The Confederate flag

[Wylie Times]

You're right. Taking down the Confederate flag from government buildings is one thing, and it seems that even most southerners are understanding that State Capitals shouldn't be flying a flag representing a failed rebellion But going after historic sites, memorials, museums, etc. would definitely turn the South against the movement.

The Union could have hanged Lee and Davis for being traitors, but it would have been counterproductive in trying to put the nation back together. Sometimes you have to look the other way in the interest of peace. The boot-to-throat approach to diplomacy doesn't work. All it does it leads to a spiteful population itching for revenge. We found that out the hard way with the Treaty of Versailles after World War I.

Many people from that south are heading that movement.

I really don't think people are understanding how black southerns feel about this type of thing.

Much of the history of the Confederacy is white washed to make white soldiers and generals to be heroic figures while black people are virtually erased or only spoken of as slaves (rather than enslaved people).

That's done while at the same time it takes near herculean efforts for any positive history relating to black southerners to be acknowledged. Many southern states also make a point to hold holidays for confederate generals on the SAME DAY as Martin Luther King day.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Well, that does need to end. It's one thing to say Lee was one hell of a general. Another to celebrate his birthday.

But then I feel that state-obligated celebration of anyone's birthday is rather pointless.

You really think Martin Luther King would be thrilled that kids get a day off to play Xbox and surf the web?

 

[Wylie Times]

Well, that does need to end. It's one thing to say Lee was one hell of a general. Another to celebrate his birthday.

But then I feel that state-obligated celebration of anyone's birthday is rather pointless.

You really think Martin Luther King would be thrilled that kids get a day off to play Xbox and surf the web?

It's supposed to be a day of remembrance but it's become just a day off for most people. Doesn't help that people buy into the Disney version of Martin Luther King.

I'd much rather Junteenth be a nationally recognized holiday. But a LOT of people worked hard to get Martin Luther King day recognized.

Funny that for all the talk of southern Heritage and southern pride most white Southerns don't even know what Junteenth is.

 

[NotFadeAway]

Two things, and it may be a little off topic....

One, the confederate flag being removed does not bother. It's a symbol of racism, oppression, and if I may be so dramatic it's the banner of enemy that wanted to destroy the United States. The Confederate flag should have been treated as the Nazi flag is in Germany today. It particularly rubs me the wrong way when I see northern rednecks waving it around as a sign that they are "country".

But two, and this is where I may get off topic but I'm voicing frustration, while I agree with the voice of people denouncing the confederate flag....how come a blind eye is turned when citizens, even celebrities, openly walk on, spit on, and set a flame the flag of the United States? Or when students on college campuses wave ISIS flags? Those a-holes get the get left alone or even defended, while those that wave the confederate flag are denounced. Which they SHOULD be, but shouldn't these other groups draw flame as well?

 

[warhorse78]

Two things, and it may be a little off topic....

One, the confederate flag being removed does not bother. It's a symbol of racism, oppression, and if I may be so dramatic it's the banner of enemy that wanted to destroy the United States. The Confederate flag should have been treated as the Nazi flag is in Germany today. It particularly rubs me the wrong way when I see northern rednecks waving it around as a sign that they are "country".

But two, and this is where I may get off topic but I'm voicing frustration, while I agree with the voice of people denouncing the confederate flag....how come a blind eye is turned when citizens, even celebrities, openly walk on, spit on, and set a flame the flag of the United States? Or when students on college campuses wave ISIS flags? Those a-holes get the get left alone or even defended, while those that wave the confederate flag are denounced. Which they SHOULD be, but shouldn't these other groups draw flame as well?

Double standards? I always wondered about things like that. Many of my co-workers are from other countries, and they have their country flags all over their cars, homes and one even has a business and their country flag is waving right in the front, and I'm like, WTF? They praise their country, but I'm like, if your country is so great, then why are you living and working here? Their remarks, the living quality, welfare and job opportunities are better in the USA than any other country for immigrants, but their hearts will be forever in honor to their home country. I don't understand this line of thinking. I'm like, your home country betrayed you in providing a good way of life, so why honor them when they did not honor you? Another thing that kind of had my eyebrows raised. Olympic level athletes that train in the USA, but compete for another country. The United States seems to be the place to train for many athletes, because again, of the quality of the enviroments, trainers, coaches and other resources, but then again, they are using our resources and way of life to train for their medals, shouldn't they then at least credit the USA for providing that crucial tool to help them achieve their Olympic dream?

