The Dark Knight Caine Describes Ledger's Joker

[CaptainClown]

I was initially disappointed, but that was because I'd not seen a thing about it and somewhere in my head I'd decided that it was a Stephen King film

I like it fine now though -- Pacino acts the majority of the film without entering shout mode hahahaha

ya shout mode Pacino can get annoying if you have too much of it.

 

[BAT_WING]

jeez why are poeple arguing about this asking question no one can really amswer other than the directer himself.

so big fdeal hes not permantly white! just like bruce wayne he may be able to keep his identy in some of the movie.

in all fairness jack nichsolns joker image is far to cartoony/camp for nolan relastic to date style of batman.

he just couldnt be taken seriously enough in any dramatic scene like that,

im all for a new vamp. he dosnt need an orgin and hes not getting one anyways! ITS THE RSIE OF THE JOKER .

we all know who the hell he is. let it be and enjoy the film its 2007 not the 80s

 

[BAT_WING]

aslo if you remebr he did fall into a vat of chemicals but he did also go to that back steet surgeon so we really didnt see the state of him before that happend.

and if your happy with him dying his hair brown and puting on flesh coloured makeup whats the big deal the other way around in nolans visoin. ?

 

[Eggyman]

That's a good question . . . and I'm sure you'll get a lot of long-winded answers

 

[ultimatefan]

hmm certainly viable and doesn't break from lore. So you are saying his insanity is forcing him into that clown state rather then personal choice.

Exactly. He doesn´´t remove it not because physically he can´´t, but because psychologically he can´´t.

 

[CaptainClown]

I am too lazy to respond and read.. I will just say whatever you said was wrong, you should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[ultimatefan]

I agree. The more I think about it, I feel like the whole "tragic" aspect of Joker's background that fans like so much is just an effort to humanize him. It's easier to connect to someone you can pity. But Joker, at least in Nolan's interpretation, isn't the kind of person you can feel sympathy for. He's someone who's completely irredeemable.

Yeah, people often mention TKJ as a take that makes him more tragic and sympathetic, which is great, but even Moore himself never established it as a "definitive" origin, that´´s why he came up with "multiple choice past". It could well be just a fantasy that Joker made up in his mind to justify his bleak vision of the world in that story. In the Paul Dini story Mad Love, Joker makes up tragic stories from his past to get sympathy from psychologists and manipulate them, which is actually a common tactic used by psychopaths.

 

[SuperJAK]

jeez why are poeple arguing about this asking question no one can really amswer other than the directer himself.

so big fdeal hes not permantly white! just like bruce wayne he may be able to keep his identy in some of the movie.

in all fairness jack nichsolns joker image is far to cartoony/camp for nolan relastic to date style of batman.

he just couldnt be taken seriously enough in any dramatic scene like that,

im all for a new vamp. he dosnt need an orgin and hes not getting one anyways! ITS THE RSIE OF THE JOKER .

we all know who the hell he is. let it be and enjoy the film its 2007 not the 80s

What on earth are you trying to say? Jack Nicholson's Joker has nothing to do with whether the Joker wears make-up or not. What you feel about Nicholson's Joker is completely moot, because it means nothing to this debate.

Discrediting another Joker does not make this version any better (especially when we haven't even seen it yet).

 

[SuperJAK]

Yeah, people often mention TKJ as a take that makes him more tragic and sympathetic, which is great, but even Moore himself never established it as a "definitive" origin, that´´s why he came up with "multiple choice past". It could well be just a fantasy that Joker made up in his mind to justify his bleak vision of the world in that story. In the Paul Dini story Mad Love, Joker makes up tragic stories from his past to get sympathy from psychologists and manipulate them, which is actually a common tactic used by psychopaths.

I don't feel that Joker falling into a vat of chemicals automatically makes him a tragic character. Joker can be permawhite and still be a straight psychopath.

 

[ultimatefan]

I don't feel that Joker falling into a vat of chemicals automatically makes him a tragic character. Joker can be permawhite and still be a straight psychopath.

He can be a straight psychopath one way or another, that´´s why I don´´t see it being a big deal if it isn´´t perma-white.

 

[BAT_WING]

my point is poeple are moaning abt this joker not being perma white!

my point is whats the big deal ?

so he wont be anything like the jack nicholson joker. but to be honest that is abit camp and cartoonish for this up to date reboot.

do you honelty think if he looked anythign like jacks version in this new world it would look good ?

so wether he puts it on himself is no big deal.

and just like other folk i have a right to speak freely.

i really dont see whyy folk are so uptight abt it whent hey aint seen it yet and its a reebot , its not jack! its not tim b and its certainly not the 80's if you really hate it that much simply dont watch the movie.

i dont see nayone bashing the bats orgin, ie parents killed, i dont see nay bashing of the choice of car etc so why on earth bash the joker casue he looks a tad bit diffrent, youd thik it would be a good think.

 

[Eggyman]

my point is poeple are moaning abt thgsi joker not being perma white!

my point is whats the big deal ?

so he wont be anything like thejack nichsoon joker. but to be honest that is abit camp and cartoonihs for this up to date reboot.

do you honeltything if he looked anythign like jacks version in this new worls it would look good ?

so wether hre put it on himj self is no big deal.

and just like other folk i have a right to speak freely.

i really dont see hwy folk are so uptight abt ti whenthey aint seen it yet and its a reebot , its not jack! its not tim b and its certainly not the 80's if you really hate it that much simply dont watch the movie.

