Man of Steel vs Superman: The Movie

[PacificBoy]

"iconic "big, blue boy scout", or a two-fisted, super-strong action hero."

Can't we have BOTH?

The sequel to MoS, one can hope.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

Problem with STM is how campy Lex was. That started to date the movie pretty fast. But the one thing STM did that MOS didn't was to make Superman "super first and then take it to the next level.

In MOS, Superman is not introduced to the world and people who knew about him knew him as "one of those aliens that can fly and whatnot." That and they got the Lois-Clark-Superman relationship all screwed up and not established yet.

But yes, MOS had a lot of things right. If only it was a little more about Superman and less about an alien invasion.

STM had to fight against many things to take the hero seriously. And it succeeded when it had everything against it. It gets my vote.

 

[Shikamaru]

It truly depends on your viewpoint and feeling of who and what Superman is.

There's something more wholesome and nostalgic about the Superman from the 40's through the 80's...the "truth, justice, and the American way" Superman, the "boy scout". The icon. That Superman was never only a superhero. But in MOS it seems like now he is. This iteration of Superman doesn't feel iconic. He's just a superhero no different than Iron Man, Spider-man, Batman, etc...

This isn't necessarily a bad thing. Maybe this day and age we don't need icons and heroes, maybe that sappy "hero of truth and justice" stuff is a thing of the past. He still saves people, no different than other heroes, is a good guy who wants the right things...

But both movies are fine, but people will lean towards the sort of Superman they want to see....the iconic "big, blue boy scout", or a two-fisted, super-strong action hero.

I think the "Truth, Justice and American Way" has indeed become a thing of the past. We see America more cynical and through a much more critical lense than in the past. Having things like that in a film nowadays would almost come off as American propaganda and the film will be called out on it.

That being said, I thought MOS did a great job at having the theme of "truth, justice and the American way" present in the film without actually saying that line. If you think about it and analyze the film, Superman represents all the classic American values while Zod represents the exact opposite.

Superman in the film represents hope and the ability to make your own choices and shape your own destiny, as well as the belief that we are all individuals. On the other hand, Zod comes from a hopeless world, which is something he plans to bring to Earth as well. He not only believes there is no such thing as the freedom to make your own choices but also believes that everyone must be stripped of their individuality and just be whatever they were genetically engineered to be in order for the Kryptonian race as a whole survive. This was the same mentality one can find in the Soviet Union or in books like 1984. Even the symbol of Zod's chest somewhat resembles the Communist flag.

 

[blumatic]

We obviously have to agree to disagree then. Mario Puzo's screenplay was pure genius here. Coupled with John Williams' timeless score and Christopher Reeve's winning performance.

In STM you get magical and mythical scenes like this

[YT]7ujuOikKgAE[/YT]

I don't find any comparable scenes, this sense of wonder and glory, in MoS.

Sorry. I was talking about his saves and action scenes. But in terms of the scenes of Krypton, Fortress, and Superman's arrival. Yes they were more iconic than in MOS. What STM does great was captured the majesty of the Superman lore. That's what made me love the character.

 

[Bruce Malone]

I certainly didn't grow up with this film as a child unlike others so it was only recently that i decided to view it in its entirety and it's a good film but i kept thinking that if i was alive in 1978 i'm sure i'd think this was a great/amazing movie but it hasn't transcended time as well compared to a lot of the other great movies of that era.

I'd say the only timeless aspect is reeve's performance the other aspects which again were probably amazing in their day don't stand up well enough for a modern era/audience. I'm sure nostalgia plays a role but abstractly it doesn't hold up amazingly.

It's not fair comparison perhaps but other movies from that era be it the godfather or Apocalypse Now totally transcend the era which they were in.

 

[writer0327]

I think the "Truth, Justice and American Way" has indeed become a thing of the past. We see America more cynical and through a much more critical lense than in the past. Having things like that in a film nowadays would almost come off as American propaganda and the film will be called out on it.

That being said, I thought MOS did a great job at having the theme of "truth, justice and the American way" present in the film without actually saying that line. If you think about it and analyze the film, Superman represents all the classic American values while Zod represents the exact opposite.

