Thanos = This Generation's Darth Vader

[KBX]

In 40 years time when the MCU is rebooted, after Spiderman, Fantastic Four, and X-men save the day to only see Thanos show up, for everyone to lose their minds, that’s when you know.

 

[KBX]

You know when you arrived.....

 

[Flash525]

I don't actually think Thanos is this generations Vader, at least not in terms of goals - not that anyone is specifically saying that. Vader (through Palpatine) wanted to rule the Galaxy. Thanos wanted to bring balance to the Galaxy (and by extension, the Universe) by ensuring genocide. Very different goals, very different personalities. Thanos was somewhat empathic, Vader wasn't.

 

[Kane52630]

The popularity of Thanos is staying.

 

[Boy Scout]

This generation’s Vader is probably Ledger’s Joker, if anyone.

 

[Breogan]

I guess we'll know in a decade and a half, if they are talking about doing the Thanos Prequel Trilogy, about his origin and his fall to darkness..
And then in yet another decade after that another movie trilogy about his son and grandson inevitably facing off. LOL!


Of course everyone knows the only true measure of pop culture success and popularity, is the amount of crap bootleg merchandise you generate...

When Thanos achieves this ^ level of humiliating-greatness, then we talk.

 

[Breogan]

Spoiler

Well movie was great fun, and an absolutely satisfying ending to an unprecedented multi-film franchise.
Yet after all is said and done, Thanos I'll reap the bounty of the wold I've sown, and contemplate existence, reverted to his more savage, uninteresting self, loses points.
Then his arc, sacrifice, etc... undone by the wibbly woblly timey wimey adventure team, leaves him for the most part forgettable (like most MCU villains).
And becomes a pretty laughable wet blanket the more you think about it.
While Vader's arc;
Intro (IV), Reveal(V,) and final re-Turn(VI) by way of his son, will still remain the epic villain for the ages.
No comparison.

 

[TraditionalHero]

Thanos had what... a few classic lines at best? "I am inevitable"?

Literally almost every piece of dialogue Vader utters in SW & Empire is classic and quotable.

"The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner now I am the master."

Vader was almost effing Shakespearean in his villainy.

 

[Flint Marko]

Friendly reminder that iconic status isn’t decided by jaded, middle-aged (mostly) dudes who frequent message boards. We’re all aware that your favorite characters and movies will never be topped by the shiny new one.

Iconic status is decided by the countless kids across the planet who saw Infinity War and End Game and are all but guaranteed to remember Thanos fondly as the big bad of the biggest movies ever with numerous lines that have already permeated the cultural lexicon.

Thanos is inevitable, fam.

 

[Kane52630]

Plus give it a few years... people will still remember Thanos.

 

[The Joker]

After having seen Endgame, which was the one we were all waiting on before committing to the idea of whether he is this generation's Vader or not, its blatantly obvious he is not. I would not even say he is a contender.

A villain who achieves that kind of status creates a sensation from the get-go. I haven't seen anything from the media, the audiences, any kind of general consensus that would suggest Thanos has created the kind of impact Vader had. He has not even created the kind of impact Ledger's Joker had.

Thanos is not a forgettable villain. But saying he will be remembered doesn't mean he's going to be held up to Vader's level. Or even Joker's. There's plenty of good CBM villains that are still remembered e.g. McKellan's Magneto, Doc Ock, or will be remembered like Loki. But to say Thanos is going to be Vader like status just because he was in two major superhero movies is seriously misguided. The budget or box office of a movie doesn't define the impact and status of a character. That's not how it works. Even if Anthony Russo wanted him to be.

Also a villain of that status transcends the genre they're in. Vader's not just seen as one of the greatest Sci Fi villains of all time. He's seen as one of cinema's greatest villains of all time. Ditto with Ledger's Joker, he's not confined to the CBM genre as one of the greats. He's seen as one of the all time cinema greats, too.

Will time change that for Thanos? Possible, yes. Likely, hell no.

 

[Flint Marko]

A villain who achieves that kind of status creates a sensation from the get-go. I haven't seen anything from the media, the audiences, any kind of general consensus that would suggest Thanos has created the kind of impact Vader had. He has not even created the kind of impact Ledger's Joker had.

I read this, immediately opened twitter knowing there was going to be a Thanos meme, and sure enough:



Again... it's almost like none of us here are even remotely qualified to talk about what is/is not resonating with this generation.

 

[The Joker]

All I had to do was log onto twitter to see this isn't the case, and I don't even follow superhero fans accounts.

Yes......and?

 

[Flint Marko]

Yes......and?

And your insistence that he hasn't made an impression based on your own personal experience is proving my previous point perfectly. Couldn't have planned it better, I read your post and immediately logged onto Twitter knowing I'd find a Thanos reference. And it happened within 20 seconds.

But hey you didn't love Thanos all that much so clearly that's the consensus, right?

