Age of Extinction Transformers 4 USER REVIEW THREAD

[Marvin]

Show me an example form G1 Transformers where someone spewed an innuendo similar to "best hands in the state for working my stick". We know what Bay was doing with the comments too, trying to make the character of Cade uncomfortable given his anti-dating stance. He took it too far considering the age ramifications of the characters.



They've never come right out and said things like that, it's always been innuendo, just like Sam Witwicki's "happy time" in the first TF.

Yes, Cade was made to feel uncomfortable with the implications. Not only that his daughter is seeing some jock under his know, but he is of the mind to take that information and skew it in a way only an over protective anti teen sex father would. Compare this to bad boys one where Martin Lawrence' character, thinking his partner is sleeping with his own wife due to his STATE OF MIND and characterization and all that is implied to play this up and drive his character crazy. That's the crux of the innuendo in the TF4 situation, implication. It's not like he said sally hawkins has the best hands in texas. He said it about someone that clearly does, as proven twice in the script. But that's beside the point, I'm not really trying to explain the movie to anyone(as I see it).

In Beast Wars, a good amount of blackarachnia's 'work' on male characters was done by way of sexual innuendo and coxing.

I actually think the handled the 'talk' in TF1 pretty tastefully and fun. As if it was an ep of fresh prince or even cosby imo. If it felt awkward that's because adolescent(teen rather) sex is supposed to, it also happens.

 

[Rock Sexton]

That one film supposedly has more than the other(I'll respect the no pissing contest sentiment, though I will say stark has plenty more such things in his wheel house including masterbation and debaucherous jokes of his own) is actually beside the point. the issue was that of one film containing 'booger eater humor' as you called it. The sheer presence of it annoyed you. For I doubt you are going to argue that all the humor in the TF films is of that ilk(dad buys the cheap car, jokes). The point I made was that this was hardly the only film to contain such things. Other pg 13 films have it to. "It's not foreign" was my sentiment.

Now, if your actual problem was a matter of quantity of this particular level of humor, to each his own I suppose. One could just as easily come down on IM in relation to TDK in this same regard. It's a matter of preference, each deck looking down at the one below and thinking themselves above imo.

It annoyed me because of the movie it's in, but moreso the sheer volume of it. It's more forgivable when it's not peppered through a film (in this case 3).

You bring up the IM example as if I defended it or said I found it humorous. You then utter vague generalities about others in the IM franchise, but seem to have a hard time actually telling me what was said or done.

 

[Marvin]

I get that this is all subjective. But can you at least understand why several of us feel that a movie franchise which takes the time to showcase giant metal balls on a robot in the middle of a battle scene, and has comedic beats that are pretty similar to this regularly peppered throughout each movie, just might be a little more childish than your average summer blockbuster?

I do get it. And I get that you don't like it. I also think you have every right to feel as such. I personally draw the line when it goes beyond that however. Into declarations of right and wrong and greater quality and rules and such. Among other things, it just waves the flag of double standard imo.

There just seems to be greater stinks raised about all things TF, like people draw some line on every or any issue.
[YT]a6Rge7sc6ls[/YT] I know these sorts of comedies work because they are littered throughout all sorts of comedies and films. Bay has taken it upon himself to, instead of making something of the Godzilla tone, to infuse his tacky actioner's with his personal style of comedy. An artistic liberty. Now people can debate all day as to whether it's a good idea or not, a good execution or not, but he's found a cult(a rather extremely massive) cult that digs it. That fully goes along with it. Like any artist, I think finding an audience that you can speak to is the one of the more important achievements. I mean they said the same things about army of darkness no doubt. Whatever bay's style is in fact yielding, it's seemingly to a greater fiscal effect than the likes of most of these other films. That means something imo.

I digress, I respect your personal opinion and why you have it. I just don't think it applies to everyone or speaks to the greater truth. You started off asking why people find this funny even though, you seemingly don't. I think we both can agree on the answer; Because these same people don't have the same tastes, and that's fine.
Unless your a critic cause then your personal taste is law.

