Let's Talk About Movie Budgets

THIS is what I’m saying! It’s not the CGI itself that’s raising the costs, it’s the productions using it as an excuse not to properly plan out their films in pre-production that is.

I don’t know if it’s still this way as I haven’t read up on him recently, but there’s a reason Chris Nolan at least used to be one of the few big-budget filmmakers who always came in on-time and on(sometimes even under)-budget: He’s a planner. His films are meticulously planned down to a science. So his budgets are for exactly what they’ll need and when they’ll need it. Spielberg used to be the same way (no idea if he still is either).

A part of the issue is the way the blockbuster production line works now thanks in no small part to the MCU. It used to be, when you got hired to make a film for your studio, you’d go through and break down a script page by page, determine the budget you’ll need and the TIME you’ll need (which is a huge determining factor in the budget, because a lot of stuff is rented and paid for by the hour/day) to make it, and that proposal would either be rejected by the studio or be given the green light and release date based on that. Nowadays, it’s seems like the studios say “here’s your movie, here’s your release date, now start planning whatever you have to do to make it by that date.” So with that way of working, it’s no surprise that shortcuts would become standard in lieu of proper planning and craftsmanship.

Setting a release date before anything else (sometimes not even a script!) on a movie is wild to me. I get why these “interconnected universes” feel they have to do that, but it does not engender the right kind of planning at all imo.

And not to pick on the MCU too much but with a few exceptions it seems like they, like you said, basically have the movie already planned out before the directr is hired and they pretty much just hire someone to just show up every day and yell "Cut!" and "Action!" Nothing more nothing less. They dont bring in too many artists like Coogler, Raimi, Waititi, Zhao who are usually meticulous with their films and how they look because they just need someone to get the film from point A to point B.
 
I would heavily dispute that they're similar movies. Really other than both featuring Tom Cruise and are action movies, they're not similar at all. I don't understand that comparison.

Maverick is way more fun, triumphant, and positive in tone. I've made the comparison a bunch but Maverick feels like a sports movie rather than an action one. It's not nearly as action packed as MI7 or any MI movie.

Also, I'm just gonna basically copy and paste what I posted in the MI thread


It's kinda like expecting the Rogue Nation crowd to have showed up for The Mummy in 2017. Or the WW and ST crowd to show up for Pine in Dungeons. That doesn't really happen like that anymore. The IPs are the stars. Not the performers

One thing I will also point out is that the original Top Gun also had a far bigger cultural impact than MI ever has, even the original 90s film. Top Gun, whatever you think of its quality, was one of the top handful of most popular and defining films of the 80s.
 
This is gonna be a long winded post but it's a few things

1) There's only one Maverick. True we may have not seen Keaton as Bruce Wayne in years, but we still got 5 versions of Bruce Wayne since Keaton's last appearance. And that's just live action. But there's only one guy playing Maverick which is Tom Cruise so seeing him back after decades was more of a treat

2) Keaton, despite the marketing, was a guest in a Flash movie. Maverick was all about Cruise. And imo Keaton's Batman looked out of place. Like they put him in an environment (more fantastical and bright) that contrasts where he was in B89 or BR. I saw that clip of Keaton fighting a Kryptonian and it looks really weird. Not just because of the CGI but because it looked so out of place for any live action version of Batman, save for Affleck, to be doing that. Maybe it would've been different if it was an actual Keaton returns as Batman movie? But I doubt that because...

3) I think some of us nerds online really just over estimate how much people care about Keaton as Batman. Look, I get it that that's the Batman that a lot of people grew up with. I respect that. But not enough care to seriously boost things. Not to be obnoxious and do the "told ya so" thing, but I know I and a handful of other members say the same thing. I think people are pretty indifferent to him on Batman when you look beyond just online reaction. His last appearance was too long ago and we've had a good amount of live action versions since to varying success. The 18-34 demo cares more about Bale most likely because TDKS came out in their life and was better received. And I think WB knew that and that's why they'd been trying to get Bale back ever since the DCEU started
That's no shots as Keaton or his performance as Batman because I like his portrayal. And this might be anecdotal but I've never heard someone irl say Batman 89 or Batman Returns is their favorite movie like I've heard with TDK. Hell I haven't even heard anyone ever say B89 is their favorite superhero movie irl.
I just don't think Keaton as Batman had enough juice to put butts in seats. For sure didn't have enough juice to overcome a) the DC universe rebooting soon b) bad CGI in trailers, c) Miller's whole controversy
TL;DR: People don't care about Keaton as Batman as much as us nerds do and they make up a significant portion of the movie going audience

