Is Zorro a Superhero?

[Alien Anal]

Yet Zorro also has the money, and gadgets, access to the best of his time, and a few inventions of his own.
He's got a sprawling vineyard and huge hacienda atop a silver vein.
As for gadgets; Sword, main-gauche-dagger, throwing knives, pistol, bullwhip, bolas, black-powder explosives and glycerin (in glass pellet) bombs, smoke bombs, has used bow and arrow, flintlock rifle, crossbow, crossbow loaded grapple, herbs, poisons, hallucinogens, knock out pellets, etc...
For Vehicle, he's got the most versatile, on or off road, can outrun anything in the land, jump chasms, barricades, effortlessly maneuver through heavily wooded areas, safely through crowds, has stealth, and it's remote control - answers and takes specific commands to whistles = Tornado!

Man Zorro is a bad ass!

I'm not a fan of pirates of the Caribbean but I can imagine a Zorro film done in a similar fashion could be pretty rad. No need to set it in modern times.

 

[Thundarr]

No, he's mexican.

Last time I checked Los Angeles was located in California.

 

[Thundarr]

Yes Zorro is a superhero, just as Batman, Hawkeye, Green Arrow, Robin, Nightwing, Batgirl, Huntress, Katana, and God only knows how many others are superheroes.

Does Zorro fight space aliens and evil robots on a regular basis? No, but neither did Batman early in his crime fighting career. The early issues of Detective Comics had Batman mostly solving murders and burglaries, things like that. He didn't start fighting more fantastic villains like Poison Ivy and Clay Face until much later.

Had Zorro's writers thought of having him go up against aliens and robots from outer space or mutants with strange and frightening powers way back when he was at the height of his popularity in pop culture, I'm sure they would have done so. And he likely would have kicked butt as well.

 

[Breogan]

Man Zorro is a bad ass!

I'm not a fan of pirates of the Caribbean but I can imagine a Zorro film done in a similar fashion could be pretty rad. No need to set it in modern times.

Further Adventures of Zorro Johnston McCulley (1922)
"...In stumbled the pirates, their blades held ready.
"Take him alive! barbados thundered. "Catch me this land pirate!...​

True, the character was half pirate, in story he's actually referred to as a "land-pirate". The second pulp Zorro story written by Mcculley turned into a novel, was a huge swashbuckling adventure, pretty much Zorro the Pirate hunter. Where his now main villain aka the scarface he marked in the first. Secretly highers Pirates to raid Los Angeles. Amongst much looting, they steel two main treasures, one a relic from a church, the other Diego's bride to be who scarface is obsessed with.
Zorro single handedly hunts them down, jumps a moonlit cliff into the ocean below, and in pursuit secretly boards their ship, and like a true pirate exploits their superstitions, and haunts them at sea, picking the cutthroats off one by one.

The character was unique in that he really lived at a time on the perfect cusp between two great genres, the swashbuckling pirate adventurer , and the classic western. And created during the masked pulp-hero explosion.
He had a foot in many worlds.

The pre-Disney Zorro Dell comics, which first recreated McCulley stories into comics, visually emphasised the pirate side, obviously the bandana he already had, but even including earing.

 

[Octoberist]

Zorro is not a superhero but a Zuperhero.

 

[Loki882]

It sort of depends on what your own personal definition of a "Superhero" is. To some people, you need to have actual superpowers in order to be a "superhero." And some people don't even consider characters like Batman, Daredevil, Black Widow, etc to be "superheroes." They see them more as "a detective, a vigilante, and a spy."

Me personally, I DO consider those kinds of characters to be "superheroes." So yes, I also consider Zorro to be one as well. Heck you could make a case for The Lone Ranger being one as well.

 

[Loki882]

Man Zorro is a bad ass!

I'm not a fan of pirates of the Caribbean but I can imagine a Zorro film done in a similar fashion could be pretty rad. No need to set it in modern times.

We already kind of got a Zorro movie like that. It was called The Mask of Zorro, and it was awesome. The only thing that was missing was the overt supernatural stuff that's in the POTC films.

 

[Shikamaru]

It sort of depends on what your own personal definition of a "Superhero" is. To some people, you need to have actual superpowers in order to be a "superhero." And some people don't even consider characters like Batman, Daredevil, Black Widow, etc to be "superheroes." They see them more as "a detective, a vigilante, and a spy."

I always found that to be a silly definition, tbh. They're called superheroes because they can do extraordinary things. "Extraordinary" is a very broad term which goes beyond powers. It refers to any talent or ability that's remarkable or exceptional.

