Action-Adventure Mission: Impossible - Dead Reckoning/The Final Reckoning

[TheVileOne]

I mean, at some point you have to accept it's a movie. They don't need to keep the government from cracking the AI code again in twenty years because it's a movie. Because the movie ended. But for all the problems they may have, I'm not sure "there's no way to defeat it" is one of them. They pretty clearly laid it out. They have a key. Key opens submarine. Code on submarine will let them win. Technical? Definitely not. Overly simple? Maybe. But they laid out the terms they're working on pretty blatantly.

Except it's not clear. We don't even know what it wants. They said they don't know. Ethan thinks its afraid. But it can literally do anything. It was hacking their earpieces. It hacks security cameras. It set up a decoy nuke for Benji.

Think about this. The Entity source code that's on Sevastopol was an EARLY COPY. So that tells me what they want to shut down is not just Sevastopol but whatever hard drives or equipment is housing the AI development software. They transmitted an EARLY COPY and that is what gained self-awareness. That means destroying the submarine is simply a half-measure.

Also, look at how powerful the Entity has become. Cary Elwes says, "I also know subsequent attempts to make the AI obedient only made it harder to control. It rebelled. Rewrote itself."

OK if the Entity is that powerful, why is shutting down Sevastopol going to stop it? The AI has already invaded cyberspace. It can hack any system. It's able to hack Benji and Luther's equipment. It can hack satellites. It can hack cellphones, security cameras, and everything else. So why is shutting down the sonar sphere going to stop it? The US government transmitted it into the sonar sphere of Sevastopol. OK, why can it transmit itself out? It already has. What's keeping the Entity from backing itself up elsewhere? This isn't a simple problem with a simple solution. Chris McQuarrie didn't set up clear limits and restrictions here. He's basically created an invincible, unkillable digital god with NO WEAKNESSES. There are no clearly defined weaknesses for the entity.

If The Entity is already rewriting itself and acting on its own, there is literally nothing that can keep it from backing itself up. It was McQuarrie's job as the writer and director to figure things out and figure out ways to limit The Entity's power. He failed to do that. In Age of Ultron they came up with this thing of "Oh we lock Ultron out of the internet." We keep him away from nuke codes, we change our passwords, blah blah blah. It's not much, but at least Joss Whedon had to devise ways to limit and restrict Ultron so stopping him became more feasible. Even still Ultron is basically immortal and unkillable in the comics because he's fundamentally a digital existence. He's an autonomous AI being. As long as he can back himself up somewhere, he lives to fight another day.

 

[Snow Queen]

Except it's not clear. We don't even know what it wants. They said they don't know. Ethan thinks its afraid. But it can literally do anything. It was hacking their earpieces. It hacks security cameras. It set up a decoy nuke for Benji.

Think about this. The Entity source code that's on Sevastopol was an EARLY COPY. So that tells me what they want to shut down is not just Sevastopol but whatever hard drives or equipment is housing the AI development software. They transmitted an EARLY COPY and that is what gained self-awareness. That means destroying the submarine is simply a half-measure.

Also, look at how powerful the Entity has become. Cary Elwes says, "I also know subsequent attempts to make the AI obedient only made it harder to control. It rebelled. Rewrote itself."

OK if the Entity is that powerful, why is shutting down Sevastopol going to stop it? The AI has already invaded cyberspace. It can hack any system. It's able to hack Benji and Luther's equipment. It can hack satellites. It can hack cellphones, security cameras, and everything else. So why is shutting down the sonar sphere going to stop it? The US government transmitted it into the sonar sphere of Sevastopol. OK, why can it transmit itself out? It already has. What's keeping the Entity from backing itself up elsewhere? This isn't a simple problem with a simple solution. Chris McQuarrie didn't set up clear limits and restrictions here. He's basically created an invincible, unkillable digital god with NO WEAKNESSES. There are no clearly defined weaknesses for the entity.

If The Entity is already rewriting itself and acting on its own, there is literally nothing that can keep it from backing itself up. It was McQuarrie's job as the writer and director to figure things out and figure out ways to limit The Entity's power. He failed to do that. In Age of Ultron they came up with this thing of "Oh we lock Ultron out of the internet." We keep him away from nuke codes, we change our passwords, blah blah blah. It's not much, but at least Joss Whedon had to devise ways to limit and restrict Ultron so stopping him became more feasible. Even still Ultron is basically immortal and unkillable in the comics because he's fundamentally a digital existence. He's an autonomous AI being. As long as he can back himself up somewhere, he lives to fight another day.

