The Last Jedi Luke Skywalker's role in "The Last Jedi": Did you like it?

Sorry it left you with blue balls (checking)....nope. Whew....

You better be checking youand not me there, buddy. :o :p

OK....so I should ignore this?

:huh:

You mean parts where I said "OT style or something"-- rather than PT CGI as you seem to have taken from it-- and "kind of thing people have been dreaming of"-- rather than the exact thing literally everybody has been dreaming of as you seem to have taken from it...
 
...

I would've been happier with the Crait fight if it didn't TELL us he was about to fight (by activating the 'saber) and then having him dodge/stand there awkwardly with it before turning it back off. It may make sense in universe (but there's a better way to do that, too), but it simply communicates the wrong thing to the audience. Just have him stand there/dodge/Force stuff while totally unarmed, and that frustrates and humiliates Kylo even further... And it doesn't give the wrong idea to the audience and leave us with blue balls.

That's another part of it that I find so frustrating-- there was a better version of the scene right there.

Same with the way fake out/fade away death immediately followed by a real fade away death. Just a bizarre bit of timing.

Sorry it left you with blue balls (checking)....nope. Whew....

You better be checking youand not me there, buddy. :o :p

I was....unless you were somewhere I really didn't want you to be.

I just wanted to make sure "us" didn't include me. Sorry for your affliction.
 
Last edited:
I'm so glad they avoided all the derivative, cliché badass Luke moments that some of you propose and gave us this. Much more interesting.
 
I'm so glad they avoided all the derivative, cliché badass Luke moments that some of you propose and gave us this. Much more interesting.

Yup. I actually appreciate that Luke didn't just come in there and start attacking everyone at the end, and acted like a badass or something. Instead of a Luke / Kylo Ren fight, we got a more spiritual response, which was nice.
 
We don't propose badass Luke moments, we want writing that makes sense.

3 Lessons... or was it 1, oh I'm scared of this power. J/k, here's lesson 2 like a split second later. What's lesson 3?

Is he using the force again when he sees Rey and Kylo touch fingers - I thought he cut himself off from the force. Huh.

Luke having a moment of darkness is interesting - but we get like 10 seconds of flashback, and that's it... so under used.

Luke cutting himself off from the force is interesting, but it's not explored - like in KOTOR 2, and he comes back.

Luke saying Jedi must die is interesting -- but he goes back on that, and says we have one more Jedi after all! Undercutting his previous lectures for 90% of the film.

Luke sensing darkness in Rey, and the mirror scene could have been interesting if it was about some sort of grey-balance, but appears totally unaddressed. Some fun throw away dialog. She goes to the darkness in lesson 1, plays hall of mirrors and learns nothing, and then never addressed.

We don't need Luke running in like rambo, we just need some decent writing.
 
Lesson 3 was cut from the film unfortunately. Apparently the lesson was something akin to the Resistance needing brave people who will run toward danger without thinking and not a hokey Jedi Order or old fogey like him.

Apparently the scene made Luke Skywalker look like too much of a jerk, and the movie was already running at over 2 and a half hours. Not saying I approve of the cut, but they did film the third lesson. I think it is problematic that wasn't thought out better.
 
We don't propose badass Luke moments, we want writing that makes sense.

3 Lessons... or was it 1, oh I'm scared of this power. J/k, here's lesson 2 like a split second later. What's lesson 3?

Is he using the force again when he sees Rey and Kylo touch fingers - I thought he cut himself off from the force. Huh.

Luke having a moment of darkness is interesting - but we get like 10 seconds of flashback, and that's it... so under used.

Luke cutting himself off from the force is interesting, but it's not explored - like in KOTOR 2, and he comes back.

Luke saying Jedi must die is interesting -- but he goes back on that, and says we have one more Jedi after all! Undercutting his previous lectures for 90% of the film.

Luke sensing darkness in Rey, and the mirror scene could have been interesting if it was about some sort of grey-balance, but appears totally unaddressed. Some fun throw away dialog. She goes to the darkness in lesson 1, plays hall of mirrors and learns nothing, and then never addressed.

We don't need Luke running in like rambo, we just need some decent writing.

I think some of those, especially Luke going back on his decision to cut back the "Jedi must die" line of thinking can probably be explained by Luke's experiences throughout the film, some of which were probably deleted from the film, or written out at the last minute. I actually bought it myself.
 