Then there's the issue of consistency. Is Green Lantern a superhero when he just uses highly advanced technology? If the argument is that he can do things no one in real life can do, wouldn't that qualify Batman and Daredevil as superheroes?

Speaking of real life, if someone in the future makes an actual Iron Man suit or finds a way to give themselves spider powers, do Spider-Man and Iron Man cease being superheroes?

 

[Rowsdower!]

The Scarlet Pimpernel is considered a superhero, and Zorro is way cooler than him. So yeah, he's a superhero.

 

[jmc]

Batman can easily be described as merely a hero. He has no super powers. Same with Iron Man. There's nothing inherently different between them and Zorro, other than technology.

 

[Enriquespy]

The Scarlet Pimpernel is considered a superhero, and Zorro is way cooler than him.

I partially object to these two ideas, Scarlet will rise again, I tell you!!!!.

There should be a separate term for the secret identity / customised / defenders of justice et al that have existed before superman. "Vigilantes" and simply "Heros" just don't cut it.

 

[Thundarr]

I partially object to these two ideas, Scarlet will rise again, I tell you!!!!.

There should be a separate term for the secret identity / customised / defenders of justice et al that have existed before superman. "Vigilantes" and simply "Heros" just don't cut it.

It does. They're superheroes.

Just like Batman, Robin, Nightwing, Batgirl, Batwoman, Huntress, Green Arrow, Hawkeye, Katana, etc are all superheroes.

You don't have to have super powers to be a superhero.

 

[Tanin]

All you need to be a Superhero is enough clout to make Superherohype enough advertising money when a film based off you comes out.

 

[godisawesome]

Eh, I classify Zorro and and other guys like him strictly as swashbucklers, not superheroes. I tend to think that superheroes strain some element of credibility just that tiny bit more towards the fantastic; even the "normal humans" have a ridiculous amount of training or resources. Guys like Zorro, the "demmed" Pimpernel, the Scarecrow of Romney Marsh, and Scaramouche, even though they're the original template for Batman, still depend a great deal more on sheer chutzpah and brazen willpower.

Whenever you upgrade their arsenals to the point of anachronistically matching Batman's, like in the old Zorro cartoon, then you're making them a superhero, but only for that adaptation.

This isn't a prejudice thing; I actually prefer swashbucklers in their temporal eras quite a bit more than the "back in the past superheroes." I guess it's just something about the presentation that makes it a real difference to me. Otherwise, there's not that much difference; they wear costumes, are skilled combatants and intelligent planners, and even have recurring nemeses, like Citizen Chauvelin.

 

[Mysteryman]

I find it interesting that a lot of people think Zorro is a hero But not a Superhero.
Almost as if heroes were an underclass among do gooders .
Interesting.

 

[DarthDorranceBane]

I consider myself a superhero. In fact I'll be joining the Secret Adventuring League of Mysterious Vigilantism five, or six..? years from now?

 

[Warhammer]

The difference between Batman and Zorro is scope. While they are basically the same (wealthy dude who puts on a mask and fights crime), Zorro exists in our "real" world. He fights corrupt government officials. Batman is buddies with Supes, Wonder Woman, Zatanna, and the Justice League. He is apart of an entire universe of powered individuals. Some of his rogues have powers. Because all of that does not exist in this world, I consider Batman a superhero.

Zorro has limits. Batman has no limits.

 

[Thundarr]

The difference between Batman and Zorro is scope. While they are basically the same (wealthy dude who puts on a mask and fights crime), Zorro exists in our "real" world. He fights corrupt government officials. Batman is buddies with Supes, Wonder Woman, Zatanna, and the Justice League. He is apart of an entire universe of powered individuals. Some of his rogues have powers. Because all of that does not exist in this world, I consider Batman a superhero.

Zorro has limits. Batman has no limits.

That all depends on what adaptation of Zorro you're basing your opinion on.

Granted, most versions of Zorro have been set in the "real world" (the old 1930's films, Disney's series starring Guy Williams, the 1990's series, the Antonio Banderas movies, etc). However there have been versions that have battled the supernatural, including ghosts, vampires, and demons. Some of the cartoons and comic books have had Zorro meet time travelers from the distant future. These are precisely the "fantastic elements" that Batman faces on a semi-regular basis.

And I would like to point out, once more, that when Batman was originally conceived as a character for DC comics, he was a masked detective/vigilante, nothing more. He didn't fight demons and monsters and metahumans in every issue. For years he was written as fighting gangsters, thieves, extortionists, mafia hitmen, killer's, and the like. They didn't start pitting him against superhuman villains until much later in the series.

