Raimi confirms Sandman *spoilers*

[Vile]

Bloody double post demons.

 

[Vile]

the moral of the story is "with great power comes great responsibility" and it will remain that way no matter what happens.

Very true...only now it seems so very hollow. An ol' gypsie woman could have told it to Pete...or he could have read it on the back of a cereal box.

You people amaze me and not in a good way. 6 pages on a tidbit that we already knew? I thought snadman being the killer was established time ago and you people are only whining about it now?

It was established, but never really confirmed. Until now, it seems. Most believed it would have been revealed to be false.

 

[lordofthenerds]

It was established, but never really confirmed. Until now, it seems. Most believed it would have been revealed to be false.

Except for those of us who read the script summary.

 

[zanos]

Raimi probably thought this was a good idea when he saw it in the Batman films.

 

[Prodigy]

Except for those of us who read the script summary.

or watched the trailer that was released in november

 

[lordofthenerds]

or watched the trailer that was released in november

Well I think he means that after watching the trailer most people thought it would turn out to not be true.

 

[Prodigy]

Well I think he means that after watching the trailer most people thought it would turn out to not be true.

yes, THEY were hoping it would turn out to be not true, and thus for them it wasn't "established" ... for the rest of the world that's not blinded by fandom, having it in the trailer like that.... established it

 

[Vile]

yes, THEY were hoping it would turn out to be not true, and thus for them it wasn't "established" ... for the rest of the world that's not blinded by fandom, having it in the trailer like that.... established it

Well it was more like blind faith that maybe Raimi wouldnt **** up this film anymore than he has.

Whoops, what was I thinkin'? t:

 

[bes628]

Whats the problem with it?

How Would Ben's Murderer being Sandman make his whole power and responsibility thing pointless?

to your average movie go'er they wont care.


and it really isnt that big of a deal in my opinion to say it was a bad idea.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

Very true...only now it seems so very hollow. An ol' gypsie woman could have told it to Pete...or he could have read it on the back of a cereal box.



It was established, but never really confirmed. Until now, it seems. Most believed it would have been revealed to be false.

either if marko killed uncle ben or the burglar killed unxcle ben no matter which one with great power comes great responsibilty will not change, it is still the same even the fact that marko killed uncle ben.

 

[zanos]

Whats the problem with it?

How Would Ben's Murderer being Sandman make his whole power and responsibility thing pointless?

to your average movie go'er they wont care.


and it really isnt that big of a deal in my opinion to say it was a bad idea.

Prior to uncle ben's death comicbook Peter had only thought of using his powers for personal gain. He was self absorbed, selfish, apathetic to anyone else, etc. These are the very traits that led to Uncle Ben's death which Peter feels directly responsible for. That's why he continues to do what he does. By making Sandman the killer Raimi is essentially turning him into Batman who is more or less a hero out of vengence.

 

[Vile]

Prior to uncle ben's death comicbook Peter had only thought of using his powers for personal gain. He was self absorbed, selfish, apathetic to anyone else, etc. These are the very traits that led to Uncle Ben's death which Peter feels directly responsible for. That's why he continues to do what he does. By making Sandman the killer Raimi is essentially turning him into Batman who is more or less a hero out of vengence.

Bingo. My point exactly.

 

[Dragon]

Prior to uncle ben's death comicbook Peter had only thought of using his powers for personal gain. He was self absorbed, selfish, apathetic to anyone else, etc. These are the very traits that led to Uncle Ben's death which Peter feels directly responsible for. That's why he continues to do what he does. By making Sandman the killer Raimi is essentially turning him into Batman who is more or less a hero out of vengence.

First, that isn't even remotely the case here. Peter wants vengeance against ONE criminal- Sandman. And it's only for the length of this story. Like each other Spidey film, Raimi wants Peter to have a lesson to learn. This is the lesson for this film. that it's wrong to be out for vengeance.

Secondly that laundry list of descriptive terms for Peter's persona you have above doesn't apply to movie Peter. He did one selfish act which he felt was cosmic comeuppance.

Third, this really changes nothing. Peter not stopiing the burglar set in motion the chain of events that led to Ben's death. The robbery means the crooks need a getaway car. They carjack Ben, he dies. If the burglar had been stopped, Marko wouldn't have shot Ben to get his car. Same deal.

