Ms. Marvel becomes Captain Marvel

[Manic]

She needs to join the Lady Liberators.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v418/AuntPetunia/Lady Liberators/MarvelWomenVSRulk.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v418/AuntPetunia/Lady Liberators/LadyLiberators1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v418/AuntPetunia/Lady Liberators/LadyLiberators2.jpg

Ah, the ongoing title that should've been...

 

[Red Mask]

Sue is not nor will she ever be Marvel's premiere superheroine

She is Marvel's First Lady, and a very prominent Marvel heroine.

 

[Havok83]

She is Marvel's First Lady, and a very prominent Marvel heroine.

No one said she isnt the first lady of Marvel or that she isnt prominent. However she isnt their premiere heroine. Dark Raven already listed some of the reasons why that isnt the case and why Ms. Marvel has always had more potential than her for that spot

 

[Franklin Richards]

I don't think you know what the word "premiere" means.

 

[Havok83]

Or maybe you dont

 

[terry78]

She needs to join the Lady Liberators.

Whose ass is that up there floating?

 

[Havok83]

Whose ass is that up there floating?

Storm

 

[Kurosawa]

Storm.

 

[runawayboulder]

My mom's.

 

[Red Mask]

No one said she isnt the first lady of Marvel or that she isnt prominent. However she isnt their premiere heroine. Dark Raven already listed some of the reasons why that isnt the case and why Ms. Marvel has always had more potential than her for that spot

Some characters are stronger solo, some of them are stronger as teams. Personally, I think a strong team will lead to more potential stories.

 

[Havok83]

Some characters are stronger solo, some of them are stronger as teams. Personally, I think a strong team will lead to more potential stories.

Okay? Im not sure how that works as a response to my post, but alrighty. Carol has worked solo and on a team and both at the same time. She started her solo career in the 70s and has since had a long history going nearly 30 years as a member of the Avengers, even serving as one of its former leaders. Unlike most females in Marvel, she's been given the best of both worlds

 

[Dark Raven]

I think Marvel's premier heroine should be someone who is in a title of her own. Sue Richards has always been thought of as part of the Fantastic Four, and yes, by that token she ought to be the first lady of Marvel.

However, I do think that Ms Marvel (yes, with that name) has the potential to be Marvel's premier heroine and Wonder Woman equivalent. I never really thought Storm was that, because she is always part of the X-Men.

In the late 70s/early 80s, Spider-Woman was often marketed as the premier heroine in all of the adverts and promotional material. She-Hulk has that potential too, but both of these are usually just thought of as female equivalents. Since Carol is always the one who is around and more popular instead of Captain Marvel, I think she has surpassed her namesake as a stand-alone heroine instead of being seen as a female equivalent.

Ms Marvel's classic costume is iconic like Wonder Woman. They should stick to that. Also, Captain Marvel sounds more like a man's name (it has been usually associated with one). It never seemed to fit on Photon and it doesn't fit with Carol either. Ms Marvel is just more attractive and feminine. It's often almost pronounced like Miss Marvel (or could be mistaken for that instead of Mizz Marvel) and therefore has that attractive beauty queen sound like Miss America/ Miss World or strong bodybuilding sound like Miss Universe. The name "Ms Marvel" almost tells the world that she is Marvel's premier heroine. It's like she's won that honour out of all of the Marvel women to become Miss Marvel. That's why I think Ms Marvel is an infinitely better name than Captain Marvel for Carol.

And that's why I also think Ms Marvel sounds better than Warbird or Binary. Ms Marvel has that "Superman" type sound, just like Iron Man also conveys. Iron Man goes beyond just being a man who is made of iron, but has all the connotations of strength and other associations with the Ironman triathlon, which is why Iron Man sounds better than War Machine.

I wonder how I could write to Marvel and tell them the above? I think they're just using the Captain Marvel name a) in order to retain the legal rights and b) to associate that name with an already popular character.

However, by giving Carol the Captain Marvel name, they're overlooking what I said above. Captain Marvel just conjures images of strong male heroes, either Mar-Vell or Shazam, and something slightly whimsical from a bygone era.

 

[Harlekin]

Uh, just write them. But it won't really do anything and honestly, it's the least compelling counterargument.

 

[Havok83]

I think what doesnt make sense is the timing. She is about to star in the Avengers cartoon as Ms Marvel in her original costume. This will be her biggest mainstream exposure outside of the books and will be how she is known and recognized. If they expect to get new fans/readers out of that, how jarring will it be to see her like this instead. Makes me wonder if they are gonna have her change by the end of the season to become Captain Marvel with the new look and hair

Assuming it lasts this long, issue #27 should coincide with Ms. Marvel #100. I bet by then she will reclaim her old codename and costume with the series reverting back to the old title/numbering

 

[Red Mask]

Okay? Im not sure how that works as a response to my post, but alrighty. Carol has worked solo and on a team and both at the same time. She started her solo career in the 70s and has since had a long history going nearly 30 years as a member of the Avengers, even serving as one of its former leaders. Unlike most females in Marvel, she's been given the best of both worlds

The Fantastic Four remains a great series because it has a family structure, which keeps a greater consistency. While the Avengers are the mightiest team, the roster keeps changing. That opens up to lots of potential stories, but the wrong character combination can also lead to poor adventures. Susan Storm has managed to grow very well over the decades because she had strong co-characters to work with.