I woulda loved for Return of the Mack to be playing when Luke appeared in front of Kylo Ren the ATAT's , but that's just me. :mnm:
 
We don't propose badass Luke moments, we want writing that makes sense.

3 Lessons... or was it 1, oh I'm scared of this power. J/k, here's lesson 2 like a split second later. What's lesson 3?

As stated cut for time. Also it could be argued that it ties into the way Rey thinks she can simply recreate what Luke did with Vader in regards to Kylo. While Rey is not aware of the intimate details I think it's easy to see the parallels with Luke being headstrong and leaving Yoda to confront Vader to save Han, Leia, Chewie and Threepio. Rey assumes the outcome of her trying to turn Ben will go the same way, not heeding Luke's advice that it's not going to go the way she thinks.

Is he using the force again when he sees Rey and Kylo touch fingers - I thought he cut himself off from the force. Huh.

Pay attention to the film I say. He re-connects with the Force to reach out to Leia in a previous scene. The movie lampshades this when Kylo and Rey have contact when Rey is in Luke's presence and because he has cut himself off he isn't aware. Then he reaches out to Leia, re-establishing his Force abilities and thus, now able to "see" the contact Rey and Kylo are having.

Luke having a moment of darkness is interesting - but we get like 10 seconds of flashback, and that's it... so under used.

It was established in TFA Luke walked away because of guilt. In TLJ we get the reasons behind it. We get multiple scenes of POV's on the moment and the reveal plays into the themes of failure, hero worship, self recrimination, buying into one's own reputation and self forgiveness so one can move on. And this is how real life is for a lot of people. Maybe it seems small from the outside but to an individual even momentary failure can, bluntly, **** you in Thebes head. With Luke it's a bit more complex still. He struggled as he did in the Emperor's throne room with something terrible and again fought back but instead of being rewarded the universe let it blow up in his face. That momentary weakness shattered his self image, and the fallout riddled him with guilt and self doubt.

Luke cutting himself off from the force is interesting, but it's not explored - like in KOTOR 2, and he comes back.

Uh... Of course he was going to save the bacon at the end. I mean... Yeah.

Luke saying Jedi must die is interesting -- but he goes back on that, and says we have one more Jedi after all! Undercutting his previous lectures for 90% of the film.

Again... Duh. He was in a different mindset at the end then when we first met him in TLJ. It's called an arc.

Luke sensing darkness in Rey, and the mirror scene could have been interesting if it was about some sort of grey-balance, but appears totally unaddressed. Some fun throw away dialog. She goes to the darkness in lesson 1, plays hall of mirrors and learns nothing, and then never addressed.

She learns that her parents, which TFA established she was obsessed with, don't matter. We learn her lineage doesn't matter. That snap moment shows to me that all her actions even in infinite variables all come down to her. Luke's lessons include telling Rey that the totality of the Force, Dark, light and inbetween, don't belong to, or reside in the Jedi or Sith exclusively. And it's certainly addressed by Kylo who uses Rey's feelings after her experience to try to deepen their connection, for as we learn, his own selfish ends.

We don't need Luke running in like rambo, we just need some decent writing.

That's my take.
 
I don't disagree with any of that per se, only that parallels and subtle transitions felt ineffective and that if they just expanded, pulled on the threads a little more, on any of the concepts a little more it would have felt really great.

For example, exposition and POVs on the spectacle is ok - I get it. But why not show a little more of the post rubble, screaming in the rain, talk to R2 in the rain, arriving at the island, showing him cutting himself off from the force through flashback or force imagery and not exposition? Even have him wince in pain in the very beginning on how he is wounded and disconnected from the force instead of a joke of throwing the lightsaber.

I get the cave scene, but it didn't feel aligned with the pull of the darkside as described, and literally feared by Luke in the previous scene. Don't call it a darkside place, just call it a challenge or literally anything else. At best, I could convince myself that the focus on the self aligns with the sith code and maybe that's a darkside-ish thing, but that's far fetched.

The arc of changing his mind on the Jedi also feels inconsistent with the burn down the past message. It's basically the movie screaming at us to forget the past and move forward, but then undercuts itself with - we have more Jedi. Literally anymore dialog here about "a new Jedi, focused on..." or something along that rather than "jk, we're doing it all over again!". I wanted growth of "not the old Jedi, but a new" since he already described how the old Jedi was a giant failure. If his arc is "I was wrong, let's do more Jedi" that's a weak role for him. If it's "I transcend the jedi dogma, she will carry on a new..." that's compelling.
 
