Superman Returns Why Don't Some Superman Fans Like Superman Returns?

[Angeloz]

This is from a new column:

I remember back in 2006 when Superman Returns was released and the film scored a 77% Rotten Tomatoes ranking marking it “Certified Fresh” which means it joins the pantheon of films to have earned such a moniker including Citizen Kane, Toy Story, Walk Hard: The Dewey Cox Story and, of course, Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. It’s a cornucopia of quality. Trouble is, I thought Superman Returns wasn’t all that good. Not that I hated it or anything, I just simply thought it was slow and it was boring. However, the more and more I heard how good it was — or how this was great and that was amazing — I began to argue against the film. Sooner rather than later I found myself almost loathing it, until suddenly I had to ask why.
Arguments for Superman Returns included adjectives such as “breathtaking” and “emotional”. My answer to this was simply, “No, it’s not,” but that didn’t change the fact that hearing about how great it was helped matters. To get to the point, the love some people had for the film created debates in which I found myself hating on the film far more than I actually did. The people I was talking to argued for the film on such a level that I felt I had to match it just in order to get my point across. However, as it inevitably would turn out, neither person arguing convinced the other as much as we simply reinforced our own conviction and actually enhanced them. There was a time I had to say to someone, “I actually don’t hate the film this much, but you are making me dislike it more and more.” They returned the same sentiment, but in reverse, and so it goes… a mini-backlash was born. Even though it was an entirely self-aware backlash.

http://www.ropeofsilicon.com/article/is-slumdog-millionaire-next-in-line-for-oscar-backlash

Sounds like there was a failure of constant fictional nude lightsabre fights on both sides. It might have saved the situation from deteriorating.

If too naughty then pillow fights. They're fun. I'm one to like the film but I see why others might not. I got good and bad things from the internet and forums. But the film itself was the reason I watched it more than once.

Angeloz

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

This is from a new column:

I remember back in 2006 when Superman Returns was released and the film scored a 77% Rotten Tomatoes ranking marking it “Certified Fresh” which means it joins the pantheon of films to have earned such a moniker including Citizen Kane, Toy Story, Walk Hard: The Dewey Cox Story and, of course, Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. It’s a cornucopia of quality. Trouble is, I thought Superman Returns wasn’t all that good. Not that I hated it or anything, I just simply thought it was slow and it was boring. However, the more and more I heard how good it was — or how this was great and that was amazing — I began to argue against the film. Sooner rather than later I found myself almost loathing it, until suddenly I had to ask why.
Arguments for Superman Returns included adjectives such as “breathtaking” and “emotional”. My answer to this was simply, “No, it’s not,” but that didn’t change the fact that hearing about how great it was helped matters. To get to the point, the love some people had for the film created debates in which I found myself hating on the film far more than I actually did. The people I was talking to argued for the film on such a level that I felt I had to match it just in order to get my point across. However, as it inevitably would turn out, neither person arguing convinced the other as much as we simply reinforced our own conviction and actually enhanced them. There was a time I had to say to someone, “I actually don’t hate the film this much, but you are making me dislike it more and more.” They returned the same sentiment, but in reverse, and so it goes… a mini-backlash was born. Even though it was an entirely self-aware backlash.

http://www.ropeofsilicon.com/article/is-slumdog-millionaire-next-in-line-for-oscar-backlash

Interesting article indeed, it does seem the people who disliked the movie have begun to dislike it more over time, maybe it is because of constant arguing. I will say the more I watched the movie the more I loved, it was nothing to do with arguing on here. I'm sure its the same for some who disliked the movie as well of course.

 

[El Payaso]

Apparently, that guy's hatred is against people who like the movie, not against the movie itself.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^It seems that way doesnt it, thankfully, we can just enjoy the movie without being influenced by the opinions of others. I will be the first to admit my love for SR wasnt as high as now on my first viewing, but repeat watching and then learning more about the character through reading the comics brought me to stage were I simply grew to love the movie.

 

[Angeloz]

^It seems that way doesnt it, thankfully, we can just enjoy the movie without being influenced by the opinions of others. I will be the first to admit my love for SR wasnt as high as now on my first viewing, but repeat watching and then learning more about the character through reading the comics brought me to stage were I simply grew to love the movie.

Some influence can be a good thing.

And I'm glad you can love the film. Really. I can even understand why some don't as long as they're reasonable. Although silly reasoning can be funny sometimes. But not always. But as everyone knows I love the film too. I hope to see more of Routh in another one.

I know we don't always get what we want.

