Discussion: All Things Union

[Kelly]

I put this in another thread, but it is a part of this conversation as well...

Wisconsin Dem Assemblyman Tells GOP Assemblywoman ‘You Are F–-ing Dead,’ Media Mum

 

[hippie_hunter]

Big Labor has lost in Ohio

http://hotlineoncall.nationaljournal.com/archives/2011/03/labor-loses-big.php

 

[DACrowe]

Looks like the US is hellbent on repeating the early 20th century. God help us all.

 

[DACrowe]

WIS. SENATE REPUBLICANS ORDER DEMOCRATS' ARREST IN ILLINOIS
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0311/50606.html

Apparently this may be breaking the state Constitution that says state legislators can only be arrested during session if they have been accused of committing a felony (if they were in Wisconsin they could be forced with force to return to the state capitol though). Well who ever let little things like constitutional rights stand in the way of union busting before? Time to grab some popcorn.

 

[The Squirrel]

Arresting is a little far, but they do need to be forced back to do the jobs they were elected for.

 

[hippie_hunter]

What Squirrel said.

 

[enterthemadness]

Looks like the US is hellbent on repeating the early 20th century. God help us all.

One could say the 'clock is ticking' on America, and it's not pretty.

 

[chaseter]

Looks like the US is hellbent on repeating the early 20th century. God help us all.

Yup...this means children will be allowed to work in factories and you will not be given over time pay

Collective bargaining in the public sector is collusion, a scam against the tax payer. At least in the private sector unions aren't getting CEOs and Presidents hired to the company they work for. At least in the private sector union greed and corruption leads to the downfall of their company.

 

[Handsome Rob]

Yup...this means children will be forced to work slave labor in radioactive, chemical-laden, and zombie-infested factories with no safety standards and you will not be given over time pay or vacation or a wage of more than a few pennies, if they don't make you work for free!

Fixed! t:

Collective bargaining in the public sector is collusion, a scam against the tax payer. At least in the private sector unions aren't getting CEOs and Presidents hired to the company they work for. At least in the private sector union greed and corruption leads to the downfall of their company.

QFT. This is why I don't have nearly the problem with private unions (and believe they should be allowed to exist) that I do with public unions (which shouldn't exist at all, as far as I'm concerned).

 

[DACrowe]

Yup...this means children will be allowed to work in factories and you will not be given over time pay

Collective bargaining in the public sector is collusion, a scam against the tax payer. At least in the private sector unions aren't getting CEOs and Presidents hired to the company they work for. At least in the private sector union greed and corruption leads to the downfall of their company.

"First domino."

I also like how public employees are treated as if they don't have real jobs and should be grateful for whatever anti-government legislators will throw their way.

 

[chaseter]

First domino. Rofl.

You want to talk about real jobs? Real jobs don't have pensions that they pay a measly part of and continue to receive half their pay 30 years after they retired. Real jobs don't have healthcare that they pay 4% of. Real jobs don't cause taxes to increase when employees collectively bargain for more. Real jobs don't have their boss giving them whatever they want because they got them hired.

I am not knocking teachers, fire fighters, police, etc. I am knocking the system. Collective bargaining leads to nothing but complacency and bargaining with the people you got elected is corruption plain and simple. Tell me why a teacher that makes the exact same as a teacher in the classroom beside them would stay 3 hours late tutoring a kid that is really having a hard time if they know they are getting nothing more or less than the person who leaves at the bell. In the perfect world, that question is easily answered. We don't live in a perfect world.

Just imagine if we all worked for the government and could collectively bargain and get pensions.

 

[DACrowe]

No you are knocking them. You just implied they don't have "real jobs." I qualify that as a "knock" despite any qualifiers that are used before placing the problems of our nation on those who make on average 50-80k a year in the name of public service.

 

[Franklin Richards]

So who should be making 50 to 80k a year with medical and retirement benefits?



People who make 250k a year?

 

[chaseter]

After you implied that I already said that I said that DaCrowe. 80k a year for a teacher is ridiculous. Then getting benefits on top of that and that total is well over 100k...well over.

Secondly, why are our kids getting dumber and dumber while teachers are getting paid more and more? Why are we spending more one education and getting declining results? This isn't the teachers fault. This is the system's fault. Yes there are terrible teachers and yes there are good teachers...just like everything else. They don't deserve pensions while we all get a 401k and also pay for their pensions. They don't deserve cadillac healthcare for an extremely low premium while we receive average healthcare for 5x while we also pay for their healthcare.

We are 24th out of 36 countries in math. Why is that? Do teachers need another 20k a year to get us in the top 5?

 

[Franklin Richards]

So instead of getting yours, you want to take theirs? You think that will help you get yours?

 

[DACrowe]

After you implied that I already said that. 80k a year for a teacher is ridiculous.

I was referring to people in state governments such as administrators, secretaries in governors' administrations, university professors, etc. Public school teachers don't get paid that much.

 

[chaseter]

So instead of getting yours, you want to take theirs? You think that will help you get yours?

I pay for theirs. How is it theirs?

 

[chaseter]

I was referring to people in state governments such as administrators, secretaries under governors' administrations, university professors, etc.

What

 

[Franklin Richards]

It's THEIR job. Shouldn't the jobs pay well in order to bring the best and brightest into the field? That's what I always hear about the medical profession. Is the guy who flips the switch on the MRI at the VD clinic worth more than the people who teach our children?

 

[chaseter]

It's THEIR job. Shouldn't the jobs pay well in order to bring the best and brightest into the field? That's what I always hear about the medical profession. Is the guy who flips the switch on the MRI at the VD clinic worth more than the people who teach our children?

I wish all doctors got paid the exact same no matter how many people they see a day or the quality of their work.

Why are our kids among the dumbest of industrialized nations?

 

[Franklin Richards]

I wish all doctors got paid the exact same no matter how many people they see a day or the quality of their work.

Why are our kids among the dumbest of industrialized nations?

Big Pharma. World of Warcraft. The Disney Channel. Shia LeBeouf.

 

[chaseter]

Uh huh

 

[Franklin Richards]

It's ok. You can laugh.

 

[DACrowe]

What

Not all public employees are teachers and some are paid more.

 

[chaseter]

Not all public employees are teachers and some are paid more.

Oh I know. It's in all facets of the public sector. It's now way better to work for the government. You get pensions, job security, amazing healthcare, the whole nine. We are spending more than ever in the public sector but we aren't more better off than say 20 years ago.