Network Decay: Cartoon Network vs. Disney Channel vs. Nickelodeon

[SuperFerret]

To be fair, it used to have Gargoyles.

So did the local networks after school.

 

[John Locke]

I considered Fosters but it ended and I can't get pass a cartoon of a reality show. It just doesn't feel right. Also I heard their bringing in live reality shows.

 

[BlackLantern]

To be fair, it used to have Gargoyles.

Disney XD (formerly ToonDisney) still airs Gargoyles at 4 or 430 am....occasionally at 12 or 1 am on a weekend

 

[Etienne]

I still say Nickelodeon has changed for the worst in recent years. My recent post confirms Cartoon Network is realizing that "CN Real" isn't bringing in the ratings thus making some nice changes to their schedule.
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=17266149&postcount=260

People are forgetting that Nick, which used to have a lot of really quality shows and was more interested in using good TV to entertain kids without talking down to them, has for the past couple of years been using the same formula as MTV.

Nickelodeon has fallen the furthest, followed by Cartoon Network. As far as I'm concerned the Disney Channel has always sucked.

Pretty much.

 

[Phatman]

Definitely. I think BET worse because other than showing crappy hip-hop songs and shelling most other black artists out, they ripoff a lot of bad MTV shows (College Hill, The Hills), and have basically went to actually reinforcing stereotypes instead of straying away from. With that saying, The Black Panther animated series might change my mind t:.

Hey, how long has it been since this series was announced? Will it ever hit the air?

On another note:

Disney can't sell Mickey Mouse and co to an audience that's outgrown him or has never known him. Ask a kid today who Mickey Mouse or any Disney character pre-1989 (Little Mermaid) and you'll be met with expressions from them. The only Disney characters people recognize instantly today are the Princesses, and Winnie-the-Pooh. This is why these characters are rarely pushed anymore.

This is why Disney was forced to re-imagine their business model with live action shows. With their animated characters aging out, they needed to create characters today's children's audience could identify with. Plus these shows are MUCH cheaper to produce than animated shows. A Raven, Hannah Montana, or a Zack and Cody costs $500,000 an episode while an episode of Gargoyles or an episode of Replacements costs $3 million an episode.

Plus the turnaround time on a live action show is a lot faster. 13-26 episodes of Zack and Cody can be filmed in 3-6 months while an 13 episodes of an animated series can take a year or longer due to complete due to the outsourcing of animation to China and filming of frames.

The only drawback is that we may see a flood of Child stars in ten years writing tell alls and complaining about how they've been typecast in the vein of Danny Bonaduce, Todd Bridges and Gary Colemans.

 

[Steel Thunder]

Nickelodeon - it used to be amazing in the 90's

 

[TMC1982]

Hey, how long has it been since this series was announced? Will it ever hit the air?

On another note:

Disney can't sell Mickey Mouse and co to an audience that's outgrown him or has never known him. Ask a kid today who Mickey Mouse or any Disney character pre-1989 (Little Mermaid) and you'll be met with expressions from them. The only Disney characters people recognize instantly today are the Princesses, and Winnie-the-Pooh. This is why these characters are rarely pushed anymore.

This is why Disney was forced to re-imagine their business model with live action shows. With their animated characters aging out, they needed to create characters today's children's audience could identify with. Plus these shows are MUCH cheaper to produce than animated shows. A Raven, Hannah Montana, or a Zack and Cody costs $500,000 an episode while an episode of Gargoyles or an episode of Replacements costs $3 million an episode.

Plus the turnaround time on a live action show is a lot faster. 13-26 episodes of Zack and Cody can be filmed in 3-6 months while an 13 episodes of an animated series can take a year or longer due to complete due to the outsourcing of animation to China and filming of frames.

The only drawback is that we may see a flood of Child stars in ten years writing tell alls and complaining about how they've been typecast in the vein of Danny Bonaduce, Todd Bridges and Gary Colemans.

If Disney is unable to sell Mickey Mouse to kids of today, then that's there own fault, rather than the consumers. I've said it before and I'll say it agian, it's much easier in theory to market or sell Mickey Mouse than it is a real life child star like the Sprouse twins, because cartoon characters don't age. Thus, you don't have to set a timetable before having to seek out for a new breed of youngsters (like a cycle).

 

[TMC1982]

Nickelodeon - it used to be amazing in the 90's

Nickelodeon in my estimation, started to go downhill in the late '90s early 2000s. I want to say it was around the time that Rugrats was brought back from its hiatus and the subsequent movie became a huge hit (the first non-Disney animated movie to make over $100 million at the box office). After that, Nick started to rely too heavily on other Klasky-Csupo type shows (almost to the point in which it was practically overtaking the channel). The All Grown Up series was a clear cut sign, that Nickelodeon was hanging on to the Rugrats franchise well past it's usefulness. I feel that they're now doing the same thing with SpongeBob.

 

