Comics ??Birthright being retconned out of continutity??

[NotFadeAway]

Man Of Steel............

 

[Benstamania]

...I'm thinking I need to read Man Of Steel.

 

[DavidTyler]

...I'm thinking I need to read Man Of Steel.

And, when you do, please concentrate on the concepts Bryne and Wolfman (why do people keep forgetting long-time DC scribe Wolfman when speaking about the MOS reboot?) put forth more than any specific character dialogue.

BTW, I can't say enough how much I love Byrne's Krypton. It just makes total sense to me.

Byrne's Krypton is an extremely advanced civilization that has grown sterile and repressive. So sterile in fact that they've even elimated physical contact for procreation and, additionally, have clothing that completely covers their bodies except for their completely shaven faces.

Byrne's Jor-el didn't just save his son from a planet about to be destroyed but from a dying civiliation. And I love the way Bryne and co. handle Jor-el's rebellion. Jor-els story alone would make a good science fiction movie. It almost feels like one of the great sf films I grew up with like Logan's Run.

 

[Gogo Bananas]

Plus it offers an explanation as to why the Kryptonians didn't evacuate their planet before it blew up.

 

[Comic Book Boy]

Am I the only one who loved BIRTHRIGHT? It was a great exploration of Kal-El...Real cool writting. Fun to read. Good characters.

(Bryne's MAN OF STEEL was cool too)

 

[Dope Nose]

BTW, I can't say enough how much I love Byrne's Krypton. It just makes total sense to me.

Byrne's Krypton is an extremely advanced civilization that has grown sterile and repressive. So sterile in fact that they've even elimated physical contact for procreation and, additionally, have clothing that completely covers their bodies except for their completely shaven faces.

Byrne's Jor-el didn't just save his son from a planet about to be destroyed but from a dying civiliation. And I love the way Bryne and co. handle Jor-el's rebellion. Jor-els story alone would make a good science fiction movie. It almost feels like one of the great sf films I grew up with like Logan's Run.

couldn't agree more.

 

[charl_huntress]

There has been such division with folks complaing over the Byrne reboot, and I'm glad to see that there are people happy with the changes. I like the reboot. I thought it was a wonderful concept and really helped revitalize the character with more energy but less corn than the SA.

 

[Spike_x1]

And, when you do, please concentrate on the concepts Bryne and Wolfman (why do people keep forgetting long-time DC scribe Wolfman when speaking about the MOS reboot?) put forth more than any specific character dialogue.

BTW, I can't say enough how much I love Byrne's Krypton. It just makes total sense to me.

Byrne's Krypton is an extremely advanced civilization that has grown sterile and repressive. So sterile in fact that they've even elimated physical contact for procreation and, additionally, have clothing that completely covers their bodies except for their completely shaven faces.

Byrne's Jor-el didn't just save his son from a planet about to be destroyed but from a dying civiliation. And I love the way Bryne and co. handle Jor-el's rebellion. Jor-els story alone would make a good science fiction movie. It almost feels like one of the great sf films I grew up with like Logan's Run.

By contrast, that depiction of Krypton also reinforces the strength of character that Jor-el had with the simple fact that his last act before the planet exploded was to tell Lara that he loved her.

 

[Ender Durden]

Am I the only one who loved BIRTHRIGHT? It was a great exploration of Kal-El...Real cool writting. Fun to read. Good characters.

(Bryne's MAN OF STEEL was cool too)

i still need to read MOS but i loved Birthright as well. i personally loved its explanation of the . how its the symbol for krypton/hope and not just the the El family crest makes much more sense, since it explains that Superman is known as the last son of "Krypton" and not "El", and how it just happens to look like the letter S is cool to me.

the thought of clark putting an S on his chest and calling himself Superman was always just dumb. even if it was the kent family symbol from an indian snake decoration or whatever. In Birthright it symbolizes where he truly comes from, the origin of his powers and his people. and it explains why he has no mask and why is suit is bright. i admit it sometimes grabs in the air for explanations on little things but its still interesting. also i love genius/insane lex in smallville.

does MOS explain these characteristics in a better way?

