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masteryoda
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Rosslyn Chapel's extraordinary carvings explained at last
DIANE MACLEAN
THE doors of Rosslyn Chapel have shut behind the cast and crew of The Da Vinci Code. But grail tourists will continue to travel to this place of 21st century pilgrimage and walk in the footsteps of the Knights Templar and the Holy Grail.
Behind all the fantastical nonsense there are lone voices asking us to put aside the hype, look inside the chapel and open our eyes to what it really is. They don't see heretic knights and ancient secrets but an important remnant of medieval architecture deserving of serious study that has been prostituted on the altar of commercialism.
Just in case you've been asleep (or abducted by aliens) you may need a quick re-cap on current "theories" re Rosslyn. Revisionist historians consider Rosslyn to be a grail chapel. Built by Sir William Sinclair in 1446 as a copy of the Temple of Solomon, its intricate carvings hint at secrets passed down to the family since the fall of the Templars in 1307. Depending on your inclination the chapel is the final resting-place for Jesus's head, Templar treasure or any number of outlandish ideas.
According to the new book Rosslyn and the Grail by Mark Oxbrow and Ian Robertson, it is none of these things. The authors place the chapel firmly in its 15th century context and finally reveal the true meaning of the carvings. In doing so they seek to revisit the history of the Sinclair family and cast doubt on those who paint a 14th century William Sinclair as a Knight Templar.
Detail of gravestone.
"The Sinclairs were devout Catholics who were ruined by clinging to their Catholicism in the face of the reformation," says Oxbrow. "William Sinclair has been dead for (about) 700 years. There is no-one left to defend him, and to accuse him of being a Templar is appalling."
Sinclair was "exposed" as a Templar when his gravestone was found. It has been suggested that it is incontrovertibly Templar, featuring as it does a sword and a Templar rose. Oxbrow believes the people who came to this conclusion have forgotten their history, citing many similar gravestones connected to the Lords of the Isles. Furthermore, that the Templar "rose" is more likely to be a reference to the family saint of the Sinclairs, St Catherine and her eight-spoked wheel.
Having discarded the idea that the Sinclairs were Templars, the authors also aim to debunk the idea of Rosslyn as a place of intrigue. They hope that new revelations about the man they believe to be the secret architect will lead to a reappraisal of the chapel.
Sir Gilbert Hay was tutor the children of the Sir William who built Rosslyn (a descendant of the earlier William) and an exceedingly erudite man. He had spent 20 years in France, possibly fighting alongside Joan of Arc. Oxbrow is convinced that it was Hay, not Sinclair who oversaw most of the building work and that his hand is there in the carvings, if you only know where to look.
At the time Rosslyn was being built Hay was translating books on chivalry into Scots - for the very first time. He would also definitely have read books on Arthurian legend.
"Right through the medieval period Arthurian legends were popular," says Oxbrow. "They were not historical, but allegorical, the story was there to have a meaning or purpose."
Green men are thought to be pagan figures representing life and fertility. The term green derives from the foliage around their faces.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Like the Arthurian legends of dragons and knightly quests, Rosslyn was built to be read like a storybook. And like the grail stories of old, it would not have been hard for the local churchgoers to interpret the stories that it told.
Oxbrow and Robertson have spent 20 years investigating Rosslyn and think they've cracked the story. This means that for the first time since the Middle Ages we can now read the chapel as it was meant to be read.
"It was the green men that gave us our first clue," explains Oxbrow. "They start off on the east side as young men, and then get progressively older as you travel round the church."
The story of Rosslyn can be "read" starting in the east with the two windows.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Oxbrow believes that the chapel is quite simply the story of life in miniature. To begin the journey you need to face the two east windows, which are designed to catch the morning light. Opposite these windows are carved musicians, welcoming in the dawn. Facing them is the nativity scene. The whole east section of the chapel is concerned with the beginning of day, the start of life and spring. The green men here are young boys with single vine leaves entwined round their immature faces.
Shifting south the scene moves on towards the middle of the day, summer and the middle years of life. The foliage depicts harvest time, there are fruits in abundance. Here the green men are in the prime of life, verdant and lush. The biblical lesson is about gaining wisdom, with depictions of the seven deadly sins and the seven virtues.
Moving west and dusk falls. The scene is autumnal and the green men are ageing. The roof represents the canopy of the heavens with stars and moons.
The green men at the north of Rosslyn are just skeletons.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Finally, coming round to the north, the chapel hits winter, the end of the day and the end of life. The green men are skeletons; the biblical story is of the crucifixion. The north aisle is associated with death. It is no coincidence that the only two black slabs in the flooring are placed here. Beneath them a stone stairway leads to the crypt where the bodies of innumerable Sinclairs lie entombed in their armour.
The beauty and simplicity of the chapel still amazes Oxbrow, not least because it gives an insight into people's beliefs at the time.
