Discussion: Global Warming and Other Environmental Issues

[Heretic]

The one thing that I didn't get in Al Gore's film A Simple Truth, was when he brought out the graph chart showing temperatures and our past ice ages. I'm wondering if I read or misheard what he was talking about because according to that chart where the spike is at during our present time, it was at the same level or even passed(can't fully remember)the past spikes he himself said were past ice ages.

So technically, was he full of **** and didn't realize it or did I miss something?

That movie is simply full of lies and half truths. A British court even ruled that it was.

Al Gore presented a graph showing the rise of C02 which then resulted in temperature increases. Uh oh...pretty good evidence!!!

OOPS! Turns out what Gore did was FLIP the data...and the actual data showed that the temperature rose, which naturally then led to a rise in C02. When temperatures heat up, the oceans release C02. That was a proven case of lies...I mean mistakes that werent intentional at all.

In related news: Al Gore has canceled his planned appearance at the Global Climate Conference in Copenhagen. It probably had nothing to do with ClimateGate though.

 

[Figs]

That movie is simply full of lies and half truths. A British court even ruled that it was.

Al Gore presented a graph showing the rise of C02 which then resulted in temperature increases. Uh oh...pretty good evidence!!!

OOPS! Turns out what Gore did was FLIP the data...and the actual data showed that the temperature rose, which naturally then led to a rise in C02. When temperatures heat up, the oceans release C02. That was a proven case of lies...I mean mistakes that werent intentional at all.

In related news: Al Gore has canceled his planned appearance at the Global Climate Conference in Copenhagen. It probably had nothing to do with ClimateGate though.

I see. I only watched it once so wasn't sure if I needed to watch it a second time if I misinterpreted anything.

I didn't really care to watch it again mainly because I'm pretty firm in my belief that the weather changes aren't exactly or entirely man made but the Earth going through a cycle.

With that said, I do believe that we should start trying to take better care of the planet and atmosphere regardless.

 

[Heretic]

With that said, I do believe that we should start trying to take better care of the planet and atmosphere regardless.

The fact that Global Warming is a fraud should not stop anyone from wanting to improve the environment.

It's kind of like...you'll see conservatives like Bill Orielly actually DEFEND people who murder abortion doctors. Sane people watch that and think "you arent helping your cause by defending that guy". But pro-lifers want so desperately to defend their own, that they will ignore the facts. They cant g after one of their own because they think it'll somehow invalidate their entire argument.

Environmentalists are in the same boat right now. It is OBVIOUS that Global Warming has been a scam...but they are afraid that if they throw the scientists under the bus that somehow their entire movement will be discredited. In fact it is the opposite. If you stand up and demand that your own side be truthful and scientifically accurate...assure the world that these scam artists do not speak for the entire movement...then it would make the movement that much stronger. The opposing view would understand that the grassroots of the movement was NOT doing this for political purposes, and we can all get together and help drive the movement to clean up our freaking water!!!!!!!!! However, by continuing to defend these guys, it looks as if politics IS being placed above the cause itself.

It reminds me of when a few PETA members adopted 80 animals from local shelters, killed them and tossed them in a dumpster. They were arrested, and PETA paid for their defense saying they did "nothing wrong". That discredits PETA as an organization in my eyes.

Currently the Tea Party movement...one of the GREATEST movements I could imagine...has been hijacked by the Republicans. They have turned it into a partisan issue when it was George Bush who caused much of the damage. The founder of the tea parties has even come out strongly against Glen Beck and others...but damage has been done.

The lesson is...when your movement has been hijacked...get rid of the hijackers and right the course of your ship.

 

[Figs]

The fact that Global Warming is a fraud should not stop anyone from wanting to improve the environment.

It's kind of like...you'll see conservatives like Bill Orielly actually DEFEND people who murder abortion doctors. Sane people watch that and think "you arent helping your cause by defending that guy". But pro-lifers want so desperately to defend their own, that they will ignore the facts. They cant g after one of their own because they think it'll somehow invalidate their entire argument.

Good point. I'm more on the pro-life side of things and even I thought it was ignorant that those morons actually missed the point of their cause by taking lives.

It reminds me of when a few PETA members adopted 80 animals from local shelters, killed them and tossed them in a dumpster. They were arrested, and PETA paid for their defense saying they did "nothing wrong". That discredits PETA as an organization in my eyes.

Wow, I don't think I ever heard of that happening before. I've heard of a few stories where PETA placed lizards and certain animals on farm lands/owned property in some little ravines and whatnot. Then claimed that the owners living there were disrupting the animals habitat and the owners ended up getting pushed out. Then later we find out the PETA psychos were full of ****.

 

[Heretic]

PETA is MESSED UP. They have an "adoption center" in my area. They are NEVER open for people to come in to adopt. In 2008 they were open for ZERO hours to the public. They took in 2,216 animals in 2008. 7 of those animals were adopted and 2,124 were euthanized, which is a ridiculous kill rate, especially for an organization which preaches about not killing animals. They even say on their website that if your pet is shy that you should euthanize it.

 

[Figs]

PETA is MESSED UP. They have an "adoption center" in my area. They are NEVER open for people to come in to adopt. In 2008 they were open for ZERO hours to the public. They took in 2,216 animals in 2008. 7 of those animals were adopted and 2,124 were euthanized, which is a ridiculous kill rate, especially for an organization which preaches about not killing animals. They even say on their website that if your pet is shy that you should euthanize it.

That's messed up. So basically this is common knowledge and yet they still have so many supporters...too many sheep in this society.

I guess their excuse would be, "it's better for the animals". The fact that they tell people they should euthanize shy pets sounds very Nazi'ish. Get rid of the unwanted and weak, they just bog down society.

