What if the ALIEN franchise had gone differently?

Indeed. I love Alien 3. Its not as good as Aliens...but its great in its own right. (it does do things better though imo)
 
Figs said:
Although I read this a few days ago I'm deciding to comment on that article and call horse **** on that guy. All because of this quote. Also, someone correct me if I read it wrong but to me it sounds obvious...yet full of BS.

"This movie can't possibly not be awesome!" I said to my little friend John at the time. "This is gonna make Aliens look like ET! I hope it's directed by the guy who will in the future direct Fight Club!"

Aliens 3 came out in 1992, Fight Club came out in 1999. No way in hell back before '92 when Alien 3 was still being talked about/set up did anyone have any clue David Fincher would end up directing Fight Club nearly 7-8 years later. What is this guy talking about?!?
Click to expand...

:doh:....I'm pretty sure he was trying write a witty article. That part was a joke. And I pretty much can't take the article seriously, it's so stupid.

There are usually two camps in this debate. Everyone agrees Alien and Aliens are terrific. But people split when it comes to which sequel ruined the franchise, Alien 3 or Alien 4.
I'm of the camp that likes Alien 3. I remember seeing it in the theater and initially not liking it. After the ultimate high of a kick-ass ending that Aliens left, it seemed like a whiplash inducing curveball. It went back to the horror aspect of the first film. And Fincher did what he does best...shock you. That's what we love about Fincher, whether it is a head in a box or a dual personality...he is always willing to smack the audience upside the head. And they went in with the intention that this was the last Alien film. They also established the idea that the Alien takes on the characteristics of the host.
Is it as good as the previous two entries?..no, but it is still a dark, intense movie. It still feels like an Alien film. It took a few years, but I grew to really like that film and what it tried to add to the series. It would have been a great way to just end the series right there.
Resurrection on the other hand, with it's moments of silliness, feels like somebody made a parody of Aliens. It doesn't fit in the mood of the other films and feels so out of place to me. And what's bad is it had a good concept with the Ripley clone, but the execution was so piss-poor. It's on my list of movies I try to ignore the existence of or they ruin the rest of the franchise for me (I'm looking at you Terminator 3!)

Obvisouly, since there was a fourth film, Alien 3 didn't destroy the Alien franchise. Alien 4 did. The only way to attempt recovery was combine with Predator. And though I don't altogether hate those movies, we all know how that mixture didn't exactly yield a classic.
 
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Alien 3 is much better in the Assembly Cut. I remember it being "okay" the first time I saw it but also seeing why so many hated it. The movie could have been so much better had they not ran it over with so many scripts, directors, visions, changes and just plain studio incompetence.

The franchise I think can make a come back but it has to be clean and avoid the previous movies. Not necessarily a reboot/remake or ignore canon, just take place without the original cast members returning or making oblique references to them.

Also, not make it a prequel or in any way taking place on an Earth where it will be covered up like some kind of incident hidden from the rest of the world. AVP and the sequel totally screwed both those concepts up.

If Aliens hit Earth, the people better know about it by the end.
 
Alien³ has a pretty ridiculous screenplay. Not even remotely comparable to the perfection of the first and second film.
 
People can say what they want but the Alien saga is one of the few good quadrilogies.
IMO Alien 3 or 4 didn't ruined the series as some of you claim, it may have ruined it for you but that is another story.
Each Alien movie has a tone and atmosphere of its own and that make the saga pretty unique in my eyes.
What tainted the saga ( and Predator too ) is the AvP movies.
 
Monsieur Xavier said:
People can say what they want but the Alien saga is one of the few good quadrilogies.
IMO Alien 3 or 4 didn't ruined the series as some of you claim, it may have ruined it for you but that is another story.
Each Alien movie has a tone and atmosphere of its own and that make the saga pretty unique in my eyes.
What tainted the saga ( and Predator too ) is the AvP movies.
Click to expand...


I disagree. The first AvP was not as bad as people make it out to be. The second...well, that one sucked. I tried to give it a chance but the multiple night scenes made the deciphering between characters awfully difficult.

Alien Resurrection is just a joke. I need to watch it again though. Haven't watched it in years.
 
AvP 1 not being that bad doesn't change the fact that the Alien quadrilogy is one of the best.
I also have a soft spot for AvP 1 but it is still rigged with inconsistencies such as Predator in Antarctica when they can't stand cold and Alien gestation being way to quick by examples.

You should watch Resurrection again ( the director's cut ), it is funny, the smugglers crew is likable and the sets design are great. IMO. My only reproach is the new born.
 
I thought AVP was one of the worst movies I had ever seen.
It felt like one of those fan youtube movies extended to a movie. It would have worked better as short.
 
Why Are You Crouching Spock? said:
I thought AVP was one of the worst movies I had ever seen.
It felt like one of those fan youtube movies extended to a movie. It would have worked better as short.
Click to expand...

The concept was good ( Alien vs Pred ), the execution was not.

PS : and if it is one of the worst movies you ever see I think you didn't see a lot of movies :)
 
I liked AVP, it wasn't that bad. I still think Resurrection was better. AVP2 on the other hand, was that bad. AVP had flaws like accelerated growth and the utter ridiculousness of the humans (inter)actions there. And the poor way the Predators handled what should have been a "routine" training mission.

These are the biggest, baddest hunters we've seen and they screw up left, right and middle? Still, it wasn't as bad as pretty much every scene in AVP2.

Entire homage and outright lifts of previous movies to cover up a lack of story or writing. Poorly written characters, poorly lighted scenes meant to cover up a poorly concieved PredAlien which had an even more poorly concieved (and utterly absurd and disgusting "reproductive" cycle). And the only redeeming part of this was the very end, referencing the Weyland-Yutani Corporation's plans for colonizing space.

