Neill Blomkamp’s next project... ELYSIUM?

[redhawk23]

"This character that was always intended to be white was obviously intended to be hispanic."

I haven't seen the movie yet so I'll drop it but I'm just saying that Damon's casting as well as the fact the population of Elysium isn't as monochromatic as you claim (along with the south Asian president, an Asian woman features prominently in the trailer's introduction of life on the space station) complicates your reading. Some reviewers have actually remarked their disappointment at seeing "just another white guy" as the protagonist.

If a film was going to be so thinly anti-white, why "whitewash" the lead? If the agenda is so plain, which side is the film falling on?

 

[Poni_Boy]

When you see it you'll understand. You're trying to grasp as anything to refute what I'm saying but it's futile because you're looking at it all out of context. There's literally nothing you can say to change my mind on what I saw until you see it and can offer an educated first person opinion. I'm not an apologist. If I think a movie is hugely flawed but still entertaining I'll say so. Likewise if the reverse is true. I have no allegiance to directors or studios. I just want good goddamn movies. I know it's hard to accept the possibility that this particular movie has major flaws. I went in doubting it could have any. Sorry that I can't offer a very positive reponse

 

[redhawk23]

I'm not trying to change your mind, simply questioning how a film that is supposed to be so heavy handed an obvious at the same time complicates its own message.

And I don't doubt the movie has major flaws, its not as if Blomkamp is the second coming of film making or something.

For the record though, you not liking a film nearly comes off as a recommendation.

 

[Poni_Boy]

That's good. I don't want anyone to ever be disappointed in a movie especially one they pay to see. I'm also not the type of reviewer to go out of my way to tell people to not see a movie. If I loved it, I'll endorse it. If I didn't, I don't. Simple as that.

Regarding your heavy-handed comment I'm not sure if you understand what you're asking. Heavy-handed storytelling =/= a simple story. Nor does it mean a complex one. It's the storytelling that is or is not heavy-handed, not the story itself. In terms of Elysium it's a very simple story with a very straightforward message that is told in a very heavy-handed, repetitive way for 2+ hours.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Wow, I didn't realize the film was set in LA.

Sorry I didn't like the third act. Don't really care either way, it didn't take away my enjoyment of the movie as a whole.

I just find it weird that the climax of a film can be that bad and it doesn't really effect your enjoyment of the film as a whole. I still really like it, but only up to that point. Then it takes a huge nosedive.

 

[Project862006]

wtf does acted Hispanic mean

 

[Kansiov]

You do realize I said ethnicity and not race, right?

Race is also a layman's term for ethnicity. Apart from a common language, Hispanics are a very diverse population, some of which not dissimilar to non-hispanics. The US Census once classified Protestant White and Catholic White as different ethnic groups once, even though Irish and Italians are culturally and biologically very different; while the Irish and English are culturally and biologically similar.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

That's good. I don't want anyone to ever be disappointed in a movie especially one they pay to see. I'm also not the type of reviewer to go out of my way to tell people to not see a movie. If I loved it, I'll endorse it. If I didn't, I don't. Simple as that.

Regarding your heavy-handed comment I'm not sure if you understand what you're asking. Heavy-handed storytelling =/= a simple story. Nor does it mean a complex one. It's the storytelling that is or is not heavy-handed, not the story itself. In terms of Elysium it's a very simple story with a very straightforward message that is told in a very heavy-handed, repetitive way for 2+ hours.

Looking up tickets and it seems the movie is 109 mins. Are you sure it is 2+ hours?

 

[Poni_Boy]

Race is also a layman's term for ethnicity. Apart from a common language, Hispanics are a very diverse population, some of which not dissimilar to non-hispanics. The US Census once classified Protestant White and Catholic White as different ethnic groups once, even though Irish and Italians are culturally and biologically very different; while the Irish and English are culturally and biologically similar.

No genius race (genetics) and ethnicity (sociology) are two different things

Educate yourself: http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race

 

[Poni_Boy]

wtf does acted Hispanic mean

Mannerisms. Dialect. Non-verbal communication. In most movies Hispanics are portrayed in an exaggerated way. That's very prevalent in this movie as every character on Earth that they show (with the possible exception of Max) is Hispanic or Latino. Damon puts a barrio boy act on in a few scenes.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Mannerisms. Dialect. Non-verbal communication. In most movies Hispanics are portrayed in an exaggerated way. That's very prevalent in this movie as every character on Earth that they show (with the possible exception of Max) is Hispanic or Latino. Damon puts a barrio boy act on in a few scenes.

Being of a certain background I find your words highly offensive, bordering on racism.

 

[Poni_Boy]

I just find it weird that the climax of a film can be that bad and it doesn't really effect your enjoyment of the film as a whole. I still really like it, but only up to that point. Then it takes a huge nosedive.

And that's all subjective. I didn't think it was a bad ending or a bad fight scene I just felt it was out of place in that movie. It didn't take my enjoyment away because it wasn't bad.

Like I explained already to a handful of people, if I have an amazing three course meal that satisfies me in every way but the dessert is just a bit too sweet it doesn't take away how much I loved the meal as a whole.

 

[Tanin]

No genius race (genetics) and ethnicity (sociology) are two different things

Educate yourself: http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race

So he is white in a hispanic culture... how is that whitewashing when race and ethnicity aren't the same?

