Revamping the Rogues Gallery

[BubbaGump]

As much as everyone loves the Joker, is anyone else getting the feeling that he's a tad bit over-used? Batman's rogues gallery is without a doubt the best of any comic book character's so why not use villains other than the Joker more often?

BTAS did a great job balancing as many villains as possible and even ended up updating crappy characters. Joker still had the most episodes (as he should), but lesser-known rogues also had fantastic revampings (Mr. Freeze, The Clock King, Clayface, Maxie Zeus).

Though the comics have used every single villain, the medium still hasn't balanced out the use of rogues. Joker is overexposed and when's the last time we've had a good Mad Hatter story?

Hugo Strange:

Hugo Strange was nicely updated in Batman and the Monster Men. I like the idea of him figuring out Batman's identity, ala Strange Apparitions. The mad scientist in him definitely shows promise. Bring him back!

Catwoman:

She has her own solo title, so that's okay. However, the Bat-cat relationship can definitely be played up a bit and her expertise in burglary can make for some good heist stories (Selina's Big Score).

Clayface:

Matt Hagen being an actor can definitely make for some interesting movie-themed crimes.

Scarecrow:

Make him scary again and he needs a complete costume overhaul. His recent two-parter in Detective was decent and a step in the right direction.

Penguin:

He's one of the most famous Batman characters, but his run in the comics have been generally weak. Which is disappointing really because he can serve as bridge between the Freaks and the Mob--a theme that was used to good effect in TLH. He's a freak that wants to be a mob boss. Elegant, classy. A lot of interesting opportunities here.

Two-Face

I'd like a Two-Face story that's not a retelling of his origin or how he fixes his face again. Batman: Faces was a good Two-Face story. And just like Penguin, the Freak/Mob aspect can be played with here.

Riddler:

The private detective thing works for now, but in the near future I'd like to see a darker, sinister, and overall more badass Riddler. His crimes should be complicated and intelligent. It's his brain that makes him such a challenge. Incorporate his OCD and intellectual death traps more. He was starting to get interesting after Hush though...

Mad Hatter:

Mind control, computers, and Alice in Wonderland! Bring in the love story from TAS and the computer wizardry into the comics. Gotham Central had a really good Mad Hatter run and excellent characterization. He should have the storybook aspect, but he shouldn't be a bumbling idiot reciting poems all the time.

I'll add more later.

 

[gwynplaine]

Cool thread. Very good summary on each villain, not only can you draw but apparently you also have writing skills. Good work, looking forward to the later addition

 

[lixdexia]

strange- no, keep him gone
catwoman- has a kid now and there's too much batman kid stuff going on now as is
clayface- is no where near that simple of a character in the comics
scarecrow-
penguin- nobody did him quite like brubaker, i really wish he was back
two face- agreed
riddler- needs to be a back ground player like he was in hush, that's where he works best
mad hatter- meh, six on one half a dozen on the other

 

[DaddyGrayson]

I'd love to see a revamp of these characters, ala the Ultimate line in Marvel. I'll come up with some ideas and post them.

 

[Batman]

Hugo Strange:

I think it'd be interesting if Strange developed a media persona, shedding supposed light to the public on the mentality of Batman, purposely causing people to fear him and think that he's a danger to society by lying and making him seem like a total psychopath. It could be an element that could be both beneficial to Bruce's facade, and damaging to his crusade, perhaps even causing his closest allies to question whether Batman knows what he's doing.

Catwoman:

I actually like the kid angle. It gives Selina a new turn in life, and a new burden which sort of forces her to do away with her reckless behavior and face the responsibilities of being a mother. But I'd like to see a story in which the baby is kidnapped, forcing Selina to go back to her old ways, and maybe even enlist Bruce's help to find her. It could be a good character study from both Selina and Bruce's perspectives, as Bruce sees how Selina has changed, and Selina sees how far Bruce is willing to go to protect the person most important in her life.

Clayface:

I'd actually like to see him be more theatrical, in terms of his crimes. Usually he's hired to mimick someone (like in Hush) or be simple brute force. Perhaps he should have some sort of multiple personality disorder, making him lost in the roles he's trying to play, and always struggling to maintain his own identity.

Scarecrow:

Agreed on needing to make him scary again. Truthfully, in recent years, he's been little more than a joke. Perhaps he should be on a neverending quest to prove that Batman does have underlying phobias, and that he hasn't simply become immune to Crane's tricks. And maybe, perhaps, he should even succeed, exposing a fear that Bruce has kept hidden from everyone for a number of years, forcing him to painfully face whatever that fear is. I also think Crane should be a bit more murderous, actually succeeding in scaring people to death, pushing Batman to the limit to stop him, rather than taking him out with a few punches.

Penguin:

I really don't have much of a beef with him. I heavily prefer him to be a mob boss posing as a legitimate buisnessman, as opposed to an umbrella obsessed thief with a coiencidental deformity. I think that's been handled well, so far, but it could definitely be presented better than it has. Maybe a storyline could even be that Penguin builds up a crime family to rule Gotham, like Carmine Falcone once did, giving him a truly menacing prescence, because let's face it... as this rate, by himself, he's not going to get anywhere.