"The whole chapel is completely straight forward," says Oxbrow. "If people continue to fictionalise history it's a bad thing, not least because the real stories are more interesting. Anything else about the Templars is just rubbish built on sand."
DIANE MACLEAN
THE doors of Rosslyn Chapel have shut behind the cast and crew of The Da Vinci Code. But grail tourists will continue to travel to this place of 21st century pilgrimage and walk in the footsteps of the Knights Templar and the Holy Grail.
Behind all the fantastical nonsense there are lone voices asking us to put aside the hype, look inside the chapel and open our eyes to what it really is. They don't see heretic knights and ancient secrets but an important remnant of medieval architecture deserving of serious study that has been prostituted on the altar of commercialism.
Just in case you've been asleep (or abducted by aliens) you may need a quick re-cap on current "theories" re Rosslyn. Revisionist historians consider Rosslyn to be a grail chapel. Built by Sir William Sinclair in 1446 as a copy of the Temple of Solomon, its intricate carvings hint at secrets passed down to the family since the fall of the Templars in 1307. Depending on your inclination the chapel is the final resting-place for Jesus's head, Templar treasure or any number of outlandish ideas.
According to the new book Rosslyn and the Grail by Mark Oxbrow and Ian Robertson, it is none of these things. The authors place the chapel firmly in its 15th century context and finally reveal the true meaning of the carvings. In doing so they seek to revisit the history of the Sinclair family and cast doubt on those who paint a 14th century William Sinclair as a Knight Templar.
Detail of gravestone.
"The Sinclairs were devout Catholics who were ruined by clinging to their Catholicism in the face of the reformation," says Oxbrow. "William Sinclair has been dead for (about) 700 years. There is no-one left to defend him, and to accuse him of being a Templar is appalling."
Sinclair was "exposed" as a Templar when his gravestone was found. It has been suggested that it is incontrovertibly Templar, featuring as it does a sword and a Templar rose. Oxbrow believes the people who came to this conclusion have forgotten their history, citing many similar gravestones connected to the Lords of the Isles. Furthermore, that the Templar "rose" is more likely to be a reference to the family saint of the Sinclairs, St Catherine and her eight-spoked wheel.
Having discarded the idea that the Sinclairs were Templars, the authors also aim to debunk the idea of Rosslyn as a place of intrigue. They hope that new revelations about the man they believe to be the secret architect will lead to a reappraisal of the chapel.
Sir Gilbert Hay was tutor the children of the Sir William who built Rosslyn (a descendant of the earlier William) and an exceedingly erudite man. He had spent 20 years in France, possibly fighting alongside Joan of Arc. Oxbrow is convinced that it was Hay, not Sinclair who oversaw most of the building work and that his hand is there in the carvings, if you only know where to look.
At the time Rosslyn was being built Hay was translating books on chivalry into Scots - for the very first time. He would also definitely have read books on Arthurian legend.
"Right through the medieval period Arthurian legends were popular," says Oxbrow. "They were not historical, but allegorical, the story was there to have a meaning or purpose."
Green men are thought to be pagan figures representing life and fertility. The term green derives from the foliage around their faces.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Like the Arthurian legends of dragons and knightly quests, Rosslyn was built to be read like a storybook. And like the grail stories of old, it would not have been hard for the local churchgoers to interpret the stories that it told.
Oxbrow and Robertson have spent 20 years investigating Rosslyn and think they've cracked the story. This means that for the first time since the Middle Ages we can now read the chapel as it was meant to be read.
"It was the green men that gave us our first clue," explains Oxbrow. "They start off on the east side as young men, and then get progressively older as you travel round the church."
The story of Rosslyn can be "read" starting in the east with the two windows.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Oxbrow believes that the chapel is quite simply the story of life in miniature. To begin the journey you need to face the two east windows, which are designed to catch the morning light. Opposite these windows are carved musicians, welcoming in the dawn. Facing them is the nativity scene. The whole east section of the chapel is concerned with the beginning of day, the start of life and spring. The green men here are young boys with single vine leaves entwined round their immature faces.
Shifting south the scene moves on towards the middle of the day, summer and the middle years of life. The foliage depicts harvest time, there are fruits in abundance. Here the green men are in the prime of life, verdant and lush. The biblical lesson is about gaining wisdom, with depictions of the seven deadly sins and the seven virtues.
Moving west and dusk falls. The scene is autumnal and the green men are ageing. The roof represents the canopy of the heavens with stars and moons.
The green men at the north of Rosslyn are just skeletons.
Courtesy: Mark Oxbrow
Finally, coming round to the north, the chapel hits winter, the end of the day and the end of life. The green men are skeletons; the biblical story is of the crucifixion. The north aisle is associated with death. It is no coincidence that the only two black slabs in the flooring are placed here. Beneath them a stone stairway leads to the crypt where the bodies of innumerable Sinclairs lie entombed in their armour.