 

[The Joker]

And your insistence that he hasn't made an impression based on your own personal experience is proving my previous point perfectly. I couldn't have planned it better.

Again, I read that snippet of your post and immediately logged onto Twitter knowing I'd find a Thanos meme. And it happened within 20 seconds.

Flint, I never said he never made any impression. I said he has not made any impact that is equivalent to Vader's or even Ledger's Joker's status. You found a meme pic of him on twitter while the movie is currently hot making a mint in theaters, and you think that means he is this generation's Vader?

 

[Flint Marko]

Flint, I never said he never made any impression. I said he has not made any impact that is equivalent to Vader's or even Ledger's Joker's status. You found a meme pic of him on twitter while the movie is currently hot making a mint in theaters, and you think that means he is this generation's Vader?

Nope! It means (relatively) older dudes on message boards aren't the ultimate barometer of these sort of things, and just so we're clear it's not just one meme.

Anyone who frequents twitter, instagram, reddit, or snapchat could tell you how prevelant Thanos and "snap" referneces have been for the past year, and not just in comic book circles. It's not going away any time soon despite your personal feelings.

 

[The Joker]

Nope! It means (relatively) older dudes on message boards aren't the ultimate barometer of these sort of things, and just so we're clear it's not just one meme.

Anyone who frequents twitter, instagram, reddit, or snapchat could tell you how prevelant Thanos and "snap" referneces have been for the past year, and not just in comic book circles. It's not going away any time soon despite your personal feelings.

Nobody's using message boards as a barometer. That's your own personal observation. Nobody else said message boards are the tell tale of a consensus. This is just a venue where someone asked it. You're the one pointing the figure at all us "relatively older" people. The public/media reaction is how you gauge these things. I've seen nothing that suggest he's made the sort of impact that Vader, or even Joker had. If you think a bunch of meme pics from one of the biggest movies of the year is equating to a character reaching Vader's status, then no offense but you are seriously misguided on this.

I have no doubt the meme pics will continue. But that doesn't paint a picture of a character who is held up as one of the all time great cinema villains. That is the truth of it despite your personal feelings. You're painting an argument that he will be remembered. Nobody said he wouldn't be.

 

[Flint Marko]

Nobody's using message boards as a barometer. That's your own observation. Nobody else said it. This is just a venue where someone asked it. The public/media reaction is how you gauge these things. If you think a bunch of meme pics from one of the biggest movies of the year is equating to a character reaching Vader's status, then no offense but you are seriously misguided on this.

I have no doubt the meme pics will continue. But that doesn't paint a picture of a character who is held up as one of the all time great cinema villains.

And what does? You personally co-signing him as one of the all-time greats?

You said you don't see anything to suggest Thanos has created an impact comparable to Vader or even Ledger's Joker, which made me think you don't venture many places on the internet. But now internet references and the general on-going pop-culture conversation around him and the snap don't count? So... what does?

 

[The Joker]

And what does? You personally co-signing him as one of the all-time greats?

You said you don't see anything to suggest Thanos has created an impact comparable to Vader or even Ledger's Joker, which made me think you don't venture many places on the internet. But now internet references and the general on-going pop-culture conversation around him and the snap don't count? So... what does?

Flint, respectfully will you stop with the stupid sarcastic jab questions. You're taking this too personally.

You know when the IT Chapter 2 trailer drops tomorrow, what are the odds you're going to see a flood of meme pics of Pennywise from that? And that's just a trailer. You going to turn around and tell me Pennywise is a villain making the same impact of Darth Vader and the Joker because we're going to get a bunch of memes across the internet of him?

I mean he even made it into shows like The Simpsons just from the first movie alone;

Does that mean Pennywise is a Darth Vader caliber villain?

 

[Flint Marko]

Flint, respectfully will you stop with the stupid sarcastic jab questions. You're taking this too personally.

You know when the IT Chapter 2 trailer drops tomorrow, what are the odds you're going to see a flood of meme pics of Pennywise from that? And that's just a trailer. You going to turn around and tell me Pennywise is making the same impact of Darth Vader and the Joker because we're going to get a bunch of memes across the internet?

Who is taking anything personally? I want to know what would it would take for you to consider him a contender beyond your own personal assessment.

Earlier you said it was making an impact comparable to Vader or Joker beyond box office dominance and widespread acclaim, so I pointed to the continued conversations that have persisted over the past year about him and the snap that remain a mainstay of most corners of the internet. But now those don't count?

If the Pennywise memes continued on a near daily basis for the next year and IT went on to make 2 billion at the box office with widespread acclaim then yeah, I'd say Pennywise has earned his place as a contender alongside Ledger and Thanos.

 

[The Joker]

Who is taking anything personally? I want to know what would it would take for you to consider him a contender beyond your own personal assessment.

Earlier you said it was making an impact comparable to Vader or Joker beyond box office dominance and widespread acclaim, so I pointed to the continued conversations that have persisted over the past year about him and the snap that remain a mainstay of most corners of the internet. But now those don't count?