Two-Face:

I'd definitely like to see Harvey focus more on his villainy than the side of him that still believes in justice. Granted, that duality should still be there, but unlike recent arcs, Two-Face was best when he used that sense of justice with a warped view, believing Batman and his partners to be the true scum of Gotham City that he needed to prosecute and lock away himself.


I really have nothing to say for Riddler or Mad Hatter. Riddler's doing fine as he currently is, in my opinion, and Mad Hatter's never really had a decline in what made him interesting in the first place... he's simply, I think, underused.

 

[Cobblepot]

Mad Hatter: Is much more than just a mind controlling freak, he's a pedophile even TAS made a nod to that. He could be Batman most vicious foe.

Clayface: There's only one left right? The son of Clayface two and three?

Poison Ivy: Would work as a lone vigilante, ridding Robinson's park of muggers and criminals. They could take her back to her environmental route, but I would love a story more Gotham based.

Cornelius Stirk: Great as he was, the heart eating, fear striking cannibal. They need to bring him back.

Zsaz: Done like in "Broken City"!

Killer Croc: Great as he was in "Broken City"!

 

[xXx]

Hugo Strange:

I think it'd be interesting if Strange developed a media persona, shedding supposed light to the public on the mentality of Batman, purposely causing people to fear him and think that he's a danger to society by lying and making him seem like a total psychopath. It could be an element that could be both beneficial to Bruce's facade, and damaging to his crusade, perhaps even causing his closest allies to question whether Batman knows what he's doing.

Catwoman:

I actually like the kid angle. It gives Selina a new turn in life, and a new burden which sort of forces her to do away with her reckless behavior and face the responsibilities of being a mother. But I'd like to see a story in which the baby is kidnapped, forcing Selina to go back to her old ways, and maybe even enlist Bruce's help to find her. It could be a good character study from both Selina and Bruce's perspectives, as Bruce sees how Selina has changed, and Selina sees how far Bruce is willing to go to protect the person most important in her life.

Clayface:

I'd actually like to see him be more theatrical, in terms of his crimes. Usually he's hired to mimick someone (like in Hush) or be simple brute force. Perhaps he should have some sort of multiple personality disorder, making him lost in the roles he's trying to play, and always struggling to maintain his own identity.

Scarecrow:

Agreed on needing to make him scary again. Truthfully, in recent years, he's been little more than a joke. Perhaps he should be on a neverending quest to prove that Batman does have underlying phobias, and that he hasn't simply become immune to Crane's tricks. And maybe, perhaps, he should even succeed, exposing a fear that Bruce has kept hidden from everyone for a number of years, forcing him to painfully face whatever that fear is. I also think Crane should be a bit more murderous, actually succeeding in scaring people to death, pushing Batman to the limit to stop him, rather than taking him out with a few punches.

Penguin:

I really don't have much of a beef with him. I heavily prefer him to be a mob boss posing as a legitimate buisnessman, as opposed to an umbrella obsessed thief with a coiencidental deformity. I think that's been handled well, so far, but it could definitely be presented better than it has. Maybe a storyline could even be that Penguin builds up a crime family to rule Gotham, like Carmine Falcone once did, giving him a truly menacing prescence, because let's face it... as this rate, by himself, he's not going to get anywhere.

Two-Face:

I'd definitely like to see Harvey focus more on his villainy than the side of him that still believes in justice. Granted, that duality should still be there, but unlike recent arcs, Two-Face was best when he used that sense of justice with a warped view, believing Batman and his partners to be the true scum of Gotham City that he needed to prosecute and lock away himself.


I really have nothing to say for Riddler or Mad Hatter. Riddler's doing fine as he currently is, in my opinion, and Mad Hatter's never really had a decline in what made him interesting in the first place... he's simply, I think, underused.

I would love for these suggestions to come to life!

 

[The Empire Ape]

His rogue gallery was already revamped since the 70s and it played out fully out in the 90s when every - even the harmless ones - batman villains were turned into a hardcore psychopath. That sucked. Making the Calendar Man a Hannibal Lector rip-off was just enough.

I'm still waiting till som eone invents the "Abortion Man"

 

[BubbaGump]

Killer Croc was great in Broken City and Hush (design and character-wise). He was getting some nice page-time, and it just stopped.

 

[WolfCypher]

Clayface- Too many Clayfaces running around. And, I don't think Matt Hagen is alive.

Scarecrow- Always up for more Scarecrow, as long as he doesn't transform into some monster again.

Two-Face- I can't keep up with him. One minute he's cured, the next, he's crazy again.

Mad Hatter- Last time I remember seeing him in action was in Secret Six. That guy was ****ing crazy there.

Catwoman- An active member of the Outsiders, with Batman. Since she doesn't have her daughter anymore, maybe, just maybe, they could rekindle a relationship again. "Hush" made the two a sexy couple.

 

[lixdexia]

Scarecrow- Always up for more Scarecrow, as long as he doesn't transform into some monster again..

yeah, what was up with that... terrible arc

 

[The Empire Ape]

Killer Croc was great in Broken City and Hush (design and character-wise). He was getting some nice page-time, and it just stopped.

