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Well, it wasn't a flash submission like with Mir/Lesnar.

Lesnar got Carwin to the ground and pummeled into position and slowly got a hold of the submission and Carwin didn't look like he knew what to do. Actually, he was gassed and couldn't defend the transitions and probably just didn't expect a submission attempt.
 
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Paroxysm said:
So what, Overeem has 13 TKO's and over 20 first round wins, he knows how to finish fights.
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:doh: @ "So what"

"So what" that means is Carwin is just as lethal a finisher, if not moreso than Overeem.. so how do you work out he'd have been able to finish Lesnar from the same position.
 
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my question is, can anything be done to change that perception with MMA fans??
 
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I don't see how my post has anything to do with what Dr. Evil said.
 
Lesnar to me at least is for real. I think part of the hate or whatever is the personality. One day he's like a snuggly little bear and the next he's a raging *****e who talks a lot of ****. Problem being, he backs up the **** talking in the octagon. Unlike a Frank Mir who should shut his mouth. It's like Lesnar doesn't know if he wants to be the villain or just be Brock Lesnar. Of course being the villain is a lot more viable financially.
 
That was one of the sillier fights I've ever watched. Carwin literally punched himself out of that fight. He was completely useless after the first round.
 
you guys need to watch this

[YT]swnM_VaXRbA&hd=1[/YT]
 
Paroxysm said:
Ubereem would have ****ing finished him
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Two of Overeem's biggest problems have always been that he has bad takedown defense and cardio. Putting on 40 pounds of muscle does not help that. Overeem had trouble with smaller grapplers taking him down at 205. He'd get taken down easily by a big wrestler like Lesnar and would gas worse than Carwin did while Lesnar's whole weight is on him.

Dr. Evil said:
It has to do with his background as a "fake" wrestler in the WWE. Die hard MMA fans are upset that he came from fake such as pro wrestling and ends up dominating in the UFC.

That's why you see other former pro wrestlers like Dave Batista and Bobby Lashley in MMA, hoping that they can duplicate the success Brock's had going from pro wrestling to the real stuff in Mixed Martial Arts.
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Well a lot "diehard" MMA fans are full of crap anyway. They hail PRIDE as the greatest thing ever and then bash Brock because he was in the WWF. Of course they're not really "diehard" fans because they would realize that PRIDE was created by a pro wrestling organization and frequently had pro wrestlers with no combat experience in their organization. Hell Sakuraba is probably one of their heroes, and he was a pro wrestler before ever even stepping foot in a ring. They just like to act as if they know so much more about MMA than "noobs" when they actually don't know much besides names and highlights.

Darthphere said:
Can I ask a question with a couple of stipulations? 1. I didn't watch the fight because I didn't feel like paying $60 plus taxes and fees and 2. I'm really not trying to start trouble, I need someone to explain this to me.

So Lesnar beat Carwin by submission. Ok, it seems it played out differently, but how is this any different than when Mir made Lesnar tap and everyone was like "It's not a real victory because Mir caught him by surprise and it wasn't a KO" that all the Lesnar fans were chanting?
Click to expand...

Some people are just really stupid. Any saying that Mir's win doesn't count is an idiot that doesn't understand MMA. If Lesnar signifies his desire to end the fight by tapping, then it is clearly a victory. People like the ones you mentioned give fans of a fighter a bad name. I'm a Brock fan, but I try not to be delusional like those guys. Sadly, nearly every fighter I'm a fan of has idiot fans that make us look bad.

"Fedor lost because of the cage.":whatever:

"B.J. Penn didn't really lose to Jens Pulver. Time just didn't get right at the end of the second round to let Jens tap to that armbar.":o

"Rampage didn't really lose that fight to Shogun. That kick broke his ribs and he wasn't the same fighter after that.":hehe:
 
zanos said:
That was one of the sillier fights I've ever watched. Carwin literally punched himself out of that fight. He was completely useless after the first round.
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Wow, really?

This kind of thing happens all the time, especially with heavyweights...The issue here is overconfidence and adrenaline with some of these fighters.

When Shane first swarmed on Lesnar and then stopped/stood back up, he should've been smart enough to realize that Lesnar wasn't going to quit, but he got back on top and tried to land more shots. Like someone mentioned, maybe at that point, especially after Carwin knew that the first round was ending that Shane's confidence dropped really low and all that factored into his energy level as well.