 

[Vile]

You're assuming that Marko wouldnt have shot Uncle Ben if the burglar had been stopped - he could have easily freaked out as the disapearance of his cohort and still carjacked Ben, still leading to his death.

There are too many 'what ifs' this whole scenerio generates, which is just stupid and not needed. It was SIMPLE to begin with: If Peter had stopped the burglar, Uncle Ben would have never died. Now you have a hundred possibilities that directly removes responcibility from Peter.

 

[Dragon]

You're assuming that Marko wouldnt have shot Uncle Ben if the burglar had been stopped - he could have easily freaked out as the disapearance of his cohort and still carjacked Ben, still leading to his death.

The only reason for shooting Ben was for his car. If his partner had been caught, and if Marko has half a brain he wouldn't do something to incriminate himself, especially with a sick daughter. He'd just walk away, and form a new plan.

There are too many 'what ifs' this whole scenerio generates, which is just stupid and not needed. It was SIMPLE to begin with: If Peter had stopped the burglar, Uncle Ben would have never died. Now you have a hundred possibilities that directly removes responcibility from Peter.

You STILL only have one possibility. The one Raimi wants. Let's remember that the comic book scenario is in and of itself EXTREMELY far-fetched. The burglar ending up at the Parker house was more than 1 in 1 billion. But it was poetic and dramatic and made for a great story. So, who's to say that Raimi can't make this work, especially since he's worked to give Marko dimension by making him repentent for the crime rather than a run-of-the-mill badguy whgo doesn't care what he does. You and so many others are worrying over nothing.

 

[Kritish]

OMG IT N0tt de s@me! RaImI a suxxorz!

Grow up nerds, Rami can do what he wants.

 

[Vile]

You STILL only have one possibility. The one Raimi wants. Let's remember that the comic book scenario is in and of itself EXTREMELY far-fetched. The burglar ending up at the Parker house was more than 1 in 1 billion. But it was poetic and dramatic and made for a great story. So, who's to say that Raimi can't make this work, especially since he's worked to give Marko dimension by making him repentent for the crime rather than a run-of-the-mill badguy whgo doesn't care what he does. You and so many others are worrying over nothing.

Giving Marko new dimension was inevitable - lets face it, Sandman is pretty weak character-wise.

Making him Uncle Ben's killer was just a cop-out. It was the easy thing to do, and seems to be a running theme in comic movies these days which is sad. With Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer Peter is no longer plagued by the guilt of his actions (or inactions, if you will) because regardless of what he would have done Ben would have died. He's simply out for vengeance now against ONE man. THE man.

After that...why continue to be Spidey? He got Uncle Ben's killer. Nuff said. Hang up the suit, marry MJ and live a happy life. Why continue to put your life on the line? Oh, because you have these gifts? So what? On the scene or not...it seems pretty inevitable what will and what wont happen - Spider-man being present or not.

Peter is now guiltless.

OMG IT N0tt de s@me! RaImI a suxxorz!

Grow up nerds, Rami can do what he wants.

...Are you kidding me? This is the POINT of these boards. Of course Raimi can do what he wants...as he damn well should.

 

[DACrowe]

Fans.

I personally don't think Sandman will have pulled the trigger, but it will be told in a way either direction that won't absolve Peter of responsibility or guilt though.

 

[dark_b]

first the facts
-sandman has after 4 years the same clothes. not only the shirt but even the pants and the belt


here you have flint running away from the cops

here is where they were filming. a lot of clothes there

This is the location where they're filming a chase scene -- a guy runs down the street and up a fire escape.
here he is not sandman because he has the orange suit.

so are you gona now tell me that flint marko has the same shirt,pants and belt for four years? and that after 4 years when he is running away from the cops( in the trailer we see sandman running away from the cops in the green shirt and brown pants) he is wearing the orange suit but then he takes of the orange suit and underneath he has the 4 years old shirt and pants?

i mean where is this going? of course raimi will say that sandman is the killer since it was in the trailer. to me it looks like that the movie wants to show that sandman is the killer which means that in the story peter will only think that he is the killerand become angry . and because he is angry the symbiote can come on him and make him kill sandman.

this is how it looks to me.


again after 4 years he has the same shirt,pants and belt? or is there a chance that this is really a dream scene and because peter saw sandman only in the green shirt and brown pants in hes dream filnt has the same clothes?

