I love the Burton Batman films...but compared to Batman Begins, they are crap.

[Catman]

Superman Returns doesn't eliminate anything about the Reeve franchise, it just ignores a lot of it.

Which is the movie's flaw! Comic book fans can deal with it. Especially DC fans who have had to deal with multiple Earths and what-not. Moviegoers who know nothing about the comics need specifics. Is it a sequel or not? Is it a direct sequel or not? They need specifics. What Singer should have done is a retcon. Allow the Donner films to exist but simply re-write it.

EDIT:

Singer didn't want an origin film. Fine! But, he should have included a 5-minute montage which retold the origin which at the same time created a new continuity for the film that makes sense to viewers.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Which is the movie's flaw! Comic book fans can deal with it. Especially DC fans who have had to deal with multiple Earths and what-not. Moviegoers who know nothing about the comics need specifics. Is it a sequel or not? Is it a direct sequel or not? They need specifics. What Singer should have done is a retcon. Allow the Donner films to exist but simply re-write it.

EDIT:

Singer didn't want an origin film. Fine! But, he should have included a 5-minute montage which retold the origin which at the same time created a new continuity for the film that makes sense to viewers.

As much as I enjoyed Superman Returns, it's not without it's flaws (The same goes for Burton's films). Singer's pathetic "Is it a sequel or is it not" bull annoyed me to no end. If it's a sequel to Superman II, go with it. If not, then don't. As it stands, only parts of #2 are in continuity... it really bugs me.

I would have prefurred that we got a definitive opening for SR that showed the events of S:TM, slightly altered (Modern day instead of 1978, thus effectively retconning ONLY the original time period for S:TM), either in footage or the original comic-book opening. And then he goes to Krypton. Nothing from #2. Luthor was in jail for the Missile plot, Lois has a kid with Richard (The superkid didn't really bug me, it was handeled well, but was impossible to please a ton of people with, better to have not done it), and then, the film goes as follows, maybe with the deleted stuff back in and a brighter look.

I think that would have pleased a lot more people.

 

[Catman]

Agreed. I'm not a Superman Returns hater. In fact, I have praised the film for its awesome ideas. The problem is that the ideas weren't excuted well. Singer and company should have invested more time in re-writing the screenplay. An extra draft would have helped. Perhaps even bringing in an extra writer.

 

[dude stannis]

I would've kept Returns as it was except I'd make it a direct sequel to #2. Also I would've added either newspaper articles or comic booky sketches summerising the prior two films.

 

[Catman]

One problem though...you have to ignore the amnesia kiss and the earth turned around or keep it and find a good explanation.

 

[El Payaso]

I love the Nolan/Burton Batman films debates...but compared to Superman Returns talking, they are crap.

 

[dude stannis]

F**ken oath El Payaso! t:

Well, I'd explain it as Superman using a wormhole his ship opened up when he first came to Earth, to go back in time?

 

[Cyrusbales]

Here we go again.....

One dimensional action film V multilayered concept art.

Did you listen to the dialogue in BB? A truley awful script in every fashion. Bale's rapist voice didn't help either. The many glaringly obvious plotholes, and the set design that really made Gotham look plain and boring. I could go on, but the first post in this thread shows me exactly why Epic Movie does well whilst The piano tuner of earthquakes remains with minimal reciepts.

 

[Proximo]

Batman begins was a action movie, wich happen to have a man dressed as a bat and a title with Batman. They could have made it a James bond movie by simply changing some names and titles...Batman begins didnt impress me at all. Its just to plain, and TO MUCH ALIKE like any other action movie.

Batman,Batman Returns and Batman forever, are REAL Batman movies.
They are not like any other movies, and they do feel like you visit a completly new world for 2 hours.

 

[Cyrusbales]

Batman begins was a action movie, wich happen to have a man dressed as a bat and a title with Batman. They could have made it a James bond movie by simply changing some names and titles...Batman begins didnt impress me at all. Its just to plain, and TO MUCH ALIKE like any other action movie.

Batman,Batman Returns and Batman forever, are REAL Batman movies.
They are not like any other movies, and they do feel like you visit a completly new world for 2 hours.

I am with you all the way, although the Batman Forever comment throws that off a little TBH.

But yeah, bit in bold, spot on!

 

[Proximo]

I threw in Batman forever because some scenes in it is so good, Like the scene after Dick save batman and they have the Two-Face conversation in the batcave. The dialoge there is amazing IMO. Probably the best acting from both Val and Chris in the whole movie.