 

[Lex Luthor]

I have to say that enjoyed MOS, more than I did Waid's Birthright. So yeah, MOS is my choice. Birthright was alright, but I remember Waid mentioning that he was more of less forced to make changes so that it would be more similar to smallville. Which I find to be very unfortunate if true. Not a huge Byrne fan, but MOS was pretty damn cool.

 

[Kurosawa]

I hated MOS and tolerated Birthright. I would rather have something close to the REAL Krypton-the Siegel and Shuster version. Maybe not superhuman Kryptonians, but definately the Alex Raymond/Fritz Lang inspired Krypton instead of Byrne's ugly, ugly, UGLY ****ing mess or the movie version.

DC would NEVER have the balls to do this though. That's just more of why American comics are slowly and deservedly dying out.

 

[Joker]

yes, American comics are dying, that's why they're at there highest point in 10 years...try again, dumbass

 

[Kurosawa]

yes, American comics are dying, that's why they're at there highest point in 10 years...try again, dumbass

First of all, **** you. I've forgotten more about comics than you'll ever know.

Second of all look at sales figures from the late 70's and look at sales figures now. Idiot.

What happens is each time they pull some crap like throwing out all the Earth-One Superman stories, killing characters, etc, they lose a few more readers. Maybe only one out of 10 people who say they're quitting comics after their latest rape/murder/retcon actually do, but built up over 20 years and a lot of stupid stories and that's a lot of readers lost. And they gain very little.

Basically what has happened in American comics is people have been trying to write their own versions of Dark Knight and Watchmen for the past 20 years.

The point that comics are at now is nothing compared to where they once were. And it'll never get back there either.

And in closing, go straight to hell, *******, and welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Up Up & Oy Vey!]

...
Kurosawa... That was extremely unnescesary.

 

[Kurosawa]

...
Kurosawa... That was extremely unnescesary.

Last time I checked he called me a dumbass first.

 

[DavidTyler]

i still need to read MOS but i loved Birthright as well. i personally loved its explanation of the . how its the symbol for krypton/hope and not just the the El family crest makes much more sense, since it explains that Superman is known as the last son of "Krypton" and not "El", and how it just happens to look like the letter S is cool to me.

the thought of clark putting an S on his chest and calling himself Superman was always just dumb. even if it was the kent family symbol from an indian snake decoration or whatever. In Birthright it symbolizes where he truly comes from, the origin of his powers and his people. and it explains why he has no mask and why is suit is bright. i admit it sometimes grabs in the air for explanations on little things but its still interesting. also i love genius/insane lex in smallville.

does MOS explain these characteristics in a better way?

I agree about the Kent Snake crest. I didn't like that at all BUT that didn't come from MOS. In Man of Steel, Jonathan and Clark leave the room and come back with the design. It's never said what they used for inspiration. They may very well have gone out to the ship and found something there that they modified into the familiar \S/.

As to naming himself, it doesn't happen in that way in MOS. Clark had been traveling the world secretly doing super deeds without a costume. Just regular clothes - jeans and t shirt. When he makes a very public rescue, Lois sees the event and names him Superman in the article she writes about the incident. The heading was something like 'Unknown Superman saves Space Plane'. I'd have to dig out my copy to give you the exact wording.

It's after this that he adopts the identity and the costume.

 

[JTStarkiller]

Is the negativity towards Birthright mostly because it screws with continuity, or that it's simply not a good story? I don't know much about these things, but maybe it would be better received if it's known from the start that it's an elseworld tale.

I'm only about a third of the way through Birthright, but I'm liking it so far. I've also only read issue 1 of MOS, so I don't know what happens after he flies up as Superman.

Since neither are technically in continuity as of right now, I'm approaching these more in terms of story, and not how they fit into the Superman mythology. With that in mind, Birthright immediately strikes me as a better book. I know MOS is 20 years, but the dialogue just doesn't quite cut it. It's hard to take it seriously. I still need to track down the entire thing sometime, all six issues.

 

[charl_huntress]

Is the negativity towards Birthright mostly because it screws with continuity, or that it's simply not a good story?