If the Pennywise memes continued on a near daily basis for the next year and IT went on to make 2 billion at the box office with widespread acclaim then yeah, I'd say Pennywise has earned his place as a contender alongside Ledger and Thanos.

Ok, then respectfully please stop with the "What makes it great, you co-signing it?" jab remarks. We've been pals for over 10 years since the days of the Raimi Sony Spidey forums. You've known me longer than most here, and know I don't make silly make judgements like that. I've always shown you respect, even when we disagreed on something.

There's continued conversations about Thanos over the last year because he has a new movie on the way, and ended another huge movie on a hell of a cliffhanger with Infinity War. This franchise is always been majorly discussed, and Thanos just wiped out half of the MCU in Infinity War. Then we had Endgame coming and marketing pumping out for that. Naturally he was a hot topic of discussion.

But I have never seen any kind of consensus that has held Thanos up to the level of Vader, or even Joker level status as a villain. Never. You've been giving examples how he will be remembered, and how he is currently a hot topic of discussion. Again naturally he is a hot topic of discussion because the movie is hot right now. As for being remembered, I don't think anyone argued he would be forgotten. There's plenty of great CBM villains who are still remembered from years ago. But there's a huge difference between being remembered and being held up as one of the all time cinema greats, which is exactly what Vader is. I've yet to see a shred of proof that shows the audiences or any kind of consensus considers him Vader level in that regard.

 

[Flint Marko]

Ok, then respectfully please stop with the "What makes it great, you co-signing it?" jab remarks. We've been pals for over 10 years since the days of the Raimi Sony Spidey forums. You've known me longer than most here, and know I don't make silly make judgements like that. I've always shown you respect, even when we disagreed on something.

There's continued conversations about Thanos over the last year because he has a new movie on the way, and ended another huge movie on a hell of a cliffhanger with Infinity War. This franchise is always been majorly discussed, and Thanos just wiped out half of the MCU in Infinity War. Then we had Endgame coming and marketing pumping out for that. Naturally he was a hot topic of discussion.

But I have never seen any kind of consensus that has held Thanos up to the level of Vader, or even Joker level status as a villain. Never. You've been giving examples how he will be remembered, and how he is currently a hot topic of discussion. Again naturally he is a hot topic of discussion because the movie is hot right now. As for being remembered, I don't think anyone argued he would be forgotten. There's plenty of great CBM villains who are still remembered from years ago. But there's a huge difference between being remembered and being held up as one of the all time cinema greats, which is exactly what Vader is. I've yet to see a shred of proof that shows the audiences or any kind of consensus considers him Vader level in that regard.

I genuinely apologize for giving off the impression I was getting heated or personal. We've been friends for a minute and I don't want to impede that off a disagreement as silly as this.

That said, I genuinely don't know what more it would take for a villain to be a contender. There's no objective measure for this sort of thing but if there were I believe Thanos would check practically every box at this point given how inescapable his presence has been for the past year in the general cultural conversation, along with the fact that his movies have dominated the box office in ways we haven't seen in quite some time.

We can agree to disagree, but I really do want to know the tangible things you look for when deciding something like this.

 

[The Joker]

I genuinely apologize for giving off the impression I was getting heated or personal. We've been friends for a minute and I don't want to impede that off a disagreement as silly as this. Written text is obviously not the best way to communicate and I

That said, I genuinely don't know what more it would take for a villain to be a contender. There's no objective measure for this sort of thing but if there were I believe Thanos would check practically every box at this point given how inescapable his presence has been for the past year in most corners of the internet.

Appreciate it, man. No harm done. We're still good.

You're right there's no exact science to measure stuff like this, but to do a comparison, even though its 11 years ago its the most 'recent' one I can think of that most here might remember so they'll recollect it, too. Joker in TDK back in 2008. It wasn't internet memes or how often people were talking about him that gave us the early signs that an all time great villain was here. It was what people were saying about him. He was being hailed one of the best villains ever. People were going nuts over his performance. People in the movie industry outside the genre were heaping praise on his Joker. There was Oscars talk from the get-go e.g.

Ledger's Joker 'one of ultimate villains'
Posthumous Oscar for Heath Ledger's Joker Performance?

It was basically Joker mania. Since its been 11 years, and he's retained this godly status all those years as a villain, we know it wasn't because of rose tinted glasses over Ledger's sad passing. He was genuinely that good. I wasn't around when the original Star Wars movie came out, or old enough to remember the impact the sequels had when they were released. This was days with no internet. So Vader's status I imagine was gauged strictly on word of mouth, and held over the decades into the digital age. People were as impressed with him then as they are now.

 

[starscream]

Agreed.

 

[Reek]

No he's not. Characters like Vader and the Joker have had such long term effect, the comparison can't even be made yet.

I feel like this thread should have ended here lol