Killer Crorc rocked in his initial arc. Then...

 

[lixdexia]

Killer Crorc rocked in his initial arc. Then...

i liked him durring knightfall

 

[Nepenthes]

Bane needs to take control of Santa Prisca as a somewhat benevolent dictator, mimising violence between the cartels, militas and political parties by calling all the shots and crushing anyone who questions. He's what Batman would be if Bruce had the balls or necessity to be the absolute Lord of Gotham. This would set-up Bane as a grander ally/occaisional foe in the vein of Ra's Al Ghul.

Firefly needs to step up as a respectable villain.

Clayface does not have one single good story. Forget the shapeshifting monster junk and get into the real story of Matt Hagen.

 

[The Empire Ape]

Clayface does not have one single good story. Forget the shapeshifting monster junk and get into the real story of Matt Hagen.

Hagen is dead since 1986.

 

[Cobblepot]

Clayface does not have one single good story. Forget the shapeshifting monster junk and get into the real story of Matt Hagen.

Oh man, you so need to read Mud-Pack by Alan Grant and Norm Breyfogle!

 

[Nepenthes]

Hagen is dead since 1986.

He's the most distinct and interesting Clayface to me, from what little I know of him. Doesn't really if he's dead does it? Just bring him back and erase all memory of those other losers, they muddy the concept (ha).

Oh man, you so need to read Mud-Pack by Alan Grant and Norm Breyfogle!

okay, thanks, i will

 

[The Empire Ape]

He's the most distinct and interesting Clayface to me, from what little I know of him. Doesn't really if he's dead does it? Just bring him back and erase all memory of those other losers, they muddy the concept (ha).

But Matt Hagen just found a cave with this liquids that made him able to shapeshift for 48 hours and so he became a thief? Not really interesting

Basil Karlo is a sociopathic mofo.
Preston Payne is the typical tragic villain.

I think both are better than Hagen. Lady Clay, Claything, and if there are other one around those too, should be killed.

 

[Armored Avenger]

I want to see Riddler become a really dark character. Not insane, crazy dark like the Joker, but intense dark. His riddles are an obssession that has taken over his life. He is a disturbing criminal whos crime are truely evil and the riddles he leaves are disturbing. His intelligence should come through on every page he is on, and be so precise that it makes him scary. He should never actually fight Batman in hand to hand combat either. He should be a true villain! Not some private Detective.

And i would really like to see Mad Hatter get a really good story as well. A really sinister story exploring his warped mind to the extent that the audience realize just how crazy this guy is! Not Theatrical Sociopathic crazy like the Joker, and a darker and more personal crazy.

 

[The Empire Ape]

I want to see Riddler become a really dark character. Not insane, crazy dark like the Joker, but intense dark. His riddles are an obssession that has taken over his life. He is a disturbing criminal whos crime are truely evil and the riddles he leaves are disturbing. His intelligence should come through on every page he is on, and be so precise that it makes him scary. He should never actually fight Batman in hand to hand combat either. He should be a true villain! Not some private Detective.

And i would really like to see Mad Hatter get a really good story as well. A really sinister story exploring his warped mind to the extent that the audience realize just how crazy this guy is! Not Theatrical Sociopathic crazy like the Joker, and a darker and more personal crazy.

we have enough dark villains.

 

[itsthebatman]

I would love to see Hugo Strange back, I want to see Batman tackle a villain with his brains, not his fists. I was disappointed that Black mask was killed off - his appearances in War Games and Under the Hood were excellent, the kind of freak/mob boss ideally suited to Batman, just the kind of villain the Bat needs to fight.

 

[Armored Avenger]

we have enough dark villains.

I can never have enough Dark Villains.
And i do really want the Riddler to get an intense dark revamp.

 

[Nepenthes]

But Matt Hagen just found a cave with this liquids that made him able to shapeshift for 48 hours and so he became a thief? Not really interesting

Basil Karlo is a sociopathic mofo.
Preston Payne is the typical tragic villain.

I think both are better than Hagen. Lady Clay, Claything, and if there are other one around those too, should be killed.

damm, see that's how lost I am on Clayface. I was thinking of the actor version, got the name wrong . yep Basil Karlo.


I really think it's time for a classic new villain, one that will stand the ages. I wonder if it's possible to create a villain like that nowadays. The last arch-rogue to be invented was Bane and before that Venquilotrist and Black Mask. Am I right? That's kinda lame.

 

[The Empire Ape]

where is nocturna? I want nocturna back!

 

[Sharkfestation]

Scarecrow:

Agreed on needing to make him scary again. Truthfully, in recent years, he's been little more than a joke. Perhaps he should be on a neverending quest to prove that Batman does have underlying phobias, and that he hasn't simply become immune to Crane's tricks. And maybe, perhaps, he should even succeed, exposing a fear that Bruce has kept hidden from everyone for a number of years, forcing him to painfully face whatever that fear is. I also think Crane should be a bit more murderous, actually succeeding in scaring people to death, pushing Batman to the limit to stop him, rather than taking him out with a few punches.

This is what Scarecrow should look like