Berserk

[Lord]

Berserkis a manga series written and illustrated by Kentaro Miura. Set in a medieval Europe-inspired fantasy world, the story centers on the characters of Guts, an orphaned mercenary, and Griffith, the leader of a mercenary band called the Band of the Hawk. Themes of isolation, camaraderie, and the question of whether humanity is fundamentally good or evil pervade the story, as it explores both the best and worst of human nature. Both the manga and anime are noted for their heavy violence.

There was an anime adaptation that aired from 1997 to 1998 and in the years from 2012 to 2013, 3 animated movie adaptations of one of the arcs were made, taking place in Guts's backstory with the Hawks, which the previous anime from the 90s had already done.

Anybody else reading this? I'm in chapter 153, and what a ride. Aside from some gratuitous violence (expecially rape), the plot has been very good and fows naturally, the world building is also excelente. As somebody who from Naruto was disapointed with how the rivalry and friend turned enemy (Sasuke), this one delivers that much better.

This arc has been quite good too, i'm loving the Vatican's role in the events right now and the manga's take on religion.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Yeah I love this series. To this day, I still think Griffith is one of the most fascinating characters in modern fiction and the Golden Age arc is probably the most tragic thing I've ever read.

The original anime series was perfect too. I love the whole franchise to bits.

 

[Lord]

I only read the manga and watched the first movie. Golden Age and Griffith were great, the way his tragedy was done was flawless. The arcs that came after were also great, but Golden Age remains my favorite of the bunch.

About the story at the present, is it just me, or is he gathering as many people as he can in order to sacrífice the entire Falconia for some greater purpose? It's a very good plan, creating a Heaven in the middle of death and chaos, Basically aseembling a huge McDonalds for demons.

The way things are going, this seems like a story that won't give humanity a very happy ending.

 

[Tequilla]

Best dark-fantasy fiction ever made.

Episode 153 ? Conviction arc ? Hmm so good. You're in for a treat. Shamefully you will get to the point where every berserk fan gets. Where it stops. I think i've got used to the idea that Miura will never end it.

I have the entire dark horse released mangas. But i kinda hope they end up releasing some big size great quality editions. If there's a manga that deserves it , its Berserk. Breathtaking artwork . Miura sure as hell takes his time to release stuff , but this last episodes , each panel is drop dead gorgeous.

There's a very specific reason why there's so many people gathering .

I dont think the violence is gratuitous. Its kinda very easy to see in that world why people and things happen like that.

The films are trash. Pure trash.

 

[chamber-music]

I love Berserk

 

[Lord]

Best dark-fantasy fiction ever made.

Episode 153 ? Conviction arc ? Hmm so good. You're in for a treat. Shamefully you will get to the point where every berserk fan gets. Where it stops. I think i've got used to the idea that Miura will never end it.

Yeah, i've already finished it. The end of the previous arc was a little weird, but i still enjoyed it.

I have the entire dark horse released mangas. But i kinda hope they end up releasing some big size great quality editions. If there's a manga that deserves it , its Berserk. Breathtaking artwork . Miura sure as hell takes his time to release stuff , but this last episodes , each panel is drop dead gorgeous.

There's a very specific reason why there's so many people gathering .

I'm actually interested in starting to buy the volumes, so i hope they don't suddenly making big size editions with better quality

I dont think the violence is gratuitous. Its kinda very easy to see in that world why people and things happen like that.

The first chapters had plenty of gratuitous child deaths, with one of the villains drinking his blood in one of the panel. But what i think is really gratuitous are the rapings or possibilities of rape, Caska was stripped like what? 6 times?

The films are trash. Pure trash.

Now that you talk about that, a live action film adaptation of the series could work very well

 

[Victarion]

I remember my first time reading Berserk. It was somewhere in the Golden Age arc, a king was acting like he was going to rape his daughter. Silly me for thinking he wouldn't try. I do love this manga, though. My favorite arc is the first one, prior to the Golden Age (Godhand, I think?).

 

[Roose Bolton]

I love the whole war between Griffith and Ganiska. It's essentially a western ideal of the devil going to war with an eastern ideal of the devil.

 

[Lord]

Yeah, i liked the war, i'm just saying that some parts felt a bit weird to me, like Guts happening to be close to where the final battle was taking place, or the end itself, which had an entire fortress rising from the ground and nobody suspecting a thing about Griffith.

