Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Discussion in 'Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice' started by The Valeyard, Nov 20, 2013.

  1. DarkSentinel

    DarkSentinel Well-Known Member

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    Actually, I found that a simple pair of glasses changed Cavill quite up. Cav-El to Henry if you will :cwink: With that galoofy (aloof/goofy, sue me, I had to make up a word :o) half-grin of his, I thought it really changed up his look. I'd buy that as a first impression.

    [​IMG]

    But only as a first impression. They established that Lois is fully aware of who Clark is, so she becomes the solution to "Daily Planet Clark". She's a Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative journalist, she probably knows a thing or two about blending in.

    They also have a huge opportunity to go more "local" with MOS2/WF/BvS. Clark should still be on "stringer" duty at the start of the film, so we can see him get a feel for Metropolis and blending in among the crowd. This is a very good chance for Henry to showcase some serious skills.

    Point is, Goyer didn't "write himself into a corner" or whatever. He gave himself and the filmmakers an opportunity to reinvent one of the core elements of the Superman character.
     
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  2. J.Drangal

    J.Drangal Well-Known Member

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    It would have been cool to have Clark as a free-lance reporter at the beginning of the film. Imagine him specialized in maybe UFOs and other strange stories, as a cover to looking for some answer of who he really is. In his trips, he needs to sometimes use his powers to help people, and such events lead the famous Lois Lane on the trail of the mysterious hero.
    We would had a game of cat and mouse that could have been interesting, and foreshadowing their future relationship before Zod's arrival.
    And this manner, at the end of the movie, Perry White would have received an article about Superman, and amazed by the style of the author and after have checking his anterior work, he had decided to hire this young Kent to put in a team with Lois, thus combining the advantages of a field reporter (Lois in the first line in the destruction of Metropolis) and a reporter for effective pen.
    Anyway, just an idea to make Clark's job at the Daily Planet something more believable, or more fluid. But to be honest, It doesn't bother me the way it is. One line or two in the next film can precise why Clark works here without any problem.
    About the glasses, I think we have to not forget that in almost every fiction and in particular in superhero genre, there's a deal between creators and spectators, a little something that they share, to create a link between them and to give the audience the feel to be advantaged in order to maintain the interest. Here, Clark and his glasses. No need to nitpicking about the "realistic" aspect of the movie, the glasses are just a gimmick, a classic element. Nobody ever asks how Peter Parker takes pictures of Spiderman in weird angles and incongruous places.
     
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  3. sf2

    sf2 Well-Known Member

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    bingo. we got a winner.
     
    #103
  4. LibidoLoca

    LibidoLoca Sensually Delicious

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    NEVAH GONNA HAPPEN. At least it wouldn't have during the years when CBMs took the Nolan approach, but with the rise of Marvel and the leniency of 'teh realism' I agree. :p
     
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  5. Afrobean

    Afrobean Well-Known Member

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    Celebrities do not fly high above the city. They can not speedily destroy any camera that might capture them. Celebrities are famous for having their faces in movies, etc., but Superman would be famous for being heroic. Do you know what even one member of "Seal Team Six" who took down bin Laden looks like, could you identify them if you saw them on the street?

    Furthermore, celebrities can and do go out into the world without people recognizing them. Some people might notice it's a celebrity through the lack of makeup, drab attire, sunglasses, etc., but they're still likely to think "there's no way I just saw that person." Not that it matters anyway since almost no one knows what Superman's face looks like anyway.
     
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  6. jonathancrane

    jonathancrane I love Marvel, DC & EC!

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    This reinforces what I have said for a while: Goyer does not understand the character. At all. I am far from a Superman expert or hardened fan (even though I love Superman Returns,) but the glasses and Clark Kent chameleon image are part of the fantasy, like Batman's red telephone to police headquarters or Ollie Queen having his Arrow-Cave (or to borrow a name from Harley Quinn from the Injustice comic, Quiver,) beneath his club. Trying to explain them exhaustively causes these artistic crystal to shatter.
     
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  7. DA_Champion

    DA_Champion Well-Known Member

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    The reason the human side has been emphasized over the alien side is that the human side is more interesting and more relateable.

    Further, even if it were worthwhile to focus on the alien side, Goyer didn't do a very good job of exploring the alien side at all, so that point is moot. The world-building on Krypton was shallow and inconsistent. It was basically a barrage of exposition, infantile bad-assery (Jor-El easily beating up Zod, etc), CGI, undeveloped concepts, and contradictions. They told us Clark was bullied as a child, but it was stated matter-of-factly, they didn't show him as being different at all. He looked the same, behaved the same, and behaved the same as any 9 year old boy would as far as the audience was concerned.

    He didn't have a different development curve either intellectually, emotionally, or physically (aside from hidden superpowers other kids would not know about). Under the hands of a better writer who was both more competent and did wish to explore the alien side, Clark might have spoken in a manner that used slightly different rules of grammar, had different circadian rhythms, had a different physical development cycle (i.e. can't walk until age 4), and different emotional responses, etc. Then you would have an explored alien side. You need to have substance for the alien side to be explored.

    They concluded Bruce Wayne's character by giving him a happy ending. The general audience loved it, but die hard fans of the character didn't because it was original and they think that Bruce Wayne should be Batman for 15,000 nights of his life rather than a more compelling ~300 nights.

    And that is hardly the "most famous" case of writer's block.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 21, 2013
  8. Kevin Smith

    Kevin Smith Well-Known Member

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    I like your way of thinking, but I don't see why the secret identity must be played for complete laughs or strictly laughs. There can be a lot of great moments with it too, take Superman: The Movie for instance where right after Superman drops Lois off from the first flight with her as the camera watches Superman leave the camera, as Lois collects herself, there's a knock at her door, and who is it but Clark Kent! <<< That is fantastic, a moment like that, and I laugh but not in like a "har! har!" way, but it is humor that does not disrupt the movie and fits very appropriately with the characters and enhances them, not a "boy are they sure stupid huh huh!" way, but in a "this is our (the audience) secret" sort of way, which is how it should play, IMO.