 

[Wylie Times]

Double standards? I always wondered about things like that. Many of my co-workers are from other countries, and they have their country flags all over their cars, homes and one even has a business and their country flag is waving right in the front, and I'm like, WTF? They praise their country, but I'm like, if your country is so great, then why are you living and working here? Their remarks, the living quality, welfare and job opportunities are better in the USA than any other country for immigrants, but their hearts will be forever in honor to their home country. I don't understand this line of thinking. I'm like, your home country betrayed you in providing a good way of life, so why honor them when they did not honor you? Another thing that kind of had my eyebrows raised. Olympic level athletes that train in the USA, but compete for another country. The United States seems to be the place to train for many athletes, because again, of the quality of the enviroments, trainers, coaches and other resources, but then again, they are using our resources and way of life to train for their medals, shouldn't they then at least credit the USA for providing that crucial tool to help them achieve their Olympic dream?

It's not that hard to grasp nor is it unique to people to immigrate to the U.S.

It's no different from people who are born and raised in Texas, but later move to and spend the rest of their lives in another state. Many of them still love the state and see themselves as Texans but go live somewhere else for various reasons.

Also lets not pretend as if many a people don't treat their nationality as a part of their identity.

Plus there's such a thing as dual citizenship.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

There are college kids with ISIS flags in their dorms?

Damn, that's pathetic.

Though I wouldn't call it a double standard until I see those flags on vehicles and state buildings.

 

[zeroapoc]

Some levity...

 

[Thundercrack85]

I do think it's a bit silly for Amazon and eBay to stop selling Confederate flags while still selling Nazi themed merchandise.

 

[Asteroid-Man]

So I was reading through the American Constitution and Bill of Rights and its inherently flawed in the way it's written. It barely covered much, which is why there have been so many amendments, and then so many of the amendments are for specific situations.

It should just be completely re-written, or a charter or rights and freedoms should be introduced similar to that of Canada with the addendum that your rights are only valid so long as they do not interfere with the rights of others (then when crossing rights "right to freedom of speech" vs "right to religion/race/culture/gender" cross paths, the court can set a precedence, which in Canada, free speech falls second to the aforementioned rights (this is backed by the Criminal Code of Canada, sections 318 and 319 on "Hate Propaganda"))

 

[Thundercrack85]

You're not American, are you?

 

[Lead Cenobite]

So I've heard WB are pulling General Lee die cast cars from shelves. Should The Dukes of Hazzard be given the Cosby treatment because of the car? I say it shouldn't, I was a Dukes of Hazzard fanatic as a child and I honestly don't believe the show was racist, and likewise, I don't think everyone who displays the confederate flag is doing so to support slavery or racism. I also think the media has paid way too much attention to the flag compared to the actual mass murder committed by Dylan Roof.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

So I've heard WB are pulling General Lee die cast cars from shelves. Should The Dukes of Hazzard be given the Cosby treatment because of the car? I say it shouldn't, I was a Dukes of Hazzard fanatic as a child and I honestly don't believe the show was racist, and likewise, I don't think everyone who displays the confederate flag is doing so to support slavery or racism. I also think the media has paid way too much attention to the flag compared to the actual mass murder committed by Dylan Roof.

Agreed. Seems people have focused way too much on his affinity for the Confederate flag and not the other things more important in the actual crime. I just ring it up as another case of drive-by activism by certain groups to make themselves feel important. They'll move on to the next thing to be offended by or campaign for in the next month or so.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

You're not American, are you?

He's Canadian so I guess we have to forgive him for not understanding certain American things. I'm sure Canada has some wonky things in their government documents that some Americans wouldn't understand as well.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I don't know about forgiving.

I'm European.