Shane has been exposed as a somewhat one dimensional fighter. We know he has huge power and good hands. After this fight, he'll know work to improve on his wrestling base and add some more BJJ and ground defense (and offense) to his training.
 
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B said:
:doh: @ "So what"

"So what" that means is Carwin is just as lethal a finisher, if not moreso than Overeem.. so how do you work out he'd have been able to finish Lesnar from the same position.
Click to expand...

Carwin has heavy hands and decent striking ability but that doesn't stack up with Overeem’s K-1 level striking and experience.

E-Man said:
Two of Overeem's biggest problems have always been that he has bad takedown defense and cardio. Putting on 40 pounds of muscle does not help that. Overeem had trouble with smaller grapplers taking him down at 205. He'd get taken down easily by a big wrestler like Lesnar and would gas worse than Carwin did while Lesnar's whole weight is on him.
Click to expand...

He "did" gas out but over the last few years he's turned into a beast of a heavyweight who has crushed the competition of late.
 
Kane52630 said:
you guys need to watch this

[YT]swnM_VaXRbA&hd=1[/YT]
Click to expand...

That was awesome. :up:

Stone Cold looks like a guy (if he were younger) that could fight for real & make it into MMA. I don't know what it is about him but he has a 'fighters aura' about him. He can probably brawl like a champion. :D

Paroxysm said:
Carwin has heavy hands and decent striking ability but that doesn't stack up with Overeem’s K-1 level striking and experience.
Click to expand...

You make it sound like Overeem is a K-1 & striking god, he was a friggin punching bag in K-1. I don't know his record off hand however I do know that it isn't impressive.. if I recall correctly he'd lost as many fights as he'd won.

Anyway, I'm stuggling to understand how his time in K-1 suddenly means Overeem would have finished Brock considering Carwin has heavier hands than Overeem & he couldn't keep Brock down/still for long enough to tee off on him with clean shots.

Paroxysm said:
He "did" gas out but over the last few years he's turned into a beast of a heavyweight who has crushed the competition of late.
Click to expand...

I know this comment wasn't in reply to me however I just thought I'd throw my opinion in; Overeem has been riding a hype cloud in recent years, he has fought distinctly average fighters with average to horrendous MMA records. He hasn't really fought anyone credible in a few years that would warrent the hype he has been recieving as far as I am concerned.
 
B said:
You make it sound like Overeem is a K-1 & striking god, he was a friggin punching bag in K-1. I don't know his record off hand however I do know that it isn't impressive.. if I recall correctly he'd lost as many fights as he'd won.

Anyway, I'm stuggling to understand how his time in K-1 suddenly means Overeem would have finished Brock considering Carwin has heavier hands than Overeem & he couldn't keep Brock down/still for long enough to tee off on him with clean shots.

I know this comment wasn't in reply to me however I just thought I'd throw my opinion in; Overeem has been riding a hype cloud in recent years, he has fought distinctly average fighters with average to horrendous MMA records. He hasn't really fought anyone credible in a few years that would warrent the hype he has been recieving as far as I am concerned.
Click to expand...

Take it how you wanna take it man, all I said was Overeem had better striking than Shane Carwin. I've watched all their fights and it's just my personal opinion based on the information I gathered. So yeah just deal with it.
 
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I do not like Brock Lesnar. However, I have to give him his props for last night. Carwin should have let him up in the first....his mistake.

Great night of fights.

I love MMA.
 
So happy Brock won. He didn't talk his usual amount of trash this time which made the win feel even better. Bring on Cain

Brock haters, eat a fat one
 
I finally got a chance to see the George Sotiropoulos fight, and I really want to see him fight Evan Dunham. I know I've mentioned wanting to see it before, but I really think that fight has some real potential to be fight of the year. You got two long guys with great ground games. I really hope the UFC makes it happen.
 
Man carwin had him, he just didn't conserve energy. Oh well, I really didn't care that much about either fighters.

Glad leben won, typical leben, gets hit with shots that would take down a gorilla and he keeps coming.
 
Carwin had him? Hahaha.

If Carwin had him, Carwin would have won. Carwin didn't have him.

He never had him, he never had his car... Wait, this isn't that movie.
 
El Bastardo said:
Carwin had him? Hahaha.

If Carwin had him, Carwin would have won. Carwin didn't have him.

He never had him, he never had his car... Wait, this isn't that movie.
Click to expand...

lesnarcarwin.gif


One would have a very strong argument for Carwin being victorious had he not gassed or punched himself out.
 
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