Earth Life Likely Came from Mars

This evidence actually lends support to both hypotheses.

Not really. Look at all the scant probabilities the theory is dependent upon.

An oxidized form of the element molybdenum, which may have been crucial to the origin of life, was likely available on the Red Planet's surface long ago, but unavailable on Eart

Another point in Mars' favor is the likelihood that the early Earth was completely covered by water

It is possible that life on Mars - if it ever existed

Accumulated probabilities do not equal certainties, nor do they equal evidence. All they equal is an unfounded hypothetical.
 
I don't believe any of the crap these scientists say. I haven't trusted them ever since they committed a hate crime against Pluto by taking away its planetary status. They're obviously biased. When they stop discriminating against Pluto, maybe then I'll give them another chance.
 
I don't believe any of the crap these scientists say. I haven't trusted them ever since they committed a hate crime against Pluto by taking away its planetary status. They're obviously biased. When they stop discriminating against Pluto, maybe then I'll give them another chance.

I agree. Down with planetary segregation.
 
You don't know that life ever ever ever existed on Mars, but there is "mounting evidence" that it came from Mars? Sounds like front-page news pseudo-science to me.

Yeah right now they are tracking the right conditions, the mounting evidence, will eventually either show there was life there or not, hence they explore test and report on it, that's how it works. What's so pseudo or stupid about that?
 
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I thought they found bacteria fossils on Mars?
They found something that resembles fossilized bacteria but not necessarily bacteria itself. It was inconclusive at best. It's more likely coincidental in reality.

This isn't new either, at least the speculation on the possiblity of proto-life coming form Mars or an asteroid. Things like amino acids and other chemicals required for life to form have been theorized to exist off Earth, not that there's evidence yet there is some kind of life out there or that lifeforms hitched a ride on a comet or something.
 
Yeah right now they are tracking the right conditions, the mounting evidence, will eventually either show there was life there or not, hence they explore test and report on it, that's how it works. What's so pseudo or stupid about that?

Because it isn't mounting evidence. Its a line of possibility open to exploration, but not mounting evidence. The story has been clearly sensationalized to be a news story, because saying "Earth Life Likely Came From Mars" is more attention-grabbing than pointing to the massive uncertainties involved in the hypothesis. This isn't a discovery, there isn't even really new evidence in the article - there's just a hypothetical that sounds fun so it got published for general, mainstream readers.

Its stupid because it is sensationalized as being something more than it is. And because the supposed "conclusions" are given undue weight, it is pseudo-scientific in its presentation.
 
Because it isn't mounting evidence. Its a line of possibility open to exploration, but not mounting evidence. The story has been clearly sensationalized to be a news story, because saying "Earth Life Likely Came From Mars" is more attention-grabbing than pointing to the massive uncertainties involved in the hypothesis. This isn't a discovery, there isn't even really new evidence in the article - there's just a hypothetical that sounds fun so it got published for general, mainstream readers.

Its stupid because it is sensationalized as being something more than it is. And because the supposed "conclusions" are given undue weight, it is pseudo-scientific in its presentation.

Don't most articles, the scientific ones especially, have "attention-grabbing" titles?
 
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The King of Mars approves of this hypothesis.
 
Don't most articles, the scientific ones especially, have "attention-grabbing" titles?
Only when it's a journalist or other non-scientist making the title. Scientists don't typically write their own news stories.
 
Don't most articles, the scientific ones especially, have "attention-grabbing" titles?

Real academic scientific articles get published in peer-reviewed journals.

But yeah, most popular news media scientific articles do. Which is kinda my point.
 
And germs make our kryptonite? Must be Martians too
 
Because it isn't mounting evidence. Its a line of possibility open to exploration, but not mounting evidence. The story has been clearly sensationalized to be a news story, because saying "Earth Life Likely Came From Mars" is more attention-grabbing than pointing to the massive uncertainties involved in the hypothesis. This isn't a discovery, there isn't even really new evidence in the article - there's just a hypothetical that sounds fun so it got published for general, mainstream readers.

Its stupid because it is sensationalized as being something more than it is. And because the supposed "conclusions" are given undue weight, it is pseudo-scientific in its presentation.

Nothing by the guy said it was conclusive, its a line of possibility not just open to exploration but already being explored, not pseudo as you claimed, with mounting evidence that the conditions may have been there, that's exactly what the guy's research shows. You just chose to ignore that and focus on the stupid instead of what the guy actually said.

Deal with it you freakin Martians!:yay:
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For them to say evidence is mounting, they sure are using the words likely, possibly, and maybe, a lot.
 
For them to say evidence is mounting, they sure are using the words likely, possibly, and maybe, a lot.
Evidence the size of Mount Rushmore, they need

I hope they enlighten us enough to say Earth itself is a clone of Mars or a piece of Mars
 
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Accumulated probabilities do not equal certainties, nor do they equal evidence. All they equal is an unfounded hypothetical.
Support for a hypothesis =/= certainty. You seem to be suffering from some severe and, sadly, common misconceptions about science in general. Nothing is certain in science. This is a central tenet of the philosophy. Probability is everything.