The beauty and simplicity of the chapel still amazes Oxbrow, not least because it gives an insight into people's beliefs at the time.
"The whole chapel is completely straight forward," says Oxbrow. "If people continue to fictionalise history it's a bad thing, not least because the real stories are more interesting. Anything else about the Templars is just rubbish built on sand."
masteryoda
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If anyone else has stuff they'd like to add to the thread, feel free. 
TheSumOfGod
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Just check out my "Reptilians!" thread.
JLBats
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kypade said:thanks. that site is pretty cool. i might check out that book.
You're not so amazing.
But really, why do you say that? What did you look up, and what isn't amazing about it?
Apparently some of the map stuff can be chalked up to projection.
kypade
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"After a long study, Mallery discovered the projection method used. To check out the accuracy of the map, he made a grid and transferred the Piri Reis map onto a globe: the map was totally accurate. He stated that the only way to draw map of such accuracy was the aerial surveying: but who, 6000 years ago, could have used airplanes to map the earth??"
"In fact Strachan said that in order to draw such maps, the authors had to know about the spheroid trigonometry, the curvature of the earth, methods of projection; knowledge that is of a very high level."
That projection? Still, how is that not amazing. Unless theres some other projection that people 6k years ago could have done very easily? These guys mention "projection" as though it is pretty advanced stuff.
"In fact Strachan said that in order to draw such maps, the authors had to know about the spheroid trigonometry, the curvature of the earth, methods of projection; knowledge that is of a very high level."
That projection? Still, how is that not amazing. Unless theres some other projection that people 6k years ago could have done very easily? These guys mention "projection" as though it is pretty advanced stuff.
TheSumOfGod
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kypade said:
Maybe some primitive cavemen just took a wild guess and got it right, you know, beginner's luck. Or maybe they ate some magic mushrooms and saw the Earth from above using ASTRAL projection.
JLBats
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TheSumOfGod said:Maybe some primitive cavemen just took a wild guess and got it right, you know, beginner's luck. Or maybe they ate some magic mushrooms and saw the Earth from above using ASTRAL projection.
It's happened.
kypade
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As long as it wasn't anal projection.TheSumOfGod said:Maybe some primitive cavemen just took a wild guess and got it right, you know, beginner's luck. Or maybe they ate some magic mushrooms and saw the Earth from above using ASTRAL projection.
TheSumOfGod
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kypade said:As long as it wasn't anal projection.
Gay people didn't exist 6,000 years ago. The Ancient Greeks invented homosexuality during the Bronze Age, and it caught on. One of their islands is even named Lesbos.
kypade
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You're saying the article is not amazing, but accept that they may have been able to map the earth because they were hallucinating? Really? Mushrooms and ghosts make sense, but airplanes and advanced math must be explained in some other way? Superhobo?JLBats said:
masteryoda
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Message In A DNA Bottle
Put your data on a hard drive, and it may be safe for a decade--assuming the drive doesn't break. But what if you want to keep information safe for hundreds of millions of years?
You might try DNA.
The power of DNA as a storage device was first recognized only six years after the molecule was discovered. In a prescient 1959 lecture at the California Institute of Technology, Richard Feynman, one of the most admired physicists of the 20th century, forecast that miniaturized technology would likely change the world--essentially predicting the digital revolution. Then he pointed out that nature had already done the microchip one better in the form of deoxyribonucleic acid.
In a small bundle of atoms at the center of every cell, Feynman noted, all the information needed to create a human, an amoeba or a tomato was encoded. As in so much else, Feynman was ahead of his time. Scientists have calculated that DNA may be the ideal storage medium. A mere pound of DNA could hold all the data that has ever been saved on any computer.
Put your data on a hard drive, and it may be safe for a decade--assuming the drive doesn't break. But what if you want to keep information safe for hundreds of millions of years?
You might try DNA.
The power of DNA as a storage device was first recognized only six years after the molecule was discovered. In a prescient 1959 lecture at the California Institute of Technology, Richard Feynman, one of the most admired physicists of the 20th century, forecast that miniaturized technology would likely change the world--essentially predicting the digital revolution. Then he pointed out that nature had already done the microchip one better in the form of deoxyribonucleic acid.
In a small bundle of atoms at the center of every cell, Feynman noted, all the information needed to create a human, an amoeba or a tomato was encoded. As in so much else, Feynman was ahead of his time. Scientists have calculated that DNA may be the ideal storage medium. A mere pound of DNA could hold all the data that has ever been saved on any computer.
masteryoda
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John the Baptist's cave 'found'
The cave contained carvings said to depict John the Baptist
A British archaeologist says he has found a cave used by the New Testament figure John the Baptist.