 

[Roose Bolton]

I think with Griffith at this point everyone just thinks this guy's the messiah and goes with.

 

[Lord]

Yeah, desperate times i guess.

Anybody wants to guess how much longer this will run? At this pace i bet on around 10 to 15 more years.

 

[KevanG]

I read it for awhile but eventually just fell out of it. The last thing I remember from a few years back is him getting that armour. That's about it.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Well, in terms of plot advancement I can kind of see some movement coming. The way Griffith changed the world certainly has me thinking that the theoretical conflict between Guts/Skull Knight and the God Hand might not be as one-sided as it used to be, and Griffith himself is in an interesting place as of the Falconia arc.

Depends on how long he wants to draw out the Elfheim quest, because that's where it's been dragging the most IMO. Certainly Caska's revival could speed the coming Guts/Griffith conflict. If she does get revived.

I've heard that Miura is open to allowing someone else to draw it if he can't keep up a decent pace, so maybe that might help things along. Hopefully he can get his miniseries out of the way and come back to Berserk with renewed vigor.

 

[Tequilla]

Yeah, i've already finished it. The end of the previous arc was a little weird, but i still enjoyed it.

Ah ok. I misread. I thought you were going at 153.That's why i even mentioned the gathering (at the tower of conviction , and didn't understood why you were mentioning falconia) .

I think i started Berserk at 2000 , maybe 2001. So im very used to wait lol

Well the plan itself still unclear. Everything is still bound to the laws of causality. Femto , like the rest of the god hand exist to carry out the will of some other entity. There's a clear goal to everything that happens in Berserk. Probably sinister , sure. The age of darkness that the prophecy says. On a more terrain level , Griffith's goal was to be a King ,so he's realizing his dream.

I'm actually interested in starting to buy the volumes, so i hope they don't suddenly making big size editions with better quality

Lots and lots of volume were out of print some months ago. Dark Horse end up reprinting most of them , so its easier to find. But they will disappear once again. The price of some of the volumes were pretty big.

The first chapters had plenty of gratuitous child deaths, with one of the villains drinking his blood in one of the panel. But what i think is really gratuitous are the rapings or possibilities of rape, Caska was stripped like what? 6 times?

I don't think there's anything particularly distinct in the first episodes to the rest. Outside of Guts being at his low. Snake Baron feasts upon a boy's blood cause he is an Apostle. He tells the mayor he dreams of human suffering in a fiery apocalypse. Gigantic piece of shi...

Berserk world is as bleak as bleak gets. For man and woman.

Now that you talk about that, a live action film adaptation of the series could work very well

I would love to see people's reaction to the Eclipse t:. Too crazy to ever be well adapted.

 

[Tequilla]

I think with Griffith at this point everyone just thinks this guy's the messiah and goes with.

Well Midland population dreamt of the Hawk of Light saving them from destruction. Which he did with the confrontation with Ganishka. Its normal they back him up. He's extremely deceiving. He prophetized his own coming into the world.

Obviously him also being the Hawk of Darkness is the real problem...

"When the Sun has died five times, a red lake will appear at the West of the city with a name both new and ancient, and it will be the sign that the fifth angel, the Hawk of Darkness, is born. The Angel shall be both master of the sinful black sheep and king of the blind white ones. He is the one who shall bring an age of darkness upon the world."

 

[Roose Bolton]

Eclipse is like Red Wedding x50 lol

I did find it extremely interesting in how the Apostles were presented during that battle with Ganishka. Miura seems to be painting them in a much more complex light with these later stories.

 

[Tequilla]

I remember the first time i saw it (anime version) and felling almost repulsed by the whole thing. But not in a gratuitous way. It hits so hard , because of how developed these characters are during the Golden Age. The bond between the group is brilliantly well made (something which the films completely dismiss, making it one of the reasons why its so bad).

Even today rereading it ,or even watching the new films version , its just gut wrenching.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Yeah that's the thing I love about the Golden Age, is that essentially it showed these young people who have really, really struggled to find happiness in this bleak and brutal world and suffered so much misery, yet found some measure of redemption through their friendship together in the Hawks. They all genuinely looked like they were recovering as human beings, Guts and Caska especially showcased how much good these people were for each other.