 

[Rock Sexton]

Yes, Cade was made to feel uncomfortable with the implications. Not only that his daughter is seeing some jock under his know, but he is of the mind to take that information and skew it in a way only an over protective anti teen sex father would. Compare this to bad boys one where Martin Lawrence' character, thinking his partner is sleeping with his own wife due to his STATE OF MIND and characterization and all that is implied to play this up and drive his character crazy. That's the crux of the innuendo in the TF4 situation, implication. It's not like he said sally hawkins has the best hands in texas. He said it about someone that clearly does, as proven twice in the script. But that's beside the point, I'm not really trying to explain the movie to anyone(as I see it).

I'm not going to compare this to Bad Boys. That franchise was Rated-R.

You're taking the literal translation of Shane's word and completely ignoring the intended innuendo that anyone NOT A TWEEN would understand. There's a better way of the movie showing she's good with her hands than an indirect reference to hand jobs from a 17 year old.

In Beast Wars, a good amount of blackarachnia's 'work' on male characters was done by way of sexual innuendo and coxing.

Save the ambiguities. Give me actual examples.

I actually think the handled the 'talk' in TF1 pretty tastefully and fun. As if it was an ep of fresh prince or even cosby imo. If it felt awkward that's because adolescent(teen rather) sex is supposed to, it also happens.

Of all the sexual jokes told in this franchise, the "happy time" reference wasn't one I really had issues with. I mean that actually happened to me once (getting caught LOL). That is also because that first film didn't insult my intelligence with gobs of it.

The larger picture here that I think you keep missing in my argument and other's is that Bay has been going out of his way to include it in this franchise ..... and including it often. If I wanted to see that kind of film, I'd go watch Pain & Gain where the crudeness is actually part of the story.

 

[DA_Champion]

See, I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not here lol.

I'm not. I find the schtick of "I'm a superhero, billonaire, genius, playboy" far dumber than anything in Transformers, and the T&A shots are no better than equal.

An important difference between T4 and IM3 ... Both movies involve the creation of 50 robots ... in T4 that development takes four years rather than 1 year, and needs the R&D staff of a full company, not just one depressed loner in a basement.

 

[Marvin]

Ok, now you are putting words in my mouth. All I said in that quote was that innuendo's are better when subtle. Because that's the point. There is a fine line between when a joke is flat out a sex joke, and when it's merely implied. Innuendo's are meant to be the latter.

I didn't know that you weren't given you opinion on the matter as it pertained to the film in question, rather just what your interpretation on general execution is. Either way, if that's what you think, then that's what you think. You have your rules.

As for my second part. I don't like rules.

 

[Marvin]

I'm not going to compare this to Bad Boys. That franchise was Rated-R.

You're taking the literal translation of Shane's word and completely ignoring the intended innuendo that anyone NOT A TWEEN would understand. There's a better way of the movie showing she's good with her hands than an indirect reference to hand jobs from a 17 year old.

That's your problem. You are drawing lines without even looking at the context of what it is I'm talking about. I'm talking about the characterization of an overprotective(or jealous)father/brother over reacting to their own proclivities when the possibility of sexual innuendo occurs. If you think this very thing in concept is beyond that of PG 13 as opposed to R, simply because it deals with sex, we'll just have to agree to disagree now. I will add that it's actually a bit that serves both the characterization(Cade/Tessa) and the story as well.

As for the intended innuendo itself. Teens have sex all the time. I know plenty myself. More to the point, they do on just about every teen drama on network television(see vampire diaries, or 90210 or teen wolf or Smallville, often times with older men). This isn't a 6 or 12 or 14 year old. So to get right to it, the implication, rather play on words means absolutely nothing to me personally. Teens do stuff. An innuendo implying it whilst never confirming it...sure I guess. The movie even touches on the fact that it's legal(in the film as well as supposedly out).

Save the ambiguities. Give me actual examples.

