The Brave and the Bold News and Discussion Thread

[Andrew92]

I do love how normally a Batman movie leads to people getting real ambitious about big name, top shelf talent and we're discussing... The most adequate of the adequate lol

So depressing.

 

[Invader Joker]

Gotta say a lot of these names are not really moving the needle for me in terms of "James Gunn really is the best person to direct this". Maybe Whannell but still.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Gotta say a lot of these names are not really moving the needle for me in terms of "James Gunn really is the best person to direct this". Maybe Whannell but still.

Gunn is a fundamentally unacceptable choice as far as I’m concerned because he’s already doing Superman. This movie is isn’t particularly worth making and is fundamentally redundant already, I don’t know why you’d want it to be redundant in a whole other way. The point of these characters should be to have as wide a variety of tones and styles as possible.

I love Gunn. Gunn’s style is great. I only need it in very, very limited doses. It’s part of why I wish he was just doing his own little fiefdom of TSS adjacent projects.

 

[flickchick85]

I never wanted Gunn on Superman but I feel like I'd want him on Batman even less. What a terrible fit that would be.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I never wanted Gunn on Superman but I feel like I'd want him on Batman even less. What a terrible fit that would be.

The thought of Gunn’s Damian gives me nightmares lmao. I can already see what he sees in Morrison’s Batman if you view it in the context of his style and it is uhhh… rather divorced from what is actually special about those comics!!

Like. I’m a huge Matt Reeves fan, he’d make a wildly better Superman movie than Gunn will and I still wouldn’t have wanted him to do it.

 

[Invader Joker]

Gunn is a fundamentally unacceptable choice as far as I’m concerned because he’s already doing Superman. This movie is isn’t particularly worth making and is fundamentally redundant already, I don’t know why you’d want it to be redundant in a whole other way. The point of these characters should be to have as wide a variety of tones and styles as possible.

I love Gunn. Gunn’s style is great. I only need it in very, very limited doses. It’s part of why I wish he was just doing his own little fiefdom of TSS adjacent projects.

If this movie is going to be made, and I think it's going to be made, it needs to be made by whoever would make the best film period. If that means getting the same guy already doing Superman so be it. There is nothing else that should matter.

 

[Invader Joker]

The thought of Gunn’s Damian gives me nightmares lmao. I can already see what he sees in Morrison’s Batman if you view it in the context of his style and it is uhhh… rather divorced from what is actually special about those comics!!

Like. I’m a huge Matt Reeves fan, he’d make a wildly better Superman movie than Gunn will and I still wouldn’t have wanted him to do it.

I don't think him doing Damian is that far-off from him doing Rocket Raccoon, which he absolutely knocked out of the park and might even be the best thing he's ever done as a creative. He's talked a lot about the reasons that he connected with Rocket and honestly a lot of those apply to Damian as well. I genuinely have no doubt that part of the film would actually be handled expertly under his guide. And that part of the film, which is also the one that's gonna separate this from any other Batman film, is the one that I think is the biggest roadblock in all of this.

There are dream choices like George Miller who'd be great at adapting this material but are kinda far-fetched. And there's also people like Dan Trachtenberg or Leigh Whannell that'd be realistic and efficient (tho even there I don't think it's a given they'd be interested in this particular story), but the thing is that I'm not sure they'd connect with Damian Wayne as a character in the way that it's pretty obvious James would or to handle this particular tone which needs to mix a bunch of really, really specific things. I know James would though, which puts him miles ahead of everyone else.


And the other guys that have been mentioned like David Gordon Green or a TV director or anything of the sort... man forget about it none of those people are actually more qualified and actually more likely to deliver a better film than James on this.

Also like. If the whole worry with this film is it not having a pure creative vision because it's a studio job, wouldn't you rather have a film that's actually 100% James own vision rather than his vision filtered through someone else?

 

[SwordOfMorning]

If this movie is going to be made, and I think it's going to be made, it needs to be made by whoever would make the best film period. If that means getting the same guy already doing Superman so be it. There is nothing else that should matter.

Thing is: the only reason Gunn seems like the best option for it is because the movie is being made in a fundamentally ass backwards way based on an outdated model which exists to make shareholders think they're getting the next MCU (spoiler alert: they aren't). It's an assignment being given by Gunn to someone. I love Gunn's movies, I think GOTG are some of the best CBMs ever (Vol. 3 is my favourite MCU movie by a landslide), but Gunn is not even close to being one of the best directors in the industry, he wouldn't be in my top ten directors for Batman. If Gunn feels like the only good option then it's not because he's the best but because the role he has at DC frankly probably shouldn't exist in the first place and it's a completely self-created problem.