And then it all goes to hell.

 

[Lord]

There's also the fact that Griff's eventual descent is allways in the back of your head. Though besides Guts and Caska, i don't think he really considered the rest of the Hawks as more than tools, and even then, he would need to see Caska in trouble or far from him to trully apreciate her.

 

[Roose Bolton]

It's funny about Griffith, because he was always hard to get a read on. I get the sense that he was always slightly sociopathic, despite his care for Guts and Caska, which admittedly was pretty damned possessive.

 

[Lord]

Yeah, i think he allways a sociopath who regarded most as tools for his dream, i think it's easier to see that in the begining when he didn't mind for some of his mercenaries being killed by Guts or when he stated his opinion of what a friend is. I think that at some point he had fondness for Guts, and Caska to a smaller degree.

His implied past must have had a role in making him what he was, but it was after having his dream completelly destroyed and being tortured for so long that i guess he just broke.

 

[Tequilla]

They cant' be tools or else the sacrifice means nothing.

Slan to the Count

The sacrificial offering to the ceremony is not just a mere lump of flesh and blood.It has to be very important and dear to your heart

.

Charlotte was Griffith tool. Genon. etc.You guys have to remember in which conditions he was put under that choice. A tortured broken man , who tried to kill himself just before the events , that saw his most dearest friends "betraying" him (guts and caska involvement) , is manipulated and his given a surreal chance of finally fulfilling his dream . He accepts it. All his life was orchestrated to that moment. In Berserk world , he was actually given no choice (not that it makes his decision any more sympathetic).

Griffith is many times portrayed with guilt and other emotions in different parts of the story. He simply knows he has to suppress it. Even among comrades. He asks Guts if he thinks he his a horrible person . Casca is the only one that sees him behind his cold persona.

He is a fascinating character. His idealism and dreams are so strong , he commits itself to a point where he almost neglects reality. Guts ends up being the only thing in the world that throws him off balance.

 

[Lord]

About his life being orcherstrated, we still don't know if the Lost chapter is still canon

 

[Tequilla]

Well , but the god of abyss episode ends with Griffith encountering something and asking "God ? " . That wasn't lost t: That episode got scrapped because it simply showed too much too soon.

But laws of causality are addressed in the story way beyond the Idea . Everything in berserk happens for a reason. Outside of Guts maybe ? Who knows. That's a big mystery. Flora says he his living through his destiny.

In Volume 5 , 3rd episode

In this World , is the destiny of mankind controlled by some transcendental entity or law ... ? Is it like the Hand of God hovering above ? At least it is true that man has no control , even over his own will

In the same Volume Zodd warns Guts of what is going to happen to them , the moment he sees the crimson behelit. It ends up in the hands of Griffith for a very specific reason.

The notion that fate is running its course is mentioned many times. Godhand when seeing Guts surviving feel surprised but ...that's kinda it. It's a minor event in the grand scheme of things.

How unforeseen!! An unpredictable thing happens at the temporal junction point. Albeit an extremely minute thing..."

It's impossible to anticipate everything. We ourselves are not gods, after all. Or else this, too, was fated to happen...

Slan tells skullknight during the eclipe that a jumping fish (him) cannot alter the flow of the river (causality)

Skullknight also addresses the issue to Guts , although he believes they might affect the events (he uses the same fish comparison but this time its able to create ripples in the surface of the water) .

That we meet again unexpectedly here and now is proof, more than anything. We already subsist within the current of causality. We who exist beyond the physical are still merely shadows on the water"

Im not saying that Griffith didn't have the possibility to choose. He did , but the circumstances of his life , the long chain of events of his life happened to assure he would accept it. Cause and Effect. That's causality.

 

[Lord]

The fact that Griffith while being transformed asks "God?" doesn't mean that chapter is still canon, yeah, i believe the idea of evil still exists, but we don't know what exactly the writer though that the lost chapter was showing, that was too much information too soon.

He may change the idea of Evil somewhat in order to not make it so overpowered, we also don't know what is the extent of Guts as part of the manipulation, the lost chapter showed him as also having been planed by the idea of evil, but due to his role being beyond destiny there has to be something else behind him, otherwise he would still be doing what the Idea wanted him to do.