 

[Lighthouse]

John Adams is my favorite founding father. Between defending the soldiers at the Boston Massacre, his abolitionism, and his no bull**** attitude made him not well liked, but it made me like him even more. Also, people should read the letters between Adams and Jefferson in their later years. Some of the best writing I've ever seen.

 

[Asteroid-Man]

He's Canadian so I guess we have to forgive him for not understanding certain American things. I'm sure Canada has some wonky things in their government documents that some Americans wouldn't understand as well.

The unfortunate thing is Americanism spills into Canada - so sometimes, we're all like "awesome, this stuff is pretty cool!" and other times we're like "...wtf? Seriously guys?"

 

[Warhammer]

I also think the media has paid way too much attention to the flag compared to the actual mass murder committed by Dylan Roof.

Duh. It was specifically a group of minorities who were killed. That gets a few days maybe. And the killer was a young, white dude. He was a very sick boy who needs help.

 

[regwec]

I think each Southern state should have a referendum concerning its use on public buildings. A wide debate on it should be had, before people are asked to make up their minds. I fear that simply proscribing something, in response to a terrible crime, would lead many people who had felt that flag was part of their identity to consider themselves to be criminalised to some extent.

I really don't think individuals should be banned from flying it themselves. That would empower the flag too much, as a symbol of defiance, among the wrong kind of people.

As for retailers withdrawing products that feature it: that's up to them. Those who are offended by the decision can buy their groceries elsewhere.

 

[NotFadeAway]

It's not that hard to grasp nor is it unique to people to immigrate to the U.S.

It's no different from people who are born and raised in Texas, but later move to and spend the rest of their lives in another state. Many of them still love the state and see themselves as Texans but go live somewhere else for various reasons.

Also lets not pretend as if many a people don't treat their nationality as a part of their identity.

Plus there's such a thing as dual citizenship.

Ahhh yes, that nationality is a part of that identity. And I respect that. I'm a grandson of German immigrants.

BUT, I instantly stop respecting that the moment those people start taking a crap all over the United States, it's way of life, it's history, and yes it's flag.

 

[NotFadeAway]

There are college kids with ISIS flags in their dorms?

Damn, that's pathetic.

Though I wouldn't call it a double standard until I see those flags on vehicles and state buildings.

I would love to take these college kids and their far left liberal professors and just drop them in the middle of an ISIS stronghold. I want to see them talk their way out of that one!!!

 

[SV Fan]

I don't get why people in the South have such high regard for the flag. One it's a flag that symbolizes traitors to the country(I thought the South love claiming how they love America, but they seem to take pride in a flag that says otherwise) and it also symbolizes that they lost and got their butts handed to them on a platter. Move on

 

[NotFadeAway]

I don't get why people in the South have such high regard for the flag. One it's a flag that symbolizes traitors to the country(I thought the South love claiming how they love America, but they seem to take pride in a flag that says otherwise) and it also symbolizes that they lost and got their butts handed to them on a platter. Move on

That's also my take on the confederate flag. Not only does it represent slavery, but traitors to the real flag.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

That's also my take on the confederate flag. Not only does it represent slavery, but traitors to the real flag.

The American flag is a flag of treason itself. If we don't want to be flying the flag of traitors, we should all be flying the Union Jack.

EDIT: Or the Mexican flag, for those in Texas.

 

[Wylie Times]

I think each Southern state should have a referendum concerning its use on public buildings. A wide debate on it should be had, before people are asked to make up their minds. I fear that simply proscribing something, in response to a terrible crime, would lead many people who had felt that flag was part of their identity to consider themselves to be criminalised to some extent.

I really don't think individuals should be banned from flying it themselves. That would empower the flag too much, as a symbol of defiance, among the wrong kind of people.

As for retailers withdrawing products that feature it: that's up to them. Those who are offended by the decision can buy their groceries elsewhere.

People have been trying to get rid of that flag for decades. The debates have been had over and over again. It just sucks that it took the deaths of nine people for folks to finally get the point.

You're never gonna see the flag banned from personal use. That's actually Un-American, but I do think we might finally see certain institutions and businesses stop using the flag and ban it from their premises.