 

[Dragon]

Giving Marko new dimension was inevitable - lets face it, Sandman is pretty weak character-wise.

Making him Uncle Ben's killer was just a cop-out. It was the easy thing to do, and seems to be a running theme in comic movies these days which is sad. With Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer Peter is no longer plagued by the guilt of his actions (or inactions, if you will) because regardless of what he would have done Ben would have died.

No Robbery = Ben doesn't get shot for his car to ESCAPE the robbery.

Robbery= Ben gets shot for his car to ESCAPE the robbery.

If Peter stopped the burglar, Ben doesn't get shot. No reason for it.

He's simply out for vengeance now against ONE man. THE man.

When Ben got shot he was out for vengeance against one man.

After that...why continue to be Spidey? He got Uncle Ben's killer. Nuff said. Hang up the suit, marry MJ and live a happy life. Why continue to put your life on the line? Oh, because you have these gifts? So what? On the scene or not...it seems pretty inevitable what will and what wont happen - Spider-man being present or not.

Peter is now guiltless.

Why be Spidey after the first burglar's death? Because he learned a lesson that he's supposed to use his powers to stop criminals and help those in need. As long as those powers exist, criminals exist and people are in need, he'll continue to be Spidey. His gift, his curse.

And he isn't guiltless. Let's review: No robbery= Ben lives. Robbery = Ben dies.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I have supported everything Raimi has done with these movies so far, but i have to say i hate the idea of Sandman being the real killer of Uncle Ben, not only will it ruin part of the 3rd movie, but it will ruin a lot of the first 2 movies as well. Like in Spidey 1 he decides to become Spiderman because he let his supposed Uncle's killer go. And all the guilt he felt in 2 about Ben's death and how he had been partly responsible for it will be now pointless. Not to mention the confession scene to Aunt May were Peter tells her what really happened that night will now be meaningless also.

Sorry, but i hate what he is doing here.

 

[GDM]

Remember Tobey Maguire: "There are so many twists and turns."
Maybe this is just one of them and it turns out Sandman was not uncles Ben killer.

 

[DyeLorean]

Yes, this is quite interesting. I like the idea of 'something' that makes you come back to the first film, BUT they're changing the origin of Spiderman.

And he isn't guiltless. Let's review: No robbery= Ben lives. Robbery = Ben dies.

Even if Peter stops that guy, and Uncle Ben gets to escape from his death, THE BURGLAR KILLED HIM. Not Sandman. That's a comicbook fact, and can't be changed.

I like what Raimi did so far, but this idea just doesn't quite fit. If they make you believe he killed him, to create the Sandman plot, but he actually didn't (in a realistic turn of events)... I guess that should be fine.

Don't forget that there's also Marko's daughter subplot.

D! (dyego)

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

first the facts
-sandman has after 4 years the same clothes. not only the shirt but even the pants and the belt


here you have flint running away from the cops

here is where they were filming. a lot of clothes there

This is the location where they're filming a chase scene -- a guy runs down the street and up a fire escape.
here he is not sandman because he has the orange suit.

so are you gona now tell me that flint marko has the same shirt,pants and belt for four years? and that after 4 years when he is running away from the cops( in the trailer we see sandman running away from the cops in the green shirt and brown pants) he is wearing the orange suit but then he takes of the orange suit and underneath he has the 4 years old shirt and pants?

i mean where is this going? of course raimi will say that sandman is the killer since it was in the trailer. to me it looks like that the movie wants to show that sandman is the killer which means that in the story peter will only think that he is the killerand become angry . and because he is angry the symbiote can come on him and make him kill sandman.

this is how it looks to me.


again after 4 years he has the same shirt,pants and belt? or is there a chance that this is really a dream scene and because peter saw sandman only in the green shirt and brown pants in hes dream filnt has the same clothes?

it will most likley be marko having a flash back of killing uncle ben. he wants to be forgiven.

 

[Venom 1988]

it will most likley be marko having a flash back of killing uncle ben. he wants to be forgiven.

What does that have to do with anything he said?

Dark b is saying that its a little to odd that Sandman has his regular clothes when he confronts Uncle Ben. Then when hes escaping prison years later, he has an orange jumpsuit, then all of a sudden happens to have the same exact cloths he had the night he "killed" Uncle Ben.