They nuke a town in Colorado and we're expected to believe this is covered up neatly as something else? No alien remains, predator technology or acknowledgement of the military personnel sent there who died? In that universe, humans are so dumb and gullible they'll believe anything they're fed no matter how obvious the lie. It was also an insult to the audience's intelligence throughout the movie.
 
co2 said:
:doh:....I'm pretty sure he was trying write a witty article. That part was a joke. And I pretty much can't take the article seriously, it's so stupid.

There are usually two camps in this debate. Everyone agrees Alien and Aliens are terrific. But people split when it comes to which sequel ruined the franchise, Alien 3 or Alien 4.
I'm of the camp that likes Alien 3. I remember seeing it in the theater and initially not liking it. After the ultimate high of a kick-ass ending that Aliens left, it seemed like a whiplash inducing curveball. It went back to the horror aspect of the first film. And Fincher did what he does best...shock you. That's what we love about Fincher, whether it is a head in a box or a dual personality...he is always willing to smack the audience upside the head. And they went in with the intention that this was the last Alien film. They also established the idea that the Alien takes on the characteristics of the host.
Is it as good as the previous two entries?..no, but it is still a dark, intense movie. It still feels like an Alien film. It took a few years, but I grew to really like that film and what it tried to add to the series. It would have been a great way to just end the series right there.
Resurrection on the other hand, with it's moments of silliness, feels like somebody made a parody of Aliens. It doesn't fit in the mood of the other films and feels so out of place to me. And what's bad is it had a good concept with the Ripley clone, but the execution was so piss-poor. It's on my list of movies I try to ignore the existence of or they ruin the rest of the franchise for me (I'm looking at you Terminator 3!)

Obvisouly, since there was a fourth film, Alien 3 didn't destroy the Alien franchise. Alien 4 did. The only way to attempt recovery was combine with Predator. And though I don't altogether hate those movies, we all know how that mixture didn't exactly yield a classic.
Click to expand...

There's a good argument to be made that the sequel that "ruined" the franchise was Aliens. As terrific as it is, it turned a horror franchise into an action franchise, took out most of the mystery of the creatures and essentially reduced them to space bugs that blow up real good, and gave closure to Ripley. The creatures became much less interesting and there really wasn't anywhere to go with Ripley either who became Alpha Mom incarnate at the end.

Not to say that as a knock against Cameron. His duty was to deliver a complete movie, not to keep the franchise kicking for the next director, but it's very easy to see Aliens as a completion of a series.
 
I kinda think Alien 3, whilst not perfect due to a variety of reasons, gave us a good close to the trilogy. It showed that there isn't always happy endings, and the alien terror continues.

With the sacrifice of Ripley at the end being the ultimate symbol of heroism.
 
I guess I'm in the minority of enjoying the Ripley/Alien hybrid in the 4th movie. AVP wasn't bad in a Professional Wrestling sort of way. I haven't seen AVP2, so I won't comment.
 
Evil Twin said:
There's a good argument to be made that the sequel that "ruined" the franchise was Aliens. As terrific as it is, it turned a horror franchise into an action franchise, took out most of the mystery of the creatures and essentially reduced them to space bugs that blow up real good, and gave closure to Ripley. The creatures became much less interesting and there really wasn't anywhere to go with Ripley either who became Alpha Mom incarnate at the end.

Not to say that as a knock against Cameron. His duty was to deliver a complete movie, not to keep the franchise kicking for the next director, but it's very easy to see Aliens as a completion of a series.
Click to expand...
Can you really call it a franchise before there's been more than a single movie in it? Aliens made it a franchise. Alien 3 split the difference between horror and action and Resurrection meandered into pointless action and half-hearted horror with the clone angle.

AVP and AVP2 were just abominations to the Alien and Predator franchises.
 
Teelie said:
AVP and AVP2 were just abominations to the Alien and Predator franchises.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't go that far...but they don't do anything new with the franchises. They are more like fan tributes that in places I do enjoy, so on some level I consider them guilty pleasures.
 
AVP was okay. It did have one good thing: Sanaa Lathan.

Damn. Is all I have to say about her.
 
Count me among the Alien 3 fans. I've always liked it a lot, it's honestly my second favorite after Aliens. I still wish it were the true finale to the series, and in my mind, it is.
 
Teelie said:
Can you really call it a franchise before there's been more than a single movie in it? Aliens made it a franchise. Alien 3 split the difference between horror and action and Resurrection meandered into pointless action and half-hearted horror with the clone angle.
Click to expand...

And perhaps they never should have tried to make it a franchise. Is The Godfather a franchise? The third one adds nothing to the table and everyone would have been just fine if it ended with Part 2.

There's a reason nobody had been able to continue the story successfully. There wasn't really a story to continue. The aliens don't have personalities and most of their mysteries had been resolved. Ripley had faced her fears and overcome her ptsd and survivor guilt. Other than retreading Aliens or killing Ripley off, what was there truly left to explore? Bond is able to vary the formula because the bad guys look and act different, they mix up the actors, they vary the Bond girls, and they have plenty of different settings. Once you start resolving the mysteries of the aliens, it's diminishing returns unless you have a really clever script, which neither 3 nor Resurrection had. Fincher did some good things with 3, but that's more a noble failure of an auteur than a success.

At least Prometheus seems to acknowledge that. It goes back to the time when the creatures are still a mystery and there's no Ripley in sight.
 
Godfather III was meant as an epilogue to the other movies, Alien 3 was actually a good way to end if it wasn't for killing bishop, that kid and the military guy. I wish this movie had been set on Earth, that's what everybody was asking for since after Aliens was released
 
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