 

[Poni_Boy]

Being of a certain background I find your words highly offensive, bordering on racism.

I'm half Hispanic and grew up in a bad part of South Miami. I'm not racist I'm realistic. Acting like movies don't portray Hispanics or Latinos as barrio kids the majority of the time is ignorant. That's what they do.

 

[redhawk23]

Being of a certain background I find your words highly offensive, bordering on racism.

Probably best to give him the benefit of the doubt that he is comparing Damon's performance to the media's stereotypical presentation of young urban Hispanics, which Poniboy does indeed specify.

 

[Poni_Boy]

So he is white in a hispanic culture... how is that whitewashing when race and ethnicity aren't the same?

Because it felt to me like he was supposed to be Hispanic. That's just how it felt the character was written. Every time Damon spoke Spanish it was cringeworthy. For example if Diego Luna had been playing Max the story would have flowed better to me.

EDIT: Maybe the trailers aren't showing it (I forget what I thought of them before I saw the movie) but Damon is literally the ONLY white guy they show being on Earth.

 

[Kansiov]

No genius race (genetics) and ethnicity (sociology) are two different things

Educate yourself: http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race

You do realize that outside of the US, race and ethnicity are pretty much mean the same thing right? The term 'race' has no scientific meaning. The only reason why race and ethnicity is still used differently by the US Census simply because, just like American measurement of units, the US is pretty much stuck in the 19th century.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

And that's all subjective. I didn't think it was a bad ending or a bad fight scene I just felt it was out of place in that movie. It didn't take my enjoyment away because it wasn't bad.

Like I explained already to a handful of people, if I have an amazing three course meal that satisfies me in every way but the dessert is just a bit too sweet it doesn't take away how much I loved the meal as a whole.

I feel like the third act is more of the main course then just the dessert, but to each their own.

I'm half Hispanic and grew up in a bad part of South Miami. I'm not racist I'm realistic. Acting like movies don't portray Hispanics or Latinos as barrio kids the majority of the time is ignorant. That's what they do.

That is fair on a whole, but I also don't think you can pigeonhole Damon's portrayal as "typical Hollywood" considering the source. But I guess I can't really fault you on that until I have seen the film.

 

[redhawk23]

No genius race (genetics) and ethnicity (sociology) are two different things

Educate yourself: http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race

Hate to break it with you but race is just as much if not more so a social construct than ethnicity is.

Race in particular is far more often a label that is applied in comparison to ethnicity that is more often self identified and is more involved in common place of origin and shared history.

A person Irish descent is a person of Irish descent but depending on place and time they wouldn't necessarily be considered white.

See also differences in what is considered "Black" between the United States, Puerto Rico and Brazil.

But this is a discussion for another thread.

 

[Poni_Boy]

That is fair on a whole, but I also don't think you can pigeonhole Damon's portrayal as "typical Hollywood" considering the source. But I guess I can't really fault you on that until I have seen the film.

When you have a movie that shows you the world, has all of these sweeping camera movements to give the world scale and depth, and they show that the entirety of the population is ONLY Hispanic or Latino, it's safe to assume that their intention is just that. Then you have a main character whose name is Hispanic, who has tattoos in Spanish, who acts like a barrio kid around his barrio friends, who speaks Spanish.. wouldn't you assume that he IS Hispanic or Latino? It's the duck/duck/duck analogy. Just because Matt Damon is playing the character doesn't mean anything. Maybe Bloomkamp didn't know what the hell he was doing?

I will say this, Elysium is as borderline racist as you can get for a big summer movie. Can't remember any other one being so overt since Transformers 2.

I know I sound like a broken record but wait till you see the movie. I know what it's like to want to call bulls**t because you WANT stuff like what I'm saying not to be true. Just adjust your expectations accordingly.

 

[redhawk23]

And against whom precisely is the film prejudiced against in your opinion?

 

[Poni_Boy]

You do realize that outside of the US, race and ethnicity are pretty much mean the same thing right? The term 'race' has no scientific meaning. The only reason why race and ethnicity is still used differently by the US Census simply because, just like American measurement of units, the US is pretty much stuck in the 19th century.

Dude, RACE and ETHNICITY are two different things. I don't care if you are in the U.S. or Canada or Antarctica. The words define two different categories.

It doesn't matter if one is archaic or if you don't like that it exists. They are two different words. They define two different things. That's fact.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ethnicity

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/race

 

[redhawk23]

http://www.wired.com/underwire/2013/07/blomkamp-elysium/

Poniboy, I don't know if you read this article before but in the interview Blomkamp describes the origins of this project, rooted in an incident that occurred when he traveled across the border to Mexico after spending time in Beverly Hills, and his intent in showing America as "the other side of the border."

 

[Poni_Boy]

And against whom precisely is the film prejudiced against in your opinion?

Personally I don't know many Hispanics/Latinos who would want to see only Hispanics/Latinos as the world's poor, crippled and dying population. Likewise I don't know many Caucasians who would be comfortable with the way 99% of the Caucasians are shown in this movie: rich, selfish, ignorant. I found it to be treading close to racist from both standpoints.

 

[Tanin]

As a White Hispanic like Matt Damon portrays in the film all this is just making me laugh.