Another way of putting this is to repeat what I said earlier in this thread: hypotheses are never actually accepted or proven - the best you can EVER do is fail to reject them at some specified level of statistical significance (see: "probability").
 
Support for a hypothesis =/= certainty. You seem to be suffering from some severe and, sadly, common misconceptions about science in general. Nothing is certain in science. This is a central tenet of the philosophy. Probability is everything.

Another way of putting this is to repeat what I said earlier in this thread: hypotheses are never actually accepted or proven - the best you can EVER do is fail to reject them at some specified level of statistical significance (see: "probability").

First off, I never said support for a hypothesis = certainty. You seem to have read into my comment, and your response is by result largely a straw man. But I'll answer it anyways, with a patronizing lecture in return for your own.

The scientific era as we know it was born in the Enlightenment, in which philosophy assumed in general the objective validity, truth, and clarity of what we observe in nature and can argue through rationality. The scientific method has always been inherently empirical. This means it needs to rely on actual demonstrable evidence (note, here "evidence" doesn't necessarily have to be tangible, but it needs to be provable).

No theory can be considered infallibly certain, i.e. above questioning or challenge. It is always possible that new evidence or reasoning may arise that negates a prior accepted theory. But to read what I said in my above comment as meaning "infallible certainty" would be an uncharitable over-reading of my position. This doesn't mean that theories can't be "certain," "proven," or "accepted" - indeed these terms are used all the time in the scientific community because scientists are largely not postmoderns. The point is that some sort of demonstrable evidence or reasoning is required - the theory cannot subsist merely on probabilities. The theory in this news article is not in the slightest demonstrable - it is prima facie plausible in presentation, but no "mounting evidence" is actually shown. A hypothesis it is, but it isn't one giving anyone a reason to take it very seriously.
 
Earth soil: Different colors and properties

Mars: The Red Planet

I'll take the possibility in discussion for granted, just for that
 
First off, I never said support for a hypothesis = certainty. You seem to have read into my comment, and your response is by result largely a straw man. But I'll answer it anyways, with a patronizing lecture in return for your own.
Then why make a big deal about words like "maybe," and "may," which are commonplace (and, in fact, necessary) in scientific discussion? You may not have stated it explicitly, but it sure seemed as though that was the implication, especially given the context of our initial exchange. Otherwise your focus on those words makes literally *zero* sense: you excluded these findings from the category of "support" because of what amounts to cumulative uncertainty. This seems to indicate a fundamental ignorance of not only the language that is common to scientific discussions, but of some of the central tenets of the scientific method itself (and, most importantly, the role of probability in its application).

And your original premise about not knowing whether life existed on Mars invalidating the idea that evidence can be mounted for panspermia of Martian origin is horribly flawed. If there is support for the latter hypothesis, then it stands to reason that it must also serve as support for the former, and knowledge of the former a priori is not necessarily required. This is basic logic.

ThePhantasm said:
The scientific era as we know it was born in the Enlightenment, in which philosophy assumed in general the objective validity, truth, and clarity of what we observe in nature and can argue through rationality. The scientific method has always been inherently empirical. This means it needs to rely on actual demonstrable evidence (note, here "evidence" doesn't necessarily have to be tangible, but it needs to be provable).

No theory can be considered infallibly certain, i.e. above questioning or challenge. It is always possible that new evidence or reasoning may arise that negates a prior accepted theory. But to read what I said in my above comment as meaning "infallible certainty" would be an uncharitable over-reading of my position. This doesn't mean that theories can't be "certain," "proven," or "accepted" - indeed these terms are used all the time in the scientific community because scientists are largely not postmoderns. The point is that some sort of demonstrable evidence or reasoning is required - the theory cannot subsist merely on probabilities. The theory in this news article is not in the slightest demonstrable - it is prima facie plausible in presentation, but no "mounting evidence" is actually shown. A hypothesis it is, but it isn't one giving anyone a reason to take it very seriously.
And each of those premises - the supposed availability of oxidized Molybdenum, water covering the earth, etc. - is based upon...

...wait for it...

empirical evidence.

You seem to be under the impression that empiricism is, itself, free from uncertainty. This is simply not the case. Uncertainty is built in to the principles that allow the utilization of empirical evidence/data (the ones which collectively constitute the scientific method), and even empirical data are prone to such phenomena as measurement error, etc.

You don't seem to fully grasp or appreciate the actual implications of what you're saying here - not the least of which is the idea that inference based upon accumulated evidence (which is, in turn, based upon empirical data) is either impossible or at the very least untenable.

If we were to subscribe to that reasoning, evolutionary theory - especially as it applies to macroevolution - would fall into the same category as you claim the hypotheses we are discussing now do.

So, while it was a nice lecture you gave, it missed the point - badly.
 
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So it's my fault that you don't understand that comments can have implications beyond what is intended? K.
You know the basics, evidence should confirm, not stick as maybes
I.F said they're not saying it right
You quoted him and held it for scientific illiteracy
 

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