Carol hasn't had consistent co-characters to work with in the Avengers. Simon went nuts. Hank Pym was a Skrull. Vision was destroyed. In her last solo lots of potential co-characters just disappeared with their sub-plots unresolved. Yet she's grown into a pivotal character lately without the need of big event promotions.

 

[Havok83]

The FF are not Marvel's leading team; the Avengers are. They are the answer to DC's JLA with most of their biggest, most popular and recognizable characters being members. They are the team which has recieved the MAJOR push within the MU in the last decade and we are seeing that push extend to outside media from the cartoons and upcoming movies. The FF are a nice little family unit but they dont have that large marketable potential for Marvel that the Avengers and its individual members have. They dont sell as well in the comic world either; the Avengers do. The Xmen have been more pivotal in these regards as well. This isnt taking away from the FF or saying they arent a great team, but it is what it is and its why they arent the lead franchise of the company. Invisible Woman is undeniably tied with them and seen more as 1/4th of a unit which is why she will never get the same push that Carol and other female Avenger heroines (like She-Hulk and Spider-woman) have. These women can break off on their own and still be very viable from a marketing standpoint and thats why Ms. Marvel has been given the push to be its premier super heroine

 

[Dark Raven]

The Fantastic Four are well known and popular, but they're like the Olsen Twins: you don't really think of one without the other. People tend to see them as a unit and while you might get to know them individually, they'll always be thought of together. Their unifying blue (or whatever colour) costumes also add to this homogenised feel whereas in the Avengers they all have different costumes which adds to their individuality. That's one good thing about the Avengers movie compared to the X-Men. They all look distinct and unique and therefore stand out.

 

[Red Mask]

The FF are not Marvel's leading team; the Avengers are. They are the answer to DC's JLA with most of their biggest, most popular and recognizable characters being members. They are the team which has recieved the MAJOR push within the MU in the last decade and we are seeing that push extend to outside media from the cartoons and upcoming movies. The FF are a nice little family unit but they dont have that large marketable potential for Marvel that the Avengers and its individual members have. They dont sell as well in the comic world either; the Avengers do. The Xmen have been more pivotal in these regards as well. This isnt taking away from the FF or saying they arent a great team, but it is what it is and its why they arent the lead franchise of the company. Invisible Woman is undeniably tied with them and seen more as 1/4th of a unit which is why she will never get the same push that Carol and other female Avenger heroines (like She-Hulk and Spider-woman) have. These women can break off on their own and still be very viable from a marketing standpoint and thats why Ms. Marvel has been given the push to be its premier super heroine

There was a time when the Fantasic Four did outsell the Avengers. It had the right talent doing the comic at the time. Years ago the Teen Titans were outselling the Justice League because George Perez was drawing it. I hope Marvel will do the same for the new Captain Marvel.

 

[Mulholland-Jr]

Whoever made that Chaz Bono comment is hilarious.

 

[Mulholland-Jr]

The Fantastic Four are well known and popular, but they're like the Olsen Twins: you don't really think of one without the other. People tend to see them as a unit and while you might get to know them individually, they'll always be thought of together. Their unifying blue (or whatever colour) costumes also add to this homogenised feel whereas in the Avengers they all have different costumes which adds to their individuality. That's one good thing about the Avengers movie compared to the X-Men. They all look distinct and unique and therefore stand out.

You are correct. It's established that they were close friends before going superhuman. And that were transformed together. That's why they're different from other heroes. People in the Avengers have all sorts of weird, distinctive origin tales, but they have personal lives outside of the Avengers. Each one of the Avengers has their own origin, their own lives, and their own journey to become superhuman. They are complete strangers when they join together. Peter Parker has his own life outside of Avengers and his own personal story. Tony Stark has his own life outside of the Avengers and own personal story. Wolverine has his own life outside the X-Men and personal story. The Fantastic Four are the Fantastic Four 24/7.


I like bolding things.

 

[THANOSRULES]

She needs to join the Lady Liberators.

sue looks waay to muscle and fitness-y i that pic..has sue ever been shown on panel working out or training? She should always be drawn as a natural chick and not a gym rat.

 

[Dark Raven]

sue looks waay to muscle and fitness-y i that pic..has sue ever been shown on panel working out or training? She should always be drawn as a natural chick and not a gym rat.

I agree. However, I don't mind Sue actually working out, just not looking that muscular. She should look toned, as superheroines need to stay fit and in shape due to the demands of their "job".

But just look at that hot bod on Spider-Woman.

 

[Red Mask]

Of all those women in that picture, Storm should be the slimmest, but with big child-bearing hips.

 

[Franklin Richards]

sue looks waay to muscle and fitness-y i that pic..has sue ever been shown on panel working out or training? She should always be drawn as a natural chick and not a gym rat.

Except that she's always been a dancer and has been trained in combat by Hawkeye, Black Panther, and Captain America.

A little too musceley? Sure. A lot? No way.

 

[Dark Raven]

Of all those women in that picture, Storm should be the slimmest, but with big child-bearing hips.

Do you mean Sue Storm or Storm (Ororo Munroe)?