The Death of Batman

I suspect the dude hates batman and doesn't understand anything about the character. This is some trashy torture porn stuff.

The whole twist about the dude being innocent is stupide. The way he tells his story, it's impossible someone as smart as batman, and supposedly the world's greatest detective, would arrest a dude just because he's near a crime scene.

It was really badly written, out of character, and trashy. Batman being tased in the balls, then raped, then killing himself because he's a sore losern is really nothing more than the bad fantasies of a sick mind.
 
I don't understand the contempt towards the film.

It reminded me of the various stories told throughout the issues of "Batman: Black and White," especially Brian Bolland's short story "An Innocent Guy"...in so much as in that story, you see a scenario of Batman being shot through the head and killed by a hapless nobody.

That's the tradition that this film is operating in.

The thing people fail to understand not just with Batman but with serialized fictional characters in general is that they represent limitless canvases where decades upon decades of creative talents are afforded the opportunity to do to them whatever they will because the templates of the characters are durable...something that "Batman & Robin" screenwriter Akiva Goldsman attested to.

I'd rather have 75+ years worth of Batman stories from various points of view and perspectives and backgrounds where creators take the character and bend and twist and break and manipulate to their creative whims and impulses.

I mean think about this. There's plenty of Batman material in Japan where the Japenese interpret the character in a number of different ways than Americans do. For example, in their culture a character who wears a cape can fly...and so there are mangas where Batman can fly.

What if there are different elements in Batman that a Spanish writer would choose to intensify? Or a Russian writer? Or an abstract artist or interpretive dancer? Or, in the case of works like this fan film and Joel Schumacher's films, they attempt to portray the homoerotic undertones of the character?

Giving creators the ability and liberty to be inventive with Batman is what makes Batman a cultural icon.

I mean on the one hand, a Campbell's Soup Can is certainly just a container of soup if that's the only one albeit boring angle you want to look at it...but put it in Andy Warhol's hands and it becomes an iconic piece of pop art.

The same idea applies to Batman.
 
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I think what you don't understand is that nobody is against the idea of a different perspective. we're not against batman being killed off in a story.

that being said, this short movie is really stupidly written, filled with bad characterization, and only aim for shock values.

I fail to see how having batman being raped by a nobody he sent in prison just because he was on a crime scene is inventive.
 
I think saw this? Back in 06 or 07 maybe? But I think I had to stop the video, it was too awful.

Was Bale's sister really in this? :hehe:
 
What the...

Maybe he got angry against her because of that?
 
I think what you don't understand is that nobody is against the idea of a different perspective. we're not against batman being killed off in a story.

that being said, this short movie is really stupidly written, filled with bad characterization, and only aim for shock values.

I fail to see how having batman being raped by a nobody he sent in prison just because he was on a crime scene is inventive.

No, you're focusing on the wrong element.

The concept of the rape is a bi-product and a conceit for the story being told.

The inventiveness and entire point of the film is in the examination of Batman's hubris, which is a territory where most Batman stories don't actually go because then they get accused of being out of character...and yet the concept itself, the idea of responding to personal tragedy by creating a physical manifestation of the super ego in the desire to forever maintain the control Bruce didn't have that night...is absolutely fertile for any and all scrutiny.

So at the beginning of the film, he is "Batman," quotations intended because he's fulfilling the obligatory role and standing on the pedestal fans and, in the case of this film himself, put him on. He's powerful, he's imposing, he's spewing Keaton-style one-liners and the addict confirms "I'M the coward, YOU'RE the hero." All of this is deliberate...exaggerated by the irony that his pride and over-confidence makes him vulnerable and he's brought down.

Once captured, he's posed like a statue or award figure. He's the persona, the ideal and he's bound (chained) to that, refusing to allow himself to be human. He's not human...he's not capable of making mistakes...he's perfect.

This symbol of perfection is brought to a head by the fact that Batman's awarded "Gotham's Man of the Year" but irony strikes again with the brutal reality. Fans make the mistake of putting Batman on that pedestal when what really makes him fascinating IS his humanity and fallibility, because it's great to see him come up against obstacles and overcome them.