I woulda loved for Return of the Mack to be playing when Luke appeared in front of Kylo Ren the ATAT's , but that's just me. :mnm:

:funny:
 
I'm so glad they avoided all the derivative, cliché badass Luke moments that some of you propose and gave us this. Much more interesting.

They remade the rebel escape from Hoth, the imperial assault on Hoth (complete with huge four legged creatures vs small speeders on a white planet), a Falcon vs Tie Fighter chase that's not only from the OT but even from TFA, the throne room scene with the new Luke facing new Vader and new Sidious with a view of how her friends are about to die (complete with new Vader killing new Sidious), etc, etc.

Yeah, they really avoided all the derivative stuff in TLJ... :whatever:
 
Luke being a hermit and doing the "if you strike me down..." thing was really cliché as well
 
They remade the rebel escape from Hoth, the imperial assault on Hoth (complete with huge four legged creatures vs small speeders on a white planet), a Falcon vs Tie Fighter chase that's not only from the OT but even from TFA, the throne room scene with the new Luke facing new Vader and new Sidious with a view of how her friends are about to die (complete with new Vader killing new Sidious), etc, etc.

Yeah, they really avoided all the derivative stuff in TLJ... :whatever:



Jesus Christ... :o

You'd all be funny if you weren't so exasperating.
 
Stuff that's happened once before, in 1977, with an actual emotional resonance for this particular character and his history, is cliche now, remember?

'Cause the internet.
 
Yup. I actually appreciate that Luke didn't just come in there and start attacking everyone at the end, and acted like a badass or something. Instead of a Luke / Kylo Ren fight, we got a more spiritual response, which was nice.
He could have done both, a characteristic of Star Wars I think.
 
I was hoping that he was a projection, because of his entrance and the fact I was hoping Luke didn't stop to get his hair dyed before saving the day. But the movie had already made so many poor decisions that I wouldn't necessarily be surprised at that point.

The AT-AT portion of the scene all but confirmed he wasn't there. But still--WHY activate the 'saber? Why TELL the audience there's going to be a fight and then not deliver? Why break Chekhov's Gun? Just remove the 'saber* from the scene, it instantly becomes better.

To me the fact that it was a blue saber and not his green one solidified my hunch that he wasn't there. I think that reads as another clue. Same with how Kylo leaves the red mineral trail with his footsteps, while they make sure to show that Luke does not. They played pretty fair with the audience there.

The saber makes sense in the context of the scene, he wants to go as long as possible with his distraction without Ben realizing he's a projection. Plus, we still get to see Luke Skywalker staring down Kylo Ren samurai style with his blade drawn. That visual justifies itself, even if the sabers never actually clash. It's not really a Chekhov's gun, if anything Force projections are in this film since it's introduced early in the film.

I just feel like a lot of the complaints I'm seeing with this movie are "this frustrated me on my first viewing" type of complaints, which is totally understandable, but that aspect DOES lessen once you see the film multiple times and you know where it's all going. IMO, most things (not all) in this film hold up and still feel earned on subsequent viewings and the aspect of feeling like the film is just trying to mess with you goes away almost completely. I've seen the film 3 times now and I still get goosebumpy AF during that whole confrontation.

I respect your opinion of course titan, wherever you end up landing on the movie after you've seen it again.
 
To me the fact that it was a blue saber and not his green one solidified my hunch that he wasn't there. I think that reads as another clue. Same with how Kylo leaves the red mineral trail with his footsteps, while they make sure to show that Luke does not. They played pretty fair with the audience there.

The saber makes sense in the context of the scene, he wants to go as long as possible with his distraction without Ben realizing he's a projection. Plus, we still get to see Luke Skywalker staring down Kylo Ren samurai style with his blade drawn. That visual justifies itself, even if the sabers never actually clash. It's not really a Chekhov's gun, if anything Force projections are in this film since it's introduced early in the film.