You are asking for exact scenes, sorry but I don't have them handy nor do I have access to them or the time to head out and grab them for you. By any chance, are you suggesting they don't exist? Blackarachnia and her sexual coaxing of Quickstrike for example...Or talks of 'later private plans' with Silverbolt? All by innuendo. And that's just sex. There is plenty of other categories of crudeness present but that's another matter.

The larger picture here that I think you keep missing in my argument and other's is that Bay has been going out of his way to include it in this franchise ..... and including it often. If I wanted to see that kind of film, I'd go watch Pain & Gain where the crudeness is actually part of the story.

Actually the point you keep missing is that you are free to go anywhere you please. These films aren't for everyone and possibly not for you. No film is or ever will be(for everyone). But sitting here and demanding they stop what it is they are doing and start catering to you(and yours) is what I'd call self importance vs film criticism. Is what the film doing effective, does it work...etc? Whether it satisfies Rock Sexton and those like him(his ilk rather), is something else entirely. I get it; 'not to your liking'. But if it literally was to the liking of every other person on the planet, where would that leave us?
Right here debating on whether this needs to change...or else?

As for IM, that was actually me talking to Flint. Not sure when the mix up happened but clearly it did. As for quantity. Again, that was never my point(though IM has it's fair share). I saw the sentiment; TF films suck cause they have 'booger eater humor'. I never detected an issue with quantity but that of presence. If you think a film has too much of something, that's a personal preference imo. By now I'd imagine know know where I'm going with this. Still, crude humor being present in that other film makes my point. We pick and choose our limits it seems.

 

[dark_b]

after a week was there any debate how Optimus Prime fixed himself? 2 times in the movie.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

after a week was there any debate how Optimus Prime fixed himself? 2 times in the movie.

And remembered he had a jetpack at the end too!

 

[Ipodman]

He also had jedi force powers. He was juggling the Seed in the air

 

[P Supreme]

Saw this yesterday and it was good but WAY TOO LONG

seriously I was exhausted by the end a couple of points I liked

* Bumblebee did speak he may not had a "voice" but he was talking IMO
* Wahlberg was a huge upgrade as the lead loved his character
* I liked the angle of the government not wanted another alien war it made sense
* Lockdown was great

Spoiler

shame he had to go out the way he did

* Bay couldn't help himself with some of the sex humor with that whole she is the best at handling a stick really wasn't needed especially at the moment it happened
* I loved Grammar in this and Tucci even though he did get a little silly at times

Things I HATED

* Galvatron was such a let down again not doing a dam thing just being there
* The whole transforming

Spoiler

moving magic clouds things WHAT??

* again the decepticons got shafted in this case not even being involved escept for

Spoiler

Megatron

* Dinobots made no sense to me to

Spoiler

why they were there and how Lockdown had them in his ship

* Lockdown's ship so you mean to tell me

Spoiler

with all that tech they didn't detect Autobots on the ship and to free his valuable bounty in Prime

I give it a 5 out 10 enjoyed the first hour and a half but it started getting absurd towards the end

 

[Colossal Spoons]

He also had jedi force powers. He was juggling the Seed in the air

Haha, I'd forgotten about that. These are the things that make the movie being "pretty to look at" insufficient for me.

 

[Marvin]

He also had jedi force powers. He was juggling the Seed in the air

Ignoring how this isn't anything new(in the series). Notice he wasn't actually doing the same with cars and jugs of water...Rather some ancient glowing relic...

 

[Flint Marko]

I'm not. I find the schtick of "I'm a superhero, billonaire, genius, playboy" far dumber than anything in Transformers, and the T&A shots are no better than equal.

An important difference between T4 and IM3 ... Both movies involve the creation of 50 robots ... in T4 that development takes four years rather than 1 year, and needs the R&D staff of a full company, not just one depressed loner in a basement.