LOL...for me it's two things that KILL the story: Soul Vision and Vegatarianism. The story is alright, and I probably wouldn't mind the continuity changes but SOUL VISION????

Uh uh...that gets a big NO for me.

I don't know much about these things, but maybe it would be better received if it's known from the start that it's an elseworld tale.

That's usually the case for stories that fudge on continuity or timeline. I like FT, but it would have been much better as a graphic novel out of continuity. BR would probably be better received if it had been handled that way, but from what I had heard it was supposed to be the new continuity. However, fan reaction nixed that idea so....Prime-boy punched the wall so it made sense

I'm only about a third of the way through Birthright, but I'm liking it so far. I've also only read issue 1 of MOS, so I don't know what happens after he flies up as Superman.

Since neither are technically in continuity as of right now, I'm approaching these more in terms of story, and not how they fit into the Superman mythology. With that in mind, Birthright immediately strikes me as a better book. I know MOS is 20 years, but the dialogue just doesn't quite cut it. It's hard to take it seriously. I still need to track down the entire thing sometime, all six issues.

MOS is great! The dialogue is appropo for the time period. I like the dialogue in BR too.

 

[JTStarkiller]

Thanks for the reply. By the way, what's FT?

 

[charl_huntress]

^^For Tomorrow...which has some wonderful art.

 

[JTStarkiller]

Oh you're right. It sure does. I've read Vol. 1, but waiting for Vol. 2 to be released in paperback. Jim Lee is incredible.

 

[charl_huntress]

^^I didn't like it in continuity. The artwork in that story is far better than BR, yet I still like it.

Again, it's one of those stories that has value that is better served outside of continuity. BR is like that too...

 

[Superbaty77]

i still need to read MOS but i loved Birthright as well. i personally loved its explanation of the . how its the symbol for krypton/hope and not just the the El family crest makes much more sense, since it explains that Superman is known as the last son of "Krypton" and not "El", and how it just happens to look like the letter S is cool to me.

the thought of clark putting an S on his chest and calling himself Superman was always just dumb. even if it was the kent family symbol from an indian snake decoration or whatever. In Birthright it symbolizes where he truly comes from, the origin of his powers and his people. and it explains why he has no mask and why is suit is bright. i admit it sometimes grabs in the air for explanations on little things but its still interesting. also i love genius/insane lex in smallville.

does MOS explain these characteristics in a better way?

While i agree it being a Kent family Symbol dosnt work for me. I disagree with you about the \S/ being a symbol of the whole planet Krypton. First off in birthright. Krypton is the size of http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geuou90...67993340_q-ZrleDgVCi%2Fi1qWCa7jJW1AABAA%40%40Jupiter. Theres no way a planet that size would have one universal symbol . I like the idea that the "S" is a family crest for the House of "EL". first its more believable and two since Kal-el is the last son of Krypton. That would make Jor-El the last father of Krypton. Who in least in the movie tryed to save the doom people of Krypton. But there heads where so up there own asses. that they didnt listen and were destroyed. I the it being an "EL" symbol makes sense. If for nothing else then for the movie. Either way it symbolizes Krypton in someways. http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geuo8u0...2015175107_q-2y2hniV39ii3hyd.DEtG.WMAAA%40%40

 

[Mentok]

god, I hope this is true. Birthright was ass. I mean, soul-vision?!

That was the only thing I liked about Birthright.

 

[Redwolf]

I've been hearing rumours that Birthright is being removed from continuity. Is this true and, if so, what will be replacing it?

Is it possible that we're going back to Man Of Steel? I certainly hope so. While Waid is good with character development, Byrne is by far better with coming up with logical and believable concepts. Waid is just not good at that.

If anyone knows for certain, please post back and give me some info that I can research.

I really hope this is true, Birthright was okay but I hated the fact Superman had "soul" vision. Also, I hope they get rid of the "Superman is a vegetarian". No offense to those who are, but suddenly changing Superman from the occaisonal meat eater to a vegetarian I didn't like.

Also in Birthright Krypton had no contact with other worlds, which screws up Doomsdays origins.