So both characters start off the same way. They're both wealthy aristocrats who are expert fighters and detectives, and dawn disguises to fight against the evil that the authorities can't, or won't, deal with. They both started off fighting "real world villains" but over the years have added various "superhuman adversaries" to their rogues gallery. Yet Batman is a "superhero" and Zorro is not?

I'm sorry, I just don't see the logic there.

 

[:eek:]

As many has pointed out, Zorro is as much superhero as Batman for example, even if Zorro perhaps isn't the first character that springs to mind when you think of superheroes. I think one reason could be that Zorro doesn't have the same comicbook origin as most superheroes have. If Zorro had been a DC or Marvel character I have a feeling things would be different.

 

[Breogan]

Magical transforming Zorro ...he of the exploding sword strike!
Super hero or not? Some of you need to check your arbitrary qualifiers, because they will fail!

As pointed out, Zorro has fought the Supernatural, and himself used supernatural weapons; a sword forged with magic and alchemy, an amulet linked to his spirit guide, etc, so if you say there is no-supernatural in his world, and use that as your arbitrary criteria for him not being a superhero, You fail!

-----------------------



If you qualify Batman (and by extension Zorro) as not a superhero? Because according to you superheroes have to have super powers, you also fail, since DC themselve market Batman as a Super hero.

-------------

If you qualify Batman as "super" because according to you his skills, and resources are "super", but not Zorro's, you fail.

Since Zorro was shown to be superior; in skills swordsmanship, marksman, stealth, agility, sleight of hand, cunning and wits, etc.than all he faught.

Also as far as resources, he used all the best of his time, and invented some of his own, ...and when switched to a contemporary setting, his vast wealth and resources passed to his legacies also switched to modern weapons and technology too.

The legacy aspect began with Fairbanks in 1925, continued into the movie-serials, where several legacy Zorro were depicted switching to modern weapons revolvers, even a retractable sword in the serials that influenced Kane & Finger's Batman, Lucas and Spielberg, to the Gen Z incarnation where he uses a LaZer sword and whip, and motorcycle, etc...

-----------------

I find it interesting that a lot of people think Zorro is a hero But not a Superhero.
Almost as if heroes were an underclass among do gooders .
Interesting.

Superhero fiction is just a sub-genre of all Heroic fiction, just people want to move and draw arbitrary lines all over the place.
Either with nuances of character, specific skills abilities, how "real" their world is/was/has remained, whether the costume qualifies as a costume or not, if it's tight enough, etc...LOL.
Some classify it as beginning around the popularity and trend of Superman and the American comic book explosion and everything it inspired. Others want to move it back, to the things that influence Superman, the comic-strip characters Phantom, Flash Gordon, Popeye! , to the pulp-magazines and radio heroes, The Shadow, Zorro, John Carter, Doc Savage, Green Hornet, etc. , to gothic and victorian era heroes, then to middle ages and knights, even further all the way back heroic epics and classics , Beowulf, Hercules, Gilgamesh and the oldest recorded stories. LOL!
Which defeats the whole purpose of the classification to begin with.

It just becomes arbitrary and meaningless.




------------------

Zorro is not a superhero but a Zuperhero.

lolZ! You win..

 

[Micromind]

I consider Zorro as a Superhero.

But for many Zorro is in the same league as The Phantom, Flash Gordon, Tarzan and The Shadow which makes him a comic book hero.

 

[Breogan]

I consider Zorro as a Superhero.

But for many Zorro is in the same league as The Phantom, Flash Gordon, Tarzan and The Shadow which makes him a comic book hero.

The Phantom and Flash gordon debuted in comic-strips.
Tarzan (like Zorro) in Pulp-Magazines.
The Shadow roots are in Radio.
None of them you list in Comic Books.

 

[Micromind]

The Phantom and Flash gordon debuted in comic-strips.
Tarzan (like Zorro) in Pulp-Magazines.
The Shadow roots are in Radio.
None of them you list in Comic Books.

I know, Superman also featured in comic-strips, but he made a successful transition (like Phantom and Flash Gordon and Tarzan) in comic books.

Many people had read these characters in the comic books, there is a common factor there.