Superman in the film represents hope and the ability to make your own choices and shape your own destiny, as well as the belief that we are all individuals. On the other hand, Zod comes from a hopeless world, which is something he plans to bring to Earth as well. He not only believes there is no such thing as the freedom to make your own choices but also believes that everyone must be stripped of their individuality and just be whatever they were genetically engineered to be in order for the Kryptonian race as a whole survive. This was the same mentality one can find in the Soviet Union or in books like 1984. Even the symbol of Zod's chest somewhat resembles the Communist flag.

I don't think Superman was meant to be a political symbol, but rather as a symbol that everyone, even little kids with jackets tied around their necks, would be able to understand and live up to. The American way of life could be defined without using that terminology.

Superman was a huge part of the warp and woof of this country's culture, he symbolized so much of what America was. As film, along with American culture and ideals have progressed and evolved, people have become less sensitive to conservative, "old-timey" values. Not that we don't care about truth, justice, decency, morality, but down deep we aren't as concerned with those values as people once were. One of the reasons why "The Lone Ranger", who also was a icon of morality and American sensibilities of the 30s and 40s, seemed ill-timed and out of place in the movie landscape today.

It seems that the world has passed The Lone Ranger by, but still has a place for Superman, provided he isn't too preachy and is shown less as a symbol of American values and more of a powerful hero who is good and helps the weak. That's the Superman we got in MOS, and like I said, nothing wrong with that.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Sorry. I was talking about his saves and action scenes. But in terms of the scenes of Krypton, Fortress, and Superman's arrival. Yes they were more iconic than in MOS. What STM does great was captured the majesty of the Superman lore. That's what made me love the character.

I feel like there's more of a sense of wonder in Superman:TM while MOS was more of an atmosphere of tension. Both effective stories, though I will say with Superman:TM there was NOTHING like that in cinema's, while MOS has elements that feel a tad familiar.

 

[113]

Man of Steel.

I'm a huge Superman fan but Reeve's was never the definitive take on Supes for me. I grew up on Lois & Clark, Superman: TAS, Justice League, Smallville, and some of the comics.

And in terms of Reeve's movies, my favorite one has always been Superman II, I never really loved S:TM.

So yeah, MoS is far superior to S:TM in my book.

 

[blumatic]

I feel like there's more of a sense of wonder in Superman:TM while MOS was more of an atmosphere of tension. Both effective stories, though I will say with Superman:TM there was NOTHING like that in cinema's, while MOS has elements that feel a tad familiar.

I agree. Thing is too, I think is difficult these days to make a film with a grand sense of wonder. I thought the Sci Fi stuff was a thing of wonder but it didn't have the magic and romance that STM had. Honestly I'm glad they didn't go for that because they would have failed. They would end up mimicking Superman Returns.

 

[Shikamaru]

I don't think Superman was meant to be a political symbol, but rather as a symbol that everyone, even little kids with jackets tied around their necks, would be able to understand and live up to. The American way of life could be defined without using that terminology.

Superman was a huge part of the warp and woof of this country's culture, he symbolized so much of what America was. As film, along with American culture and ideals have progressed and evolved, people have become less sensitive to conservative, "old-timey" values. Not that we don't care about truth, justice, decency, morality, but down deep we aren't as concerned with those values as people once were. One of the reasons why "The Lone Ranger", who also was a icon of morality and American sensibilities of the 30s and 40s, seemed ill-timed and out of place in the movie landscape today.

It seems that the world has passed The Lone Ranger by, but still has a place for Superman, provided he isn't too preachy and is shown less as a symbol of American values and more of a powerful hero who is good and helps the weak. That's the Superman we got in MOS, and like I said, nothing wrong with that.

I agree. I think the symbol of Superman is apolitical as well. I was talking about how they managed to get the message of "truth, justice and the American way" into the film without making it in-your-face or even the main point of the film. It is in there subliminally to show respect to what Superman was for so many years but at the very core of the film, the film is about more than just that. I was just stating that one can still see the film through the old school lense if they want to because there are some connections there that can still be made.