I don't think him doing Damian is that far-off from him doing Rocket Raccoon, which he absolutely knocked out of the park and might even be the best thing he's ever done as a creative. He's talked a lot about the reasons that he connected with Rocket and honestly a lot of those apply to Damian as well. I genuinely have no doubt that part of the film would actually be handled expertly under his guide. And that part of the film, which is also the one that's gonna separate this from any other Batman film, is the one that I think is the biggest roadblock in all of this.

There are dream choices like George Miller who'd be great at adapting this material but are kinda far-fetched. And there's also people like Dan Trachtenberg or Leigh Whannell that'd be realistic and efficient (tho even there I don't think it's a given they'd be interested in this particular story), but the thing is that I'm not sure they'd connect with Damian Wayne as a character in the way that it's pretty obvious James would or to handle this particular tone which needs to mix a bunch of really, really specific things. I know James would though, which puts him miles ahead of everyone else.


And the other guys that have been mentioned like David Gordon Green or a TV director or anything of the sort... man forget about it none of those people are actually more qualified and actually more likely to deliver a better film than James on this.

Also like. If the whole worry with this film is it not having a pure creative vision because it's a studio job, wouldn't you rather have a film that's actually 100% James own vision rather than his vision filtered through someone else?

I don't even think Gunn is the best DCU director for this movie. I'd take James Mangold over him on this without a second thought, both because Mangold is a better director and because I'd trust him vastly more to do Damian well.

 

[Invader Joker]

Thing is: the only reason Gunn seems like the best option for it is because the movie is being made in a fundamentally ass backwards way based on an outdated model which exists to make shareholders think they're getting the next MCU (spoiler alert: they aren't). It's an assignment being given by Gunn to someone. I love Gunn's movies, I think GOTG are some of the best CBMs ever (Vol. 3 is my favourite MCU movie by a landslide), but Gunn is not even close to being one of the best directors in the industry, he wouldn't be in my top ten directors for Batman. If Gunn feels like the only good option then it's not because he's the best but because the role he has at DC frankly probably shouldn't exist in the first place and it's a completely self-created problem.


I don't even think Gunn is the best DCU director for this movie. I'd take James Mangold over him on this without a second thought, both because Mangold is a better director and because I'd trust him vastly more to do Damian well.

I don't actually think Mangold is a realistic choice for this tho lol If he wanted to do this he'd already be doing it. Like obviously if we could assume that absolutely any director one could think of would be interested in directing this film then there are choices that I guess can seem more exciting than James, George Miller is another example. The problem is that, beyond the whole "cinematic universe problem" (I really think you way overblow that) I do think the source material does limit the scope of the type of directors that'd even be interested in the project, because while a ton of them would be interested in doing a Batman movie, I think the type of balance that this movie requires is so mega specific that I can see /a lot/ going "Eh... pass."

Like I doubt that most director's idea of their dream Batman movie after watching TDK or whatever is a movie with a ninja 10 year old at Batman's side.

Gunn tho? He'd absolutely devour that. Forget about the fact he's co-CEO of DC and he came up with the existence of this film in the first place (also man, that "well it was his assignment" argument is incredibly lame. He enthusiastically took it and he's putting his whole name behind it so what difference does it make? Also it's not hard to buy at all the man is actually into Damian Wayne as Robin and actually does want this movie to get made in general as well.) if there was any Batman film he'd want to make and any Batman film that'd actually fit with his sensibilities, it's this one 100%. It has basically everything he likes. And out of the all possible directors that'd actually be definitively into all this as well as being realistic picks, yes, I will say he's the best one 100%

 

[flickchick85]

A Gunn Batman movie would be absolutely awful, I'm sorry. There's no way to spin that.

 

[J.Drangal]

A Gunn Batman movie would be absolutely awful, I'm sorry. There's no way to spin that.

Yep... Yet, I'm still putting my money (well, some of...) on it happening.

As said, Gunn chose the run he wanted that new Batman iteration to draw from, and it happens to be the one where it's very easy to guess what he sees in it and how much he could do something with it (for better or worse). He also said that Batman was his favorite character and he's now in a position to use him if he wants to. I mean... I'm not saying Gunn is 100% the guy to direct the TBATB movie, but it wouldn't surprise me at all. In fact, the more I think about it, the more confused I am that he wouldn't.