 

[Marx]

As I've said many times, it should never be seen as a bad thing to work towards a better environment.

 

[SuperFerret]

Defining "better" is difficult.

 

[SuBe]

As I've said many times, it should never be seen as a bad thing to work towards a better environment.

Having Government raise taxes and increase regulation on unproven or fraudulent science should never be an option.

 

[Paradoxium]

Tell you what, people who wants to help the environment can donate their savings to carbon credits. Problem solved.

 

[SuBe]

Tell you what, people who were suckered into wanting to help the environment because of fraudulent science can donate their savings to the carbon credits scam. Problem solved.

fixed

 

[SuperFerret]

Nobody wants to help the environment. They want to keep it stagnant so the conditions are conducive for human survival. This is the main reason I dislike environmentalists. A healthy environment is a changing one. We need to adapt to it, not vice versa.

 

[Marx]

Nobody wants to help the environment. They want to keep it stagnant so the conditions are conducive for human survival. This is the main reason I dislike environmentalists. A healthy environment is a changing one. We need to adapt to it, not vice versa.

Man-made pollution is a serious issue and one that should be dealt with.

 

[SuBe]

Man-made pollution is a serious issue and one that should be dealt with.

How do you deal with it? By making it taboo or by taxing the public to death, reduce business, the economy and redistribute the wealth to nations that want it to fund their own programs and vote buying schemes back at home?

 

[SuperFerret]

Because it's unhealthy to the species currently living on the planet, but all man-made pollution will do to the environment is influence what species will develop in the future.

 

[Marx]

How do you deal with it? By making it taboo or by taxing the public to death, reduce business, the economy and redistribute the wealth to nations that want it to fund their own programs and vote buying schemes back at home?

What do you propose we do about it? Leave it alone and destroy the planet beyond repair?

 

[SuperFerret]

It can't destroy the planet. It can't.

 

[Paradoxium]

I will only take you as an environmentalist seriously, if you stop using toilet paper. And use a wash rag or your left hand.

 

[Paradoxium]

How does "carbon credits" improve the environment? It's a "feel less guilty" video game cheat code.

 

[Marx]

I will only take you as an environmentalist seriously, if you stop using toilet paper. And use a wash rag or your left hand.

I am not a tree hugging hippie...I just think it is incredibly irresponsible to continue this pace of pollution. Whether global warming is real or not, working towards greener energy and other alternatives is something we should be doing.

 

[Carcharodon]

Global Warming...the trillion dollar scam that has killed millions...is a fraud. Instead of focusing on REAL issues, and you mentioned a few, the environmental movement has been hijacked and focused on a non-threat.

I'm sorry, but when you repeatedly mention that "millions" of people have been killed as a direct result of this supposed "fraud," it's really hard not to assume you're talking out of your ass. Happen to have a source for that?

Also, people should really be checking this site out: http://www.realclimate.org/

This is site where scientists contribute to discussions about climate change and current events in climate science. Yes, they're addressing Climategate.

 

[Carcharodon]

Having Government raise taxes and increase regulation on unproven or fraudulent science should never be an option.

Excess atmospheric carbon is still a major environmental problem. Which part of this concept are you having trouble understanding? I've sure mentioned it enough.

Here's the scary thing, though. Let's assume that carbon dioxide has a negligible effect on global temperatures. Let's also assume that Heretic's assertion that rising global temperatures cause a release of carbon dioxide from the world's oceans (which is actually firmly based in fact: water's capacity for dissolved gasses decreases as water temperature increases). Let's also assume that the earth is cooling.

This is BAD news. Really bad. The capacity for carbon dioxide in the world's oceans will increase, thereby resulting in a greater conversion to carbonic acid, which will lower the pH of the oceans even MORE.

If you guys are right, we're actually in MORE trouble with our carbon output than we were otherwise. Super.

 

[chaseter]

Global warming is real...yet the only research data that shows that it is real is that data that has been tampered with, with peer reviews forbidden and data destroyed and new data invented to replace it.

The untampered with data shows global COOLING.

In your post you even admit that the earth has had wild temperature changes many times before humans ever thought of inventing a car or factory. Maybe, just maybe the sun has something to do with it...unless yu think the science shows that man made carbon dioxide has traveled back in time to alter temperatures in the distant past.

One of Al Gore's boys discovered a way to eliminate carbon emissions with a new way of tilling soil. His research showed it would eliminate ALL of it. He was fired.

Common sense may say that global warming must certainly be happening, but science does not. Odd that a few months ago the "science was settled" and now that its been proven to be a fraud science no longer matters because we have common sense.

And once again...the scam artists have dropped "global warming" as their cause. It is now "Climate Change" meaning summer and winter are unnatural and man made...rain is mad made, the morning dew is the result of man...everything is...and we must be taxed.

Science does not huh So us outputting tons of CO2 and destroying the plants that convert means it doesn't exist Does it magically go away?

So volcanoes erupting, massive contintental fires, all of which output tons of CO2 and destroy vegetation would have no effect on the climate

Outputting CO2 and destorying vegetation causes the Earth to warm. The Earth will correct itself and then cool to offset the warming. Think of it as cleaning the slate. So, lets keep outputting tons of CO2 and clear cutting forests right Nothing will happen because Global Warming/Climate Change is a hoax

 

[chaseter]

Having Government raise taxes and increase regulation on unproven or fraudulent science should never be an option.

Taxing is stupid. Regulating industry is not. There is nothing wrong with trying to reduce carbon emissions. Do you want to live in Mexico City or Hong Kong where businesses are loosely regulated?

 

[Carcharodon]

Fairly certain it was in the UK.