    I would just play the secret identity thing as very mater of fact and just leave it at that. It is a staple of Superman and has to be there. It is what should be in a Superman movie, naturally.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 21, 2013
  9. The Valeyard

    The Valeyard Well-Known Member

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    That wasn't addressed onscreen.

    It was a coincidence that he was at the same bar as the military officers talking about the crashed ship. He wasn't actively researching his origins and seeking clues out. If he was, it wasn't established well in the few scenes they provided.



    There has to be a logic within the context of the film's own universe though, as to how the disguise works and how the other characters are fooled by it.

    Without that, it's hard to perceive the other characters as anything more than idiots. There needs to be Donner's concept of verisimilitude. At least in the sense of there being a logic to the disguise within the context of the MoS world, even if it's harder to swallow in our own real world.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 21, 2013
  10. charl_huntress

    charl_huntress Well-Known Member

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    :whatever:

    Dude...you clearly weren't watching the movie. Jonathon told him he NEEDED to look for the answers to WHY he was here on earth. Heck! You could even say Jonathon sent him on the quest.

    Done with you. :whatever:
     
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  11. The Valeyard

    The Valeyard Well-Known Member

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    He looked exactly the same. Exactly.

    The jawline makes it obvious. His hairline and hairstyle makes it obvious. His voice was the same. His mannerisms were similar enough.

    Nothing was really changed except for the addition of the glasses, which on their own do nothing.


    Despite the fact that he admits in the interview that it's a "corner." They didn't plan it out. They sidestepped it in MoS and now they're going to have to try and contrive something together.
     
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  12. The Valeyard

    The Valeyard Well-Known Member

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    His time as a drifter didn't showcase that. He's 33, so we can assume he's been drifting for several years, yet his big break only came when he conveniently overheard a conversation by those military officers at the bar he was working at?

    Doesn't sound like he was actively researching or seeking out his origins. He just stumbled on to them when the plot called for it.

    His time on the boat and the Oil Rig didn't have much to do with him actively seeking out his origins either.

    He was portrayed as drifting for the sake of drifting, mainly for plot convenience and surface similarities to Batman Begins.


    Back on topic, my point is that they could have gone many different ways with those years. A way that would facilitate the reporter 'Clark Kent' alter ego better.
     
    #112
  13. charl_huntress

    charl_huntress Well-Known Member

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    You clearly need to watch the movie again, or your trolling for arguments when the answers you want are actually in the film.

    I can't get down with you, dude.

    You're on your own.
     
    #113
  14. DA_Champion

    DA_Champion Well-Known Member

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    That's the way I understood, he didn't know what to do with his life, so he took odd jobs, like working on a fishing boat.

    Fortune favoured him, and one of his old jobs brought him in close proximity to an alien ship excavation, and because Lois Lane was there, information leaked to the local radio stations.
     
    #114
  15. FeedOnATreeFrog

    FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    His search for his origins is not the reason why he's drifting, and he's not drifting for 'no reason'.

    He moves from city to city, taking new names, etc, because he's trying to 'cover his tracks' after using his powers.

    He does owe it to himself "to find out what that reason is", as Jonathan says, but that only comes into play when he overhears the news up north.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 21, 2013
  16. The Valeyard

    The Valeyard Well-Known Member

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    I pointed up above as to why the 'drifting' aspect of the film was poorly defined.

    And sadly, that was just one of the many elements of the film that were poorly executed. I'm in agreement with this review: http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/vi...egade-cut/41364-the-trouble-with-man-of-steel

    Decent concepts, poor execution.


    I'd buy that as a more logical reason, but even that was weakly defined onscreen.
     
    #116
  17. charl_huntress

    charl_huntress Well-Known Member

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    Why did he have the damn key around his neck then? You think he carried it for good luck?
     
    #117
  18. RAE072

    RAE072 Samhain

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    [​IMG]
     
    #118
  19. RAE072

    RAE072 Samhain

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    A man who the general public barely ever sees in real life, wearing clothes people don't wear ever(his supersuit), flying around and doing super stuff would look very different if you put him on the ground, changed his posture, put him in normal, every day clothes, changed his hair, and gave him glasses.

    It's very simple and very plausible.
     
    #119
  20. TheBat812

    TheBat812 Well-Known Member

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    I kind of like the idea that it could sort of be a case of 'don't ask, don't tell' with clark and those who actually know him. It shouldn't be overtly obvious that he's superman, but to those who know him, it would be interesting to see them question it: "Do you think Clark is Superman?" "Nah, no way." Lord knows we could use a fresh take on his 'disguise,' it's only been what, 70 years... Having said that, I hardly think it's important enough to this story to be a point of interest unless it involves Bruce figuring it out.
     
    #120
  21. FeedOnATreeFrog

    FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    I sort of doubt that he was working on that fishing boat so that he could look in the Ocean for spaceships.

    I also doubt he worked at that bar because he thought there might be spaceships nearby.
     
    #121
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2013
  22. TheBat812

    TheBat812 Well-Known Member

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    It seemed to me he wore it because it was the only piece of his heritage he actually had left (that was wearable).
     
    #122
  23. DA_Champion

    DA_Champion Well-Known Member

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    I can't find the words 'no reason' in my post.
     
    #123
  24. FeedOnATreeFrog

    FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    Sorry, referencing two different users here.
     
    #124
  25. Bigjxxx

    Bigjxxx Well-Known Member

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    This is why the next movie should be directed and written by two persons.
     
    #125

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