Wooooooooooow, calm yourself, sport

This message board is here for discussion like this. Everybody has a different view, and most of us are able to accept that, as individuals, we all have different needs in certain portrayals of characters that we are fond of.

Sure, some people get a bit carried away, but it's all in good fun.

 

[CaptainClown]

my point is poeple are moaning abt this joker not being perma white!

my point is whats the big deal ?

so he wont be anything like the jack nicholson joker. but to be honest that is abit camp and cartoonish for this up to date reboot.

do you honelty think if he looked anythign like jacks version in this new world it would look good ?

so wether he puts it on himself is no big deal.

and just like other folk i have a right to speak freely.

i really dont see whyy folk are so uptight abt it whent hey aint seen it yet and its a reebot , its not jack! its not tim b and its certainly not the 80's if you really hate it that much simply dont watch the movie.

i dont see nayone bashing the bats orgin, ie parents killed, i dont see nay bashing of the choice of car etc so why on earth bash the joker casue he looks a tad bit diffrent, youd thik it would be a good think.

read the posts, there are good arguments why people want him to have white skin. Also the spelling in those posts are impeccable, you could take a few pointers.

 

[SuperJAK]

my point is poeple are moaning abt thgsi joker not being perma white!

And what does that have t do with Jack Nicholson?

my point is whats the big deal ?

The big deal is that for 70 years Joker has done fine with his white skin. It's been an aspect of his character for so long that it would be stupid to not expect backlash.

so he wont be anything like thejack nichsoon joker. but to be honest that is abit camp and cartoonihs for this up to date reboot.

Again.. what does this have to do with Jack Nicholson? Not everyone who wants permawhite thinks Jack Nicholson's Joker is the best. I haven't even mentioned Jack Nicholson once in this debate.

do you honeltything if he looked anythign like jacks version in this new worls it would look good ?

No. That's not what i'm arguing about. You're just trying to put words into other peoples mouths to discredit their opinion. It's a pathetic method of debate.

so wether hre put it on himj self is no big deal.

I think it is.

and just like other folk i have a right to speak freely.

And I am free to disagree with what you say.

i really dont see hwy folk are so uptight abt ti whenthey aint seen it yet and its a reebot , its not jack! its not tim b and its certainly not the 80's if you really hate it that much simply dont watch the movie.

Not everyone arguing for permawhite is a die-hard fan of the Burton movies. Please remember that.

 

[SuperJAK]

He can be a straight psychopath one way or another, that´´s why I don´´t see it being a big deal if it isn´´t perma-white.

I think it is a big deal. It's what makes the Joker different. Not only is he crazy on the inside, he is crazy on the outside. It makes him inhuman. White skin is much more romantic to me than smudged white makeup.

 

[BAT_WING]

i know m8 im just standing my ground here im all for the change i dont see the prob but just casue im for the change dont meani odnt care any less or any less a fan .

folk just need to accept or move on and these no need to bash other folk casue they have an opiion and they cant get theyere way.

and im not on anbotu you eggyman

 

[Eggyman]

read the posts, there are good arguments why people want him to have white skin. Also the spelling in those posts are impeccable, you could take a few pointers.

Hahahahahaha

Can I say it? Can I? hehe -- owned!

 

[Eggyman]

I'm an easy-going chap; I'll love it either way

 

[CaptainClown]

Hahahahahaha

Can I say it? Can I? hehe -- owned!

 

[BAT_WING]

if you would hav read my first post as a meber i have stated im dislexic so my spelling is not up to scratch.! and its abit sad when you have to yuse other peoples disadvatanges to get your bit accross!

shame on you ROFL !!!!!!


to be honest im not debating im just staing hwy poeple are so down harted abt it in the first place.

i didnt perosnally say jak you were comparing it to jaks joker but some poepel will brecasue they way he was in this first batman film. ie sum poeple will eiother not read commic or not seen tht orignal shows.

and yes i know hes been perma white etc for years imnot here to argue with folk but

i know popel have ways they would like hings done but we should lerasn no matter hwat we do we dont have the money or the power to really chngae it.

i supose it nonals property now and hes obviously not convinced him being permas white or whatevr is belieavble.

 

[Eggyman]

Sorry, you took me by surprise. Next time I'll have a suitable ownage pic or gif at the ready

 

[CaptainClown]

if you would hav read my first post as a meber i have stated im dislexic so my spelling is not up to scratch.! and its abit sad when you have to yuse other peoples disadvatanges to get your bit accross!

shame on you ROFL !!!!!!


to be honest im not debating im just staing hwy poeple are so down harted abt it in the first place.

i didnt perosnally say jak you were comparing it to jaks joker but some poepel will brecasue they way he was in this first batman film. ie sum poeple will eiother not read commic or not seen tht orignal shows.

and yes i know hes been perma white etc for years imnot here to argue with folk but

i know popel have ways they would like hings done but we should lerasn no matter hwat we do we dont have the money or the power to really chngae it.

i supose it nonals property now and hes obviously not convinced him being permas white or whatevr is belieavble.

and if you read my first post you would have known I didn't read your post.
Now that I have darling I must say....relax take a breather..

 

[BAT_WING]

whatver the outcome is i iwll be happy to see the joker laghing his head of hysterically in batmans face lol

and then batman kicking him in the sacks!

he he he

go heath lol

 

[Eggyman]

Well BAT_WING, you've just been called darling from Papa Spank: you've hit the big time baby

 

[BAT_WING]

rofl that second time this week ive been called darliing

better watch myslef