Angeloz

 

[byte19]

i loved SR and you are one of the few people i've seen on various give real reason for problems in the film. over all it is great movie but it has flaws also. the complaints of deadbeat dad, bastard kid, lex's land grab, the beat down, lois and richard and chirst allegory were never valid reasons for some to hate the film. singer simply made the mistake of breaking movie 101 rule, assuming that everyone will know what is happening. in other words the things concerning jason and lex getting the crystals from the fortress should have been explained better. even him not saying goodbye to lois was different because it showed that supes/clark wasn't perfect he makes mistakes (still that needed to fleshed out little more and their reunion more intense). clark took for granted that lois would be there when came home (earth) and did a basic guy move which was easiest for him not her by not saying anything. richard and not knowing about jason were the consequences of that choice. byte often tells me that jason's true father should have been save for the sequel. my opinion of SR has not changed because of these minor problems; people that seem to hate are also the ones who by several copies of the dvd. go figure.

terra1319(byte's girl)

 

[byte19]

ps routh is still in the game no cast changes, yet. hell last i heard is that singer is part of the pre-production talks concerning the next movie, but not as director. this was at least 3 months ago everything has been so hush hush. i hope wb doesn't mess things up trying to turn it into a copy of the TDK supes and bats are different personalities they don't see the world in the same way but both have faith that things can and will get better for the future.

terra1319

 

[Angeloz]

i loved SR and you are one of the few people i've seen on various give real reason for problems in the film. over all it is great movie but it has flaws also. the complaints of deadbeat dad, bastard kid, lex's land grab, the beat down, lois and richard and chirst allegory were never valid reasons for some to hate the film. singer simply made the mistake of breaking movie 101 rule, assuming that everyone will know what is happening. in other words the things concerning jason and lex getting the crystals from the fortress should have been explained better. even him not saying goodbye to lois was different because it showed that supes/clark wasn't perfect he makes mistakes (still that needed to fleshed out little more and their reunion more intense). clark took for granted that lois would be there when came home (earth) and did a basic guy move which was easiest for him not her by not saying anything. richard and not knowing about jason were the consequences of that choice. byte often tells me that jason's true father should have been save for the sequel. my opinion of SR has not changed because of these minor problems; people that seem to hate are also the ones who by several copies of the dvd. go figure.

terra1319(byte's girl)

Who was that aimed at (the thread starter?)? Also shouldn't you get your own log in identity? By the way it's nice to hear from someone that loves "Superman Returns". I hope you don't get sucked in by the chest fights. Or other serious matters.

OK I don't mind some of those arguments. Hehehe.

Angeloz

 

[byte19]

The film just isn't true to Superman's character. He leaves Earth without telling the people who have come to depend on him where he's going, doesn't even tell the woman he loves where he's going, and is then reduced to a slacker dead beat dad when it turns out he knocked up Lois Lane and STILL didn't have the decency to tell her where he was going, and then the film becomes more fixated on him pining over Lois and even stalking her despite the fact that she now has a committed life companion in the form of Richard White, thus wrecking the little family unit she has. This does not match up with the traditional image of Superman as a mature, responsible figure.

Additionally, the film failed to properly update Superman the way "Batman Begins" updated Batman. By obsessively clinging to the Donner films, the film is more of a misguided nostalgia love fest than a proper restart of Superman's film franchise for the 21st century. And no, sticking Superman in a rubbery, de-colorized version of his costume does not count as "updating", that is blasphemy.

And of course, Brandon Routh and Kate Bosworth were WAY too young to be believable as an established Superman and Lois Lane who has a pulitzer and a 5 year old son - unless Lois was 16 when she got herself knocked up with the little bastard. Plus neither of them really felt like they inhabited the characters, they just came off as really flat and empty.

i can see some of your point but you not a dead beat father if you don't know have child in the first place, and second i didn't see supes do anything to come between lois and richard. if you are referring to the interveiw/flight scene that, how do i put this, was more like being overly polite and saying yes i still care for you but it's over (not sure i phrased it right) not that intense as it should have been. and stalking was nonexistant he went to her place once and didn't bother to see her and just left her alone with her family. this more painful to supes than annyone else. kate, i was not convinced as lois but she got job; she still can grow into. i give final judgement after the next movie. brandon i felt did well as clark/superman but final judgement after MOS. no comment on the suit.
terra1319(byte's girl)

 

[Ace of Knaves]

That article posted by D.D doesn't mean nothing. Yea it got a "certified fresh" rating. But that doesn't automatically put it in the same league as Citizen Kane and co. Not at all.

 

[Angeloz]

Hey did you watch the film in the cinema first (terra1319)? How many times? What have you got on DVD? Which article (The Ace of Knaves)?

Angeloz

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Who me?

 

[byte19]

Who was that aimed at (the thread starter?)? Also shouldn't you get your own log in identity? By the way it's nice to hear from someone that loves "Superman Returns". I hope you don't get sucked in by the chest fights. Or other serious matters.