At the very core of the film, as you probably agree, the message is that Superman is a symbol of hope for humanity in general meant to help them strive for the future and not be put down. I find it odd that some people consider MOS to be emotionally cold when it has such a hopeful message.

 

[Skrilla31]

You wanna know the biggest difference between the two? And no it has nothing to do with the interpretation of the character.

One is a competantly made film, the other one isn't. It's that simple.

 

[Milu]

Superman The Movie, easily. Man of Steel is fine in my opinion, but it didn't grab me the same way watching STM did.

 

[Showtime]

I added a poll.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

I would have to say that no matter what I will always love MOS and STM equally the same way I love Batman 89 equal to TDK, they're different versions and interpretations of two of my favorite characters and I'm just thankful that I have those versions to enjoy for years to come.

 

[InJustice]

What really killed STM for me was that awful time travelling scene, and Lex Luthor. Thankfully, Superman II turned out to be a heck of a lot better than STM.

 

[Comics N' Toons]

i REALLY REALLY wish SuperDaniel was here so we could see what he thought about MOS. SuperDaniel and I became friends and he got banned and it would be nice to see what his opinion was!

 

[flickchick85]

Well I've never been shy about voicing my distaste for the Donner/Reeve version of Superman and his universe, so I probably preferred MoS, despite its issues. That said, Superman: The Movie is clearly gonna win here, and I don't think it's undeserving. I mean, it did lay the groundwork for the entire genre, afterall.

 

[blumatic]

I have a question. If one were to describe to a friend what was Superman the Movie is about......What would one say?

I can easily say what MOS is about and it sounds interesting. But when, in my head, I try to summarize STM, it sounds very boring. But the film was good. Its weird.

 

[Lily Adler]

BNH what happened to your other account?

I will have to go with STM. I definitely believe MOS has more rewatch value, but STM seemed to be the more competently made of the two. Although, STM falls under the victim of its time angle and Donner's Luthor not being quite what fans want out of Superman's arch-nemesis. I believe if MOS has a sqeuel it may possibly be a true challenger for the best Superman film moniker. Quite frankly, I think MOS should have been that film, but too many flaws didn't let me think it earned such a title.

 

[113]

What really killed STM for me was that awful time travelling scene, and Lex Luthor. Thankfully, Superman II turned out to be a heck of a lot better than STM.

Agreed. But for every time-travel scene there is a cellophane S shield to throw at baddies.

Both of these elements in STM and Superman II are so ridiculous that they almost ruin both movies entirely.

I could get past the cellophane S because the rest of Superman II was so badass. But I could never really get over the time-travel thing in STM, it's just so so bad.

 

[KahlanAmnell]

I wonder if people from S:TM's generation complained about some of the movie's ridiculous scenes. Because it's always hard to criticize something about the previous generation. You'd always come across as someone who doesn't respect and appreciate the good ol' days. And it's not just limited to movies.

 

[Jim-El]

Superman: The Movie...All Day Long!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Jim-El]

We obviously have to agree to disagree then. Mario Puzo's screenplay was pure genius here.

Excuse me, but Donner threw out Puzo's "campy" screenplay. Tom Mankiewicz with Donner's approval penned the actual screenplay.
This is a seldom known fact.

This version was conceived in 1973 by Ilya Salkind. Several directors, most notably Guy Hamilton, and screenwriters (Mario Puzo, David and Leslie Newman and Robert Benton) were associated with the project before Donner was hired to direct. Donner brought Tom Mankiewicz in to rewrite the script, feeling it was too campy. Mankiewicz was credited as creative consultant.

Mankiewicz was the GENIUS. May he rest in peace.

 

[Comics N' Toons]

BNH what happened to your other account?

It's still active but is no longer used. It was just time for a change!

 

[Bruce Malone]

It's still active but is no longer used. It was just time for a change!

Not to Narc out but I thought multiple accounts weren't allowed? at least that's how it is on a number of other forums.