You really think the gratuitous T&A in both movies are comparable?
Wow. I don't think we watched the same movies then.
Nearly every time the main female character is on screen in transformers, it makes an effort to show her body and how sexy she is. The IM films almost never do that, save for maybe a handful of instances. You really are stretching to find a complaint here.

 

[DA_Champion]

Rotten tomatoes isn't flawless Flint. They gave an 87% to Star trek into darkness. They are decent indicators for populations of movies and trends, not individual films.

The gratuitous t&a shots in the IM movies are undeniable except from fanboys.

 

[Flint Marko]

Rotten tomatoes isn't flawless Flint. They gave an 87% to Star trek into darkness. They are decent indicators for populations of movies and trends, not individual films.

The gratuitous t&a shots in the IM movies are undeniable except from fanboys.

No, as I said I think you are stretching to find a complaint. They're nowhere near as bad as you say. Try and think of anything in IM3 near as blatant as TF4 or other transformers films. Give me specific, multiple examples. You can't. At all.
In every shot in T4, Nicola whats her face was caked in make up and wearing something skimpy and revealing. Several shots hung on her butt. Slow motion, low angle shots of women walking up stairs.
Nothing like that ever happened to Maya, or Pepper, or anyone for that matter in IM3.
I'm not saying they don't exist in the IM films - what I am saying is that they are not even remotely comparable to these movies and it is ridiculous to try and pretend otherwise.

 

[The Endless]

What gratuitous t&a shots in the IM movies? The only one i can think of is in IM2 when Widow gets into the boxing ring and we see her cleavage.

We don't have slow-motion low angle shots of women walking up stairs in the Iron Man films or hand job innuendo's about 17 year olds or sweaty skimpily dressed females leaning over car engines...

 

[The Endless]

I'm not. I find the schtick of "I'm a superhero, billonaire, genius, playboy" far dumber than anything in Transformers, and the T&A shots are no better than equal.

An important difference between T4 and IM3 ... Both movies involve the creation of 50 robots ... in T4 that development takes four years rather than 1 year, and needs the R&D staff of a full company, not just one depressed loner in a basement.

Transformers are alien bio-mechanical beings... not just robots.

And Tony Stark is obviously smarter than any human in the Transformers universe.

Such a strange thing to pick at. And no, the T&A shots are not comparable. The slow-mo low angle shot of Rosie McPoutyface walking up the stars in Dark of the Moon alone is more gratuitous than anything in the Iron Man movies.

And again, no Marvel movie would have innuendo's about a 17 year olds skills at ******* people off.

 

[Flint Marko]

Transformers are alien bio-mechanical beings... not just robots.

And Tony Stark is obviously smarter than any human in the Transformers universe.

Such a strange thing to pick at. And no, the T&A shots are not comparable. The slow-mo low angle shot of Rosie McPoutyface walking up the stars in Dark of the Moon alone is more gratuitous than anything in the Iron Man movies.

And again, no Marvel movie would have innuendo's about a 17 year olds skills at ******* people off.

Not to long ago DA champion posted in the IM3 section out of nowhere claiming that since no one had posted in 6 days that movie must not have made an impact on people, since no one was discussing it.
I think it's clear he has a chip on his shoulder for whatever reason. Best we just move on before we get off topic, I don't want to derail the conversation any further.
Here's a question for the people who know a lot about Transformers: is Cade Yeager a character from any Transformers cartoon, comic, or anything? Is the exclusion of Sam Witwicky a big deal to anyone, was he a beloved character by any means?

 

[Marvin]

In every shot in T4, Nicola whats her face was caked in make up and wearing something skimpy and revealing. Several shots hung on her butt.
Nothing like that ever happened to Maya, or Pepper, or anyone for that matter in IM3.

Not to agree with his particular point, but if you simply track the all the footage of Scarlet Jo in the second film perhaps. As it pertains to caked on make up and skimpy this or that and coverage of curves. Her introduction scene is very much a lesson in objectification, perhaps a commenary even who's to say.

We don't have slow-motion low angle shots of women walking up stairs in the Iron Man films...