Shimon Gibson spent five years excavating the site near Jerusalem, unearthing objects apparently used in ancient purification rituals.
Images carved on the walls include that of a man with wild hair and carrying a staff, said to be reminiscent of John, whom the Bible says baptised Jesus.
Biblical scholars have questioned the find, which they say is inconclusive.
Oil
The 24m (79ft) deep cave is situated on present day Kibbutz Tzuba, about 4km (2.5miles) from John's birthplace of Ein Kerem.
Mr Gibson's team found quarter of a million pieces of pottery apparently from artefacts used in the immersion process.
Worshippers are believed to have had their feet anointed here
The explorers also uncovered 28 steps leading to a chamber containing an oval stone with a foot-shaped indentation and a niche apparently through which oil would flow onto a worshipper's foot.
"John the Baptist, who was just a figure from the Gospels, now comes to life," said Mr Gibson.
A wall carving appeared to depict John, who belonged to a sect which forbade followers from cutting their hair.
Another carving of a face was symbolic of a severed head: John was decapitated by Herod Antipas, who ruled the Holy Land at the time of Jesus.
"Nothing like this has been found elsewhere," Mr Gibson said.
"It is the first time we have finds from the early baptismal period... It is an amazing discovery that happens to an archaeologist once in a lifetime."
But some biblical scholars are treating Mr Gibson's claim with caution.
Stephen Pfann, president of the University of the Holy Land in Jerusalem, said the find was intriguing, but that more work needed to be done.
The cave contained carvings said to depict John the Baptist
A British archaeologist says he has found a cave used by the New Testament figure John the Baptist.
Shimon Gibson spent five years excavating the site near Jerusalem, unearthing objects apparently used in ancient purification rituals.
Images carved on the walls include that of a man with wild hair and carrying a staff, said to be reminiscent of John, whom the Bible says baptised Jesus.
Biblical scholars have questioned the find, which they say is inconclusive.
Oil
The 24m (79ft) deep cave is situated on present day Kibbutz Tzuba, about 4km (2.5miles) from John's birthplace of Ein Kerem.
Mr Gibson's team found quarter of a million pieces of pottery apparently from artefacts used in the immersion process.
Worshippers are believed to have had their feet anointed here
The explorers also uncovered 28 steps leading to a chamber containing an oval stone with a foot-shaped indentation and a niche apparently through which oil would flow onto a worshipper's foot.
"John the Baptist, who was just a figure from the Gospels, now comes to life," said Mr Gibson.
A wall carving appeared to depict John, who belonged to a sect which forbade followers from cutting their hair.
Another carving of a face was symbolic of a severed head: John was decapitated by Herod Antipas, who ruled the Holy Land at the time of Jesus.
"Nothing like this has been found elsewhere," Mr Gibson said.
"It is the first time we have finds from the early baptismal period... It is an amazing discovery that happens to an archaeologist once in a lifetime."
But some biblical scholars are treating Mr Gibson's claim with caution.
Stephen Pfann, president of the University of the Holy Land in Jerusalem, said the find was intriguing, but that more work needed to be done.
ScottyBBadd
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Got my attention.
masteryoda
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I once told a girl that I went out on two dates with that I was born with a tail that was amputated when I was a child. But that I still have a little nubbin' on my backside and that it moves sometimes when I'm excited. She got really grossed out and I actually started to wonder if I could date someone that would actually be grossed out by this. I mean, honestly, how shallow could you be?
masteryoda
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I fell asleep during foreplay last night. I was pretty trashed and tired beyond belief to begin with, I've been working 12 hour days this week. Anyway I'm doing the finger thang and I just nod out and she hits me in the head with her shoulder so I wake up and just continue with the fingering right way. Then I nodded off twice more so I had to move downtown where I knew if I fell asleep my neck would be twisted. She got her revenge though, it was one of those nights where it was going to take forever for me to get off. (Not sure which I prefer, the nights where it takes forever or the nights where it takes two seconds...) So once she got off she kept going for abit but eventually rolled over and went to bed. I now know how it feels to be a woman.
I was pretty trashed and tired beyond belief to begin with, I've been working 12 hour days this week. Anyway I'm doing the finger thang and I just nod out and she hits me in the head with her shoulder so I wake up and just continue with the fingering right way. Then I nodded off twice more so I had to move downtown where I knew if I fell asleep my neck would be twisted. She got her revenge though, it was one of those nights where it was going to take forever for me to get off. (Not sure which I prefer, the nights where it takes forever or the nights where it takes two seconds...) So once she got off she kept going for abit but eventually rolled over and went to bed. I now know how it feels to be a woman.
C
Constanteen
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Hahaha.masteryoda said:I fell asleep during foreplay last night.
PLAS
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was it the stripper?masteryoda said:I fell asleep during foreplay last night.
masteryoda
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You don't
Jack Bauer.
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