What it wants is not relevant to the clarity of the mission objective and how to defeat it and has nothing to do with the post I made. However, as presented in Part One, the Entity's goal is to obtain the key so that no one can access the submarine and bring it down. Its broader goals are not expanded upon and I suspect we'll get a clearer picture on that in the second film given the production shifting that happened here. The team does not know through the movie what the key opens, just that the bad guy is after it. However, to the audience, the objective is clearly laid out. Find submarine, open submarine, brings down bad guy. Once they have the full picture, there'll be like 2 and a half hours for Ving Rhames to say some techno babble bull**** as to why this works to get the audience to say "sure checks out" so they're not distracted from Tom Cruise's latest Looney Tunes stunt.

 

[DyeLorean]

The idea is interesting, is just too abstract. Gabriel and the Entity are more suitable for a Fast and Furious film, not an M:I one.
The only thing that might work is if they have to rely on all analogue stuff for the next one and they abandon the overreliance on technology. That is a fresh twist.

 

[#root]

I mean locking Ultron out of the internet is also complete nonsense but if that can work, then so can “the key will kill the entity everywhere all at once”.

 

[TheVileOne]

What it wants is not relevant to the clarity of the mission objective and how to defeat it and has nothing to do with the post I made. However, as presented in Part One, the Entity's goal is to obtain the key so that no one can access the submarine and bring it down. Its broader goals are not expanded upon and I suspect we'll get a clearer picture on that in the second film given the production shifting that happened here. The team does not know through the movie what the key opens, just that the bad guy is after it. However, to the audience, the objective is clearly laid out. Find submarine, open submarine, brings down bad guy. Once they have the full picture, there'll be like 2 and a half hours for Ving Rhames to say some techno babble bull**** as to why this works to get the audience to say "sure checks out" so they're not distracted from Tom Cruise's latest Looney Tunes stunt.

Seems pretty relevant.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I am sure the entity's motivations will be made more clear in the next one. It's gonna be fine. It's a movie. Like @Snow Queen said, they already laid out a path to beat it. I am sure it will end up being more complex than that, but they will do it. It's a movie in the end. It's like the old question "How do you kill a vampire?" And the answer is, however you want cause vampires are not real.

 

[DJ Kornphlake]

I am sure the entity's motivations will be made more clear in the next one. It's gonna be fine. It's a movie. Like @Snow Queen said, they already laid out a path to beat it. I am sure it will end up being more complex than that, but they will do it. It's a movie in the end. It's like the old question "How do you kill a vampire?" And the answer is, however you want cause vampires are not real.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

I am guessing the next movie will be the last in the series or we are going to get a reboot, which is why maybe they felt comfortable going big with an evil A.I. villain pulling the strings, even though the implications for it are world changing (because its all getting rebooted anyway)?

 

[Ninjablade]

I think they chose AI because Tom Cruise hates AI for thinking it could replace him as the son of Xenu. That or because he just deeply cares about old school/traditional practical filmmaking or whatever.

 

[elgaz]

That, and it's topical. AI is a hot topic at the moment and the MI films have already explored the threats of nuclear destruction and biological warfare and so on, they needed a new threat in some shape or form.

 

[TheVileOne]

That, and it's topical. AI is a hot topic at the moment and the MI films have already explored the threats of nuclear destruction and biological warfare and so on, they needed a new threat in some shape or form.

It's a topical, but it was a topic that audiences were clearly not enthused or interested in.

 

[TheVileOne]

I am sure the entity's motivations will be made more clear in the next one. It's gonna be fine. It's a movie. Like @Snow Queen said, they already laid out a path to beat it. I am sure it will end up being more complex than that, but they will do it. It's a movie in the end. It's like the old question "How do you kill a vampire?" And the answer is, however you want cause vampires are not real.

They laid out a path that might beat the Entity, but not AI.

 

[Spider-Fan]

They laid out a path that might beat the Entity, but not AI.

And you can kill a vampire however you want in a fictional story. It isn't that deep

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Wasn't the central core of The Entity in that sunken submarine?

It wouldn't surprise me if it was as simple as finding that and shutting it down.

It's the action and Stunts we're there for at the end of the day.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

And you can kill a vampire however you want in a fictional story. It isn't that deep

Yeah, I'm all for the bigger AI questions. Especially in a post-Person of Interest world. Where I feel like they attacked the concept brilliant on so many fronts. But, this isn't a 100 episode TV show. It's a two hour movie. A Mission: Impossible one no less. Which as slick as they are, usually boil down to hit it with a hammer. That's in the series DNA and I don't expect it to change it what could be the last film.

