaks.

Or you mean me personally? Yeah I'd probably buy an official Yoda candle:oldrazz:
 
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