Peppers opening scene in Avengers does alot of things of it's own, as do Widows.

Most people in sections these days have chips on their shoulders. That is if they don't like the film. I'm thinking it comes with the territory now a days.

 

[Flint Marko]

Not to agree with his particular point, but if you simply track the all the footage of Scarlet Jo in the second film perhaps. As it pertains to caked on make up and skimpy this or that and coverage of curves. Her introduction scene is very much a lesson in objectification, perhaps a commenary even who's to say.

Peppers opening scene in Avengers does alot of things of it's own, as do Widows.

No one is saying that these things don't exist in any way shape or form in the IM/Marvel studios films.
What we are saying is that they are nowhere near as blatant or incessant as in the TF films. Surely you can understand where we are coming from. Truth be told I'm having a hard time thinking of any other recent film franchise that objectifies and plays up the female form as much as TF.

 

[The Endless]

Peppers opening scene in Avengers does alot of things of it's own, as do Widows.

Most people in sections these days have chips on their shoulders. That is if they don't like the film. I'm thinking it comes with the territory now a days.

The first time we see Pepper in Avengers she is helping Stark set up the arc reactor for Stark Tower. She's talking techno babble about the energy levels etc. She just so happens to be wearing hot pants. We don't have a slow-motion shot of her ass walking up stairs.

Widow? Well i guess in her opening scene you are right. But it actually fits her character and actually works with her codename. She uses her sexuality and femininity to lure men into a trap. But still, no gratuitous shots of her cleavage or ass.

The way Joss Whedon treats females and the way Michael Bay treats females in his TF films bares no comparison. It's absurd to be even thinking about comparing the two things.

 

[Rock Sexton]

And again, no Marvel movie would have innuendo's about a 17 year olds skills at ******* people off.

The usual gang of intellectually dishonest contrarians feel otherwise.

Isn't it funny?

The way Joss Whedon treats females and the way Michael Bay treats females in his TF films bares no comparison. It's absurd to be even thinking about comparing the two things.

It's probably one of the worst arguments I've ever read on the Hype.

 

[The Endless]

SO THERE'S THIS PART IN TRANSFORMERS: AGE OF EXTINCTION WHERE THE AUTOBOTS SUDDENLY ENCOUNTER A SUPER-LITERAL VAGINA DENTATA ALIEN THAT'S JUST HANGING OUT IN A CAGE. THERE'S NO REASON FOR THIS TO BE HAPPENING ON ANY LEVEL, IT'S JUST CLEARLY STUCK IN FOR SOME MOTIVATIONAL REASON. BUT PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THE REVEAL OF THE ALIEN'S VAGINA DENTATA-NESS IS NOT SOME PLACID CINEMATIC MOMENT BUT INSTEAD HIGHLY EMPHASIZED. THIS IS CLEAR. THIS IS OVERT. SO THEN THE FAT AUTOBOT (ONE OF THE GOOD GUYS, BY THE WAY) IS SO REVOLTED BY THIS IMAGE THAT IT TELLS THIS WAY-TOO-CLEAR-VAGINA-SYMBOL THAT IT IS "TOO UGLY TO LIVE." THEN THE VAGINA GETS SOME SLIME ON HIM AND THE FAT AUTOBOT COLLAPSES TO THE GROUND AND THINKS HE'S "BURNING." BUT THEN THE FAT AUTOBOT JUST REALIZES IT'S JUST "SHIZZ." SO HE CALLS THE VAGINA-SYMBOL "*****" AND SHOOTS HER DEAD.

THIS LITERALLY HAPPENED.

THIS LITERALLY HAPPENED IN A MOVIE THAT IS OSTENSIBLY AIMED AT YOUNG KIDS AND POSTURING THE HEROISM OF GOOD GUYS.

Yes. And the apologists think something like this is ok to have in a summer blockbuster?

 

[Flint Marko]

Wow.
I now kinda wished I had stayed and saw the whole movie just to see exactly what he's talking about.