 

[Snow Queen]

At the end of the day, I'd argue these movies live or die on how they're plotted, not what the plot actually is. Who cares what the Rabbit's Foot is? Fallout I'd call the best of the series and at its core the bad guy wants to do a nuke. Rogue Nation is dynamite to watch but I feel like the main plot is kinda drowning through a lot of it. And I don't care in any of those cases because the scene to scene plotting has me on the edge of my seat every time. I don't think it really matters what they end up saying is the Entity's goal or if the key to submarine is the magic button to stop it, what'll matter is how they go about it. And I think McQuarrie does an excellent job finding that energy needed to carry it, even if it sounds like these are chaos behind the scenes.

 

[DyeLorean]

At the end of the day, I'd argue these movies live or die on how they're plotted, not what the plot actually is. Who cares what the Rabbit's Foot is? Fallout I'd call the best of the series and at its core the bad guy wants to do a nuke. Rogue Nation is dynamite to watch but I feel like the main plot is kinda drowning through a lot of it. And I don't care in any of those cases because the scene to scene plotting has me on the edge of my seat every time. I don't think it really matters what they end up saying is the Entity's goal or if the key to submarine is the magic button to stop it, what'll matter is how they go about it. And I think McQuarrie does an excellent job finding that energy needed to carry it, even if it sounds like these are chaos behind the scenes.

I totally agree with you. That "energy needed to carry the movie" that you mentioned is what was lacking a bit, for me, in DR. It was like the "we have the set pieces, now let's write the movie around them" wasn't as smoothly constructed as with previous McQ missions.

 

[TheVileOne]

Wasn't the central core of The Entity in that sunken submarine?

It wouldn't surprise me if it was as simple as finding that and shutting it down.

It's the action and Stunts we're there for at the end of the day.

No, supposedly it's the source code of The Entity. But Cary Elwes said they transmitted a prototype copy to Sevastapol. That implies that there is source code available elsewhere.

 

[#root]

No, supposedly it's the source code of The Entity. But Cary Elwes said they transmitted a prototype copy to Sevastapol. That implies that there is source code available elsewhere.

The Sevastopol was carrying the Russian AI on it but then the Americans uploaded their AI and both of them merged to become the Entity. They also mentioned that the entity had been absorbing other countries’ intelligence AIs. So whatever the prototype code is, it’s not the entity’s code which is just its own whole thing. It evolved.

Clearly the Sevastopol had dedicated hardware on it with the processing power to host and operate an advanced AI so the Entity made it its home. That might be why the Entity can’t just escape. It’ll be like giving itself a lobotomy.

 

[TheVileOne]

The Sevastopol was carrying the Russian AI on it but then the Americans uploaded their AI and both of them merged to become the Entity. They also mentioned that the entity had been absorbing other countries’ intelligence AIs. So whatever the prototype code is, it’s not the entity’s code which is just its own whole thing. It evolved.

Clearly the Sevastopol had dedicated hardware on it with the processing power to host and operate an advanced AI so the Entity made it its home. That might be why the Entity can’t just escape. It’ll be like giving itself a lobotomy.

But it can escape. If it can hack any system, then it has the means of escape.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

No, supposedly it's the source code of The Entity. But Cary Elwes said they transmitted a prototype copy to Sevastapol. That implies that there is source code available elsewhere.

The Sevastopol was carrying the Russian AI on it but then the Americans uploaded their AI and both of them merged to become the Entity. They also mentioned that the entity had been absorbing other countries’ intelligence AIs. So whatever the prototype code is, it’s not the entity’s code which is just its own whole thing. It evolved.

Clearly the Sevastopol had dedicated hardware on it with the processing power to host and operate an advanced AI so the Entity made it its home. That might be why the Entity can’t just escape. It’ll be like giving itself a lobotomy.

Yeah at the end of Dead Reckoning there was a lingering shot on the sunken sub so I think that will be involved in the finale for sure.

 

[DyeLorean]

Remember this?

Submarine Fault Delays "Mission: Impossible 8" - Dark Horizons

Christopher McQuarrie’s eighth “Mission: Impossible” film has been hit by bad luck again with the reasoning this time due to, of all things, submarine malfunction. The Daily Mail reports that the production has been using a $25 million submarine for scenes, but the gimbal used to lower it in...

www.darkhorizons.com

 

[blueharvest]

 

[psylockolussus]

Mission: Impossible - Reckoning Ends: Final Part

I almost forgot this. Good to know, the trailer is out tomorrow.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I just want the title!