For Keaton, is is mainly one specific age (those that were kids in 1989) that are so nostalgic for him. Remember even at the time feelings on Keaton were a bit more mixed, at least by older audiences. That his portrayal wasn’t the strongest point of the films. He was notable yes, but Batman wasn’t really universally seen as starring Michael Keaton as much as starring Jack Nicholson.
 
Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom: Behind the Reshoots – The Hollywood Reporter

mvqFWs.gif
 
For Keaton, is is mainly one specific age (those that were kids in 1989) that are so nostalgic for him. Remember even at the time feelings on Keaton were a bit more mixed, at least by older audiences. That his portrayal wasn’t the strongest point of the films. He was notable yes, but Batman wasn’t really universally seen as starring Michael Keaton as much as starring Jack Nicholson.
Response to a days old post but I know people born 1989 and before and none of them are that nostalgic for Keaton. But again that's anecdotal. But I just don't think Keaton as Batman has much pull amongst the GA
 
Indy’s gonna lose a LOT more than $100 million. Probably almost as much as The Flash.
 
I'm chiming in too late but one thing that /has/ to be pointed out is that inflation is a thing. I saw earlier Nolan was pointed out as an example of a filmmaker that has reasonable budgets but Batman Begins cost $150 million in 2005. Wanna know what that'd be nowadays with inflation? $234 million. 34 million more than The Batman. Wanna know the budget for The Dark Knight? It'd be $255 million nowadays with inflation. The Dark Knight Rises? $332 million.

It is true that chaotic pre-planning and stuff like that can affect a film's budget, buuut I do think that this discussion can and often does become very misleading and the proposed solutions by some people are just flat-out misguided.

Pixar got a lot of flack recently for Elemental's 200 million dollar budget but Pixar's president recently did an interview explaining the budget and it made sense.

Pixar's 'Elemental' Box Office: What's Behind the Rebound in Sales - Variety
Is there a way to make these kinds of movies at a lower price point?

That’s a constant question. One of the ways you make these films for less money, and almost all of our competitors do this, is to do work offshore. It’s only us and Disney Animation that makes animation films in the U.S. anymore with all of the artists under one roof. We feel like having a colony of artists approach has differentiated our films. We hope to find a path to make that work. “Elemental” was particularly expensive because all the characters have visual effects. We had been getting the film costs down.

The other thing I’ll say about our film budgets is that our whole company exists only to make these films. So when we say a budget, that is everything it takes to run the whole company. Sometimes, the budgets [for other films] that get reported are physical production costs and don’t include the salaries of executives and things like that. Our budgets include all of that, so there’s some accounting context that gets lost. But that doesn’t mean they’re not expensive.

Obviously some of that mostly applies only to Pixar, but I do think it does goes to show there are a lot of things that go into a budget that most people don't take into account. That's why I roll my eyes at statements like "A Superman movie should not cost any more than 150 million" when adjusted for inflation even the first Superman movie cost 257 million dollars.

For some types of films, mainly superhero films, any budget under 150 million, even 200 million in some cases, is just flat out either impossible or ridiculous unless they exploited the workers even more than they already do. And what I've found ironic over these pasts few months is seeing so many of the same people championing for workers to be paid more also in the very same breath say "Reduce film and TV budgets!"

When they cut corners in the budget, who the hell do you think are gonna be the first corners they are gonna cut? Lower budgets benefit investors, they do not actually benefit the crew in any way and it's flat out delusional to think so.

I will also note that companies do want their movies to actually make money, so I do not get why people are just assuming they aren't already making these films for as cheap as they can make them, especially because in some cases like Ant-Man Quantumania it's flat-out obvious they half-assed a lot.

The problem with the ****ty looking films is not the budgets, the budgets would always have to be that way for these big blockbusters, maybe even bigger. The problem is that resources are not properly being used into creating films that look good.
 
Last edited:
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"