 

[Cyrusbales]

I threw in Batman forever because some scenes in it is so good, Like the scene after Dick save batman and they have the Two-Face conversation in the batcave. The dialoge there is amazing IMO. Probably the best acting from both Val and Chris in the whole movie.

I think Forever, whilst having good moments, fails overall with inconsistency. Although Val Kilmer was a good Wayne. But for arguments purposes, let's keep things with Burton.

Burton>>>>>>>>>Nolan

 

[Super78]

Burton OWNS Nolan.

That is all.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Just to re-establish something.... it's all only your guys' opinions that Burton "owns" Nolan. It's an opinion I share as well. But, it is just that.

After a recent brush with beligerency, I've had to take a step back and remind myself not to be such as ass when it comes to expressing my pro-Burton feelings. You don't have to start every sentence with "IMO", but remember that if you go from Burton praise to outright Nolan bashing (Which can be easy to do), you're asking for trouble.

Yeah, there are "Nolanites" (For lack of a better term) that can be quite 'wacked' when it comes to praise of Nolan over Burton. But all it takes is for someone who feels opposite to respond on the same level and then you've got war. Or vice-versa, even.

My only point is don't be a jerk. If you're proudly pro-Burton, go for it! If you think Nolan did something wrong, express this belief intelligently, and if somebody goes copping an attitude from your opinion (assuming you didn't express it like a jackass), prove them wrong, don't return the jackassery.

I don't know why, I just felt that I had to say this after a very personal brush with somebody very pro-Nolan.

 

[I_Hate_U_All]

Nolan's bland, boring, paint by numbers stupid film will be forgotten and Burton's artistic, beautiful fantasy will be remembered.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Nolan's bland, boring, paint by numbers stupid film will be forgotten and Burton's artistic, beautiful fantasy will be remembered.

Well now there's an agreeable fellow.

 

[Bat Attack]

Nolan's bland, boring, paint by numbers stupid film will be forgotten and Burton's artistic, beautiful fantasy will be remembered.

That pretty much says it all.

 

[I_Hate_U_All]

Hey I'm just a guy who's tired of being suppressed by the Nolanites.

I wish the guys who did V for Vendetta did batman because they know how to make a good memorable film that unfortunately since it's not called B for Batman, goes mostly unnoticed... what a world...

A movie that required thought, was edited better, kicks, smacks, pounds, and crushes everything begins was trying to be by doing it all better, and it gets little respect. Wow!

 

[dude stannis]

Well now there's an agreeable fellow.

I just love how that followed your post about expressing your beleifs intelligently. Almost like he was being sarcastic.

 

[Bat Attack]

wow, the tension just rose in here...

 

[DocLathropBrown]

I just love how that followed your post about expressing your beleifs intelligently. Almost like he was being sarcastic.

I'm quite sure that he was. His sudden appearance here is obviously meant to disrupt any positive message I had.

@ I_Hate_U_All: We're not being surpressed anymore. And it wasn't so much oppression as it was flaming. At the time of BB's release, we were. Not anymore. Being a beligerent jackass doesn't make fellow Burton fans look any better. People like you make the rest of us look like pathetic fanboys instead of people with a preference. Well, the few of us Burton fans that AREN'T idiots.

 

[I_Hate_U_All]

No sarcasm, just answering in KIND to the topic itself.

So on the topic:

What the hell is this???? ----> http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ipn4rYP0dUQ

[Micky Mouse voice]: It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me.

I've seen better on tv last week.

I can't wait until people finally wake up and realize begins wasn't deserving all its praise. I think they already have judging by the overrated thread in the other section. I'm not even speaking from a Burton lover perspective, even. as a film fan, it just didn't work for me as a "great" film. It's not something I ever care to watch again. Sorry, Nolanites. Deal with it.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Hate, I've got my reservations about Batman Begins, but you're just an immature idiot. Here's hoping the mods crack down on your almost-certain atttempts to get a war going.

And some argument you have there. He sounds nothing like Mickey Mouse. Maybe you need your ears checked. You couldn't successfully aruge any superiority Tim Burton might have if your life depended on it. "Begins sucks" isn't worth a damn.

 

[I_Hate_U_All]

What? You're shifting blame for silly batman arguments online on me? Did I make this thread?

 

[DocLathropBrown]

You're setting back the image I've tried to give to Burton fans. That we aren't just fanboy idiots that cannot move on from what's past. That to dislike BB doesn't make us dumb, it makes us opinionated.

Your behavior will only further stereotype us.

Now, are you going to dodge what I actually said again like you just did? I did nothing to claim you were the source of any arguments. You fail at reading comprehension.