 

[Alien Anal]

Magical transforming Zorro ...he of the exploding sword strike!
Super hero or not? Some of you need to check your arbitrary qualifiers, because they will fail!
[YT]4yc6RPXiftM[/YT]
As pointed out, Zorro has fought the Supernatural, and himself used supernatural weapons; a sword forged with magic and alchemy, an amulet linked to his spirit guide, etc, so if you say there is no-supernatural in his world, and use that as your arbitrary criteria for him not being a superhero, You fail!

-----------------------



If you qualify Batman (and by extension Zorro) as not a superhero? Because according to you superheroes have to have super powers, you also fail, since DC themselve market Batman as a Super hero.

-------------


If you qualify Batman as "super" because according to you his skills, and resources are "super", but not Zorro's, you fail.

Since Zorro was shown to be superior; in skills swordsmanship, marksman, stealth, agility, sleight of hand, cunning and wits, etc.than all he faught.
Also as far as resources, he used all the best of his time, and invented some of his own, ...and when switched to a contemporary setting, his vast wealth and resources passed to his legacies also switched to modern weapons and technology too.
The legacy aspect began with Fairbanks in 1925, continued into the movie-serials, where several legacy Zorro were depicted switching to modern weapons revolvers, even a retractable sword in the serials that influenced Lucas and Spielberg, to the Gen Z incarnation where he uses a LaZer sword and whip, and motorcycle, etc...

-----------------



Superhero fiction is just a sub-genre of all Heroic fiction, just people want to move and draw arbitrary lines all over the place.
Either with nuances of character, specific skills abilities, how "real" their world is/was/has remained, whether the costume qualifies as a costume or not, if it's tight enough, etc...LOL.
Some classify it as beginning around the popularity and trend of Superman and the American comic book explosion and everything it inspired. Others want to move it back, to the things that influence Superman, the comic-strip characters Phantom, Flash Gordon, Popeye! , to the pulp-magazines and radio heroes, The Shadow, Zorro, John Carter, Doc Savage, Green Hornet, etc. , to gothic and victorian era heroes, then to middle ages and knights, even further all the way back heroic epics and classics , Beowulf, Hercules, Gilgamesh and the oldest recorded stories. LOL!
Which defeats the whole purpose of the classification to begin with.

It just becomes arbitrary and meaningless.




------------------




lolZ! You win..

My favourite post of the week!

 

[Thundarr]

Magical transforming Zorro ...he of the exploding sword strike!
Super hero or not? Some of you need to check your arbitrary qualifiers, because they will fail!
[YT]4yc6RPXiftM[/YT]
As pointed out, Zorro has fought the Supernatural, and himself used supernatural weapons; a sword forged with magic and alchemy, an amulet linked to his spirit guide, etc, so if you say there is no-supernatural in his world, and use that as your arbitrary criteria for him not being a superhero, You fail!

-----------------------



If you qualify Batman (and by extension Zorro) as not a superhero? Because according to you superheroes have to have super powers, you also fail, since DC themselve market Batman as a Super hero.

-------------


If you qualify Batman as "super" because according to you his skills, and resources are "super", but not Zorro's, you fail.

Since Zorro was shown to be superior; in skills swordsmanship, marksman, stealth, agility, sleight of hand, cunning and wits, etc.than all he faught.
Also as far as resources, he used all the best of his time, and invented some of his own, ...and when switched to a contemporary setting, his vast wealth and resources passed to his legacies also switched to modern weapons and technology too.
The legacy aspect began with Fairbanks in 1925, continued into the movie-serials, where several legacy Zorro were depicted switching to modern weapons revolvers, even a retractable sword in the serials that influenced Lucas and Spielberg, to the Gen Z incarnation where he uses a LaZer sword and whip, and motorcycle, etc...

-----------------



Superhero fiction is just a sub-genre of all Heroic fiction, just people want to move and draw arbitrary lines all over the place.
Either with nuances of character, specific skills abilities, how "real" their world is/was/has remained, whether the costume qualifies as a costume or not, if it's tight enough, etc...LOL.
Some classify it as beginning around the popularity and trend of Superman and the American comic book explosion and everything it inspired. Others want to move it back, to the things that influence Superman, the comic-strip characters Phantom, Flash Gordon, Popeye! , to the pulp-magazines and radio heroes, The Shadow, Zorro, John Carter, Doc Savage, Green Hornet, etc. , to gothic and victorian era heroes, then to middle ages and knights, even further all the way back heroic epics and classics , Beowulf, Hercules, Gilgamesh and the oldest recorded stories. LOL!
Which defeats the whole purpose of the classification to begin with.

It just becomes arbitrary and meaningless.




------------------




lolZ! You win..

Excellent post.