Anyway, my personal suggestion remains to take a time machine and bring in 80s David Lynch to take care of that film, by making it like a mash-up between Batman 66' and Twin Peaks.
Otherwise, I'm not interested. ( ?)

 

[Invader Joker]

A Gunn Batman movie would be absolutely awful, I'm sorry. There's no way to spin that.

If he was adapting Year One or The Dark Knight Returns or something like that maybe, but in this specific case he fits the tone extremely well. The co-lead is a 10 year old ninja assassin for crying outloud. And it'll have an ensemble element with the Bat-Family as well as fantastical villains and stuff of that nature. It fits him ridiculously well, even better at a glance than Superman.

 

[king666]

Gunn is far from the best pick for a solo Batman movie.

My lukewarm take is that they should not even be making this movie until Reeves is done with his saga. Why we need a solo DCU Batman movie is beyond me.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Gunn is far from the best pick for a solo Batman movie.

My lukewarm take is that they should not even be making this movie until Reeves is done with his saga. Why we need a solo DCU Batman movie is beyond me.

More content for the mill! Milk the property for all its worth until it has no value and no longer feels even mildly special or exciting!

 

[Invader Joker]

Gunn is far from the best pick for a solo Batman movie.

My lukewarm take is that they should not even be making this movie until Reeves is done with his saga. Why we need a solo DCU Batman movie is beyond me.

But this isn't just a Batman movie. It's a Batman and Damian Wayne Robin movie. Which is what makes him perfect for it imo

 

[emielaen]

I mean, is it not obvious why they wanna make a Batman movie in their DC universe lol it ain’t rocket science

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I mean, is it not obvious why they wanna make a Batman movie in their DC universe lol it ain’t rocket science

I think everyone gets that, it's just not exactly a fandom unifying idea that doing a DC universe to begin with is a good idea. Or that over exposing Batman is a good idea. I have been a giant Batman fan since I was a child like most of us but I would be perfectly happy to just get a Reeves/Pattinson movie every five years for now, I don't particularly need new Batman movies to begin with so they're only really appealing to me if they're something really special.

What I keep coming back to is Bond: one at a time and infrequent enough that it feels like a valuable occasion when one of these comes out.

 

[Boom]

I'd be perfectly happy if the DCU Batman only showed up as a supporting character in other shows/movies for the first few years.

If this movie got cancelled tomorrow I probably wouldn't even blink. Unless it starts stacking talent that's too good to ignore, I can very easily do without this for the foreseeable future.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I'd be perfectly happy if the DCU Batman only showed up as a supporting character in other shows/movies for the first few years.

If this movie got cancelled tomorrow I probably wouldn't even blink. Unless it starts stacking talent that's too good to ignore, I can very easily do without this for the foreseeable future.

DCU Batman showing up in supporting roles to build hype rather than over saturating the market with Batman branded content is so obviously the correct route lol

Yeah, I feel the same. It's just so... fundamentally superflous. Morrison's Batman is my favourite Batman stuff and the Bat Family is my favourite aspect of the character but like... you're never going to actually get what makes Morrison's comics special in a movie and I'm pretty skeptical about how well fleshed out the Bat Family would actually be on film. Especially given this is a franchise that thus far has hired such amazing high calibre talent like Andy Muschietti and Craig Gillespie and has the most vanilla casting of a big property in recent memory. I'd love to be excited, I'm not even pretentious about shared universes being inherently bad for characters on any level, but it's just red flag city.

 

[king666]

I mean, is it not obvious why they wanna make a Batman movie in their DC universe lol it ain’t rocket science

It makes sense from a creative/universe-building standpoint, but considering the overall context of the DC brand (i.e. the success of The Batman franchise) it doesn't make sense to me.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Gotta endless chase imaginary MCU money. Definition of insanity.

 

[Boom]

I mean, is it not obvious why they wanna make a Batman movie in their DC universe lol it ain’t rocket science

This could just as easily have been an animated show or movie.

 

[Invader Joker]

It makes sense from a creative/universe-building standpoint, but considering the overall context of the DC brand (i.e. the success of The Batman franchise) it doesn't make sense to me.

I don't really think they can rely purely on The Batman franchise at this point.

 

[Invader Joker]

This could just as easily have been an animated show or movie.

The whole point of doing solo projects before big crossover is so people get familiarized with the characters so they have a larger impact when they do crossover. An animated show would defeat the purpose.

 

[Boom]

I'm sure people are very familiarized with Batman as a character at this point.

Animated show/movie for the DCU Bat Family, then supporting role/s in other live-action projects. Seems perfectly reasonable to me, though I suspect you'll disagree.