I just feel like a lot of the complaints I'm seeing with this movie are "this frustrated me on my first viewing" type of complaints, which is totally understandable, but that aspect DOES lessen once you see the film multiple times and you know where it's all going. IMO, most things (not all) in this film hold up and still feel earned on subsequent viewings and the aspect of feeling like the film is just trying to mess with you goes away almost completely. I've seen the film 3 times now and I still get goosebumpy AF during that whole confrontation.

I respect your opinion of course titan, wherever you end up landing on the movie after you've seen it again.

I loved this on 1st viewing, but I agree that viewing 2 and 3 made me appreciate it even more (which is the reverse of TFA for me) :up:
 
My honest feeling about this film is a strange one. My theater applauded when it was over and I felt very satisfied by the film when it was over. My fiancée said it was her favorite Star Wars film. However, I have not had a strong desire to go see it a second time which was the complete opposite feeling I had after the Force Awakens which I saw 4 times in the theatre.
My feeling is that is due to the movie's finality. It feels like such an ending. It didn't leave a whole lot to be excited about for the next film. On the one hand I'm glad they didn't do a big obvious cliff hanger but on the other hand I am not very excited about the next movie. Just curious.
 
My honest feeling about this film is a strange one. My theater applauded when it was over and I felt very satisfied by the film when it was over. My fiancée said it was her favorite Star Wars film. However, I have not had a strong desire to go see it a second time which was the complete opposite feeling I had after the Force Awakens which I saw 4 times in the theatre.
My feeling is that is due to the movie's finality. It feels like such an ending. It didn't leave a whole lot to be excited about for the next film. On the one hand I'm glad they didn't do a big obvious cliff hanger but on the other hand I am not very excited about the next movie. Just curious.

I actually know exactly what you mean, but personally I take it as a positive.

I've been lamenting the "movies have become TV" thing a lot in the post-Marvel age, and have been feeling that in the age of post-credits scenes and universe-building, we as a culture have become so preoccupied with what might come next that it's hampered our ability to digest and sit with a lot of these big franchise films.

For me, walking out of TLJ feeling wholly satisfied and fulfilled, and not immediately excited for IX was a positive sign for me. The time will come for that. When the first teaser for IX hits, the hype will be back. Personally I'm excited by the fact that there are so many directions IX can go in, rather than it being a case of another specific cliffhanger. TFA already ended on a big cliffhanger, another one would've been even more frustrating. Now I feel like the first two films stand on their own, and there's a nice open canvas for JJ to come in and resolve the journeys of these characters and the fate of the galaxy.
 
Jesus Christ... :o

You'd all be funny if you weren't so exasperating.

What a surprise, an ad hominem argument instead of having anything to say that's actually relevant to the discussion. Thanks for helping my position, I guess.
 
I actually know exactly what you mean, but personally I take it as a positive.

I've been lamenting the "movies have become TV" thing a lot in the post-Marvel age, and have been feeling that in the age of post-credits scenes and universe-building, we as a culture have become so preoccupied with what might come next that it's hampered our ability to digest and sit with a lot of these big franchise films.

For me, walking out of TLJ feeling wholly satisfied and fulfilled, and not immediately excited for IX was a positive sign for me. The time will come for that. When the first teaser for IX hits, the hype will be back. Personally I'm excited by the fact that there are so many directions IX can go in, rather than it being a case of another specific cliffhanger. TFA already ended on a big cliffhanger, another one would've been even more frustrating. Now I feel like the first two films stand on their own, and there's a nice open canvas for JJ to come in and resolve the journeys of these characters and the fate of the galaxy.

If it's the post-Marvel age I don't really see the issue since MCU movies all tend to be complete stand-alone, with a clear conclusion to the conflict at hand. Just the thing you now say that TLJ did, although TLJ doesn't resolve the New Order vs Resistance conflict at all, so it actually does less to be standing on it's own than the average MCU movie.
 
They remade the rebel escape from Hoth, the imperial assault on Hoth (complete with huge four legged creatures vs small speeders on a white planet), a Falcon vs Tie Fighter chase that's not only from the OT but even from TFA, the throne room scene with the new Luke facing new Vader and new Sidious with a view of how her friends are about to die (complete with new Vader killing new Sidious), etc, etc.

Yeah, they really avoided all the derivative stuff in TLJ... :whatever:

:funny:
 
So it TLJ too much like the OT or too different?

You guys are all over the place.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Staff online

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
200,569
Messages
21,762,900
Members
45,597
Latest member
iamjonahlobe
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"