OK I don't mind some of those arguments. Hehehe.

Angeloz

terra1319 is my id but byte and i are usually on together at our home computer. no i don't get sucked into the chest fights, i try to make a valid point and move on. but thanks any way.

terra1319

 

[byte19]

Hey did you watch the film in the cinema first (terra319)? How many times? What have you got on DVD? Which article (The Ace of Knaves)?

Angeloz

saw it 3times at the imax here in chicago, and have two copies at home I've several times and them there is HBO AND MAX.

TERRA1319

ps: going to sleep so catch you guys later or asap.

 

[Angeloz]

Who me?

If you want to answer. I've edited to make it clearer but if you have something to say feel free to say it.

terra1319 is my id but byte and i are usually on together at our home computer. no i don't get sucked into the chest fights, i try to make a valid point and move on. but thanks any way.

terra1319

I hope people will forgive me as it's pretty hot here. So not in a serious mood.

Angeloz

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Ahhh I see. The article at the top of page originally posted by Double Down. It says SR got a fresh rating on RT, and that puts it in the same bracket as films like Citizen Kane and Toy Story? I've never heard anything more ridiculous in my life.

 

[Angeloz]

saw it 3times at the imax here in chicago, and have two copies at home I've several times and them there is HBO AND MAX.

TERRA1319

I envy you the IMAX. Sorry about the name typo.

What's your view on the kryptonite landmass (if you've answered already, sorry, it's hot; I'm tired)? Or do you think that's inviting too much trouble?

Angeloz

 

[byte19]

no trouble and the landmass was good but i have to admit i still want more. i'm patient i can wait until MOS.

terra1319

 

[byte19]

i just saw a post on the 2 year anniversary of SR. its on the last page and discusses how fatherhood in SR is really a test for supes and the says that the situation in SR makes him look irresponsible and out of character. some of the points are pretty good and give you a chance to think a min. check it out it's quite interesting.

terra1319

 

[SuperDaniel]

Movies are different than comics. You just have 2 hours to tell a story about a character that has a history of 60+ years. Its obvious that some arcs of the comics are TERRIBLE but that is normal to every character. Your job as a director and as a researcher is to make a story using the BEST the character has to offer. If you can't do that, you're not up to the task. SR failed in bringing the best Superman has to offer and i have to say, thank god! Because now we'll have a reboot!

 

[Superark]

What I've really never understood is why so many fans waste their time on forums and threads about movies they did not like? I'm not just talking about SR, but any movie.

I don't like Smallville or the Spider-Man 3 movie, but I don't go over into forums to constantly talk about why I hate those things. I rather discuss the things I do like or things I want to see going forward.

But that's just me.

 

[stargazer]

What I've really never understood is why so many fans waste their time on forums and threads about movies they did not like? I'm not just talking about SR, but any movie.

I don't like Smallville or the Spider-Man 3 movie, but I don't go over into forums to constantly talk about why I hate those things. I rather discuss the things I do like or things I want to see going forward.

But that's just me.

EXAAAACTLY. I'm the same. I hated Transformers but you never see me in those forums. I guess, the people who do that ^(whine and complain without stop) are the so called Fanboys...

 

[El Payaso]

What I've really never understood is why so many fans waste their time on forums and threads about movies they did not like? I'm not just talking about SR, but any movie.

I don't like Smallville or the Spider-Man 3 movie, but I don't go over into forums to constantly talk about why I hate those things. I rather discuss the things I do like or things I want to see going forward.

But that's just me.

Not just you. I loved Spiderman 2 (although I had hated the first one) and couldn't wait for the third one. But when that piece of crap came out I spent 2 good weeks bashing it to death at the Spiderman forums. But that's it. Never went back there again, what for?

Defending what you love for years or bashing what you hate for years. The choice defines you.

 

[NickyTea]

I think I'm finally starting to grasp this.

A predominant amount of the "haters"/dissenters seem to be judging what the movie wasn't rather than what it was.

 

[stargazer]

I think I'm finally starting to grasp this.

A predominant amount of the "haters"/dissenters seem to be judging what the movie wasn't rather than what it was.

Bingo!

Personally, I think the movie is fantastic, but then I was not that big a fan of the character before I saw the movie in theaters, nor did I have all of these preconceived ideas of what and how I wanted the movie to be like as many fans did/do. I was just a casual Superman fan and a film lover who just wanted to watch a good and entertaining movie about this fantastic character. But I got more than that; I got a beautiful, serious, epic, mythic and deeply moving film about my favorite fictional character.

It seems to me that a lot of people here wanted him to fight a supervillain so badly that they cant appreciate all the subtext and emotion that this film offers. Oh, well..