That said, this is clearly taking a darker turn by NOT allowing Batman to win and again, I feel that's a deliberate choice when one observes the film as a cautionary tale against hubris.

The minute Batman starts feeding into his ego and the persona, thinking he can do no wrong, is the minute that mistakes are made. This film not only creates a scenario where that, in fact, does happen...but it takes it to its extreme conclusion by not allowing Batman off the hook and having him pay for it with his dignity and ultimately his life.

I'm fine with that because again, the entire point of Batman and other serialized characters is that their essences are durable and afforded artistic liberties and skewing.

Now do I agree with the idea of Batman being anally raped? No.

But I'm not throwing my hands up in the air over it or saying it's not Batman because I've done one of two things as a responsible audience member...I've either tapped into the filmmakers' intentions and recognized what they're trying to say regardless of how they're saying it or I've found meaning in their work for myself that justifies the means to that end.

Besides, the character isn't one omnipotent thing. It can't be ruined by the efforts of individual creators. Adaptation isn't actually adaptation at all. It's the process of creating a separate, alternate iteration that will follow its own path of circumstances and destinies.

We have multiple Batman's. One had his parents killed by the Joker ("Batman"). Another went into exile for 8 years ("The Dark Knight Rises"). Another discovered that Selina Kyle was a witness to his parent's murder ("Gotham")...and this one pays the ultimate price for his vanity and pride.

They're all Batman in as much as framework. What's fascinating is seeing what the individual filmmakers, writers and artists throughout history do to contort, manipulate, even break the character within that framework.
 
There are tons of examples of how batman is faillible in the comics, and they don't hit you in the ehad with shock scene just for the sake of shock value. Batman is far from being perfect in the mythos, Jason Todd died under his watch, he's been beaten people who weren't guilty (Solomon Grundy in The Long Halloween comes to mind), he's been on the edge of losing his humanity several times (bruce wayne murderer/fugitive), he has been a jerk to the people he loves most (alfred several times, including the dark knight rises, or officer down).

This fan film is not trying anything new. It's just adding some nonsense because it thinks it's cleverer than it is.

the whole "batman is being brought down by his ego and is captive and deshumanised" has been down way better in batman the cult as well.

The rape thing is stupid, but what makes this fan fic a bad representation of the character, is that the characterization is simply bad. Batman is a character that can be interpreted in really different ways. He can be a dark knight, a bright hero, a romantic figure of the night. But there are still important features that all those takes share: he's a vigilante who wouldn't throw a dude in jail just because he was near a crime scene. That whole twist is what makes this story supposedly relevant. and yet, it doesn't make sense with one of the most important feature of batman: he's the world's greatest detective. That doesn't mean he can't fail as a detective. That doesn't mean he always win. But that does mean he wouldn't throw an innocent dude in jail just because he was there. which is (mostly) why this fan film is a failure.

Unlike what you say, there are a lot of stories about how he tries to convince himself bruce is a maks, in order to maintain control and to avoid facing personal tragedy again. Prey comes to mind.

All those stories were better written than this. I don't care if it's a fan film or not. It's simply badly written from point A to point B, and it's also gross for the sake of shock value. You wanna see an intelligent fan film who deals with how fragile bruce's psyche can be? Watch the batman complex. It's in a whole another league when it comes to the writing, and the way it's edited is incredible. Granted, the dude didn't have to shoot a movie and all, which is a work that can, in itself, be respected, but his ideas are way better than this fan film.
 
But he clearly didn't throw him in jail just for being there. The circumstances of the crime painted a picture where he figured the man was involved. Batman made a judgment call that ended up being wrong because again...he's human.

I didn't say anything about there not being stories that examine Batman's humanity and fallability before. If you read it again, I said it's a territory where "most" Batman stories tend not to go...and if you focus your attention onto fan film, then it becomes a territory where no other Batman fan film goes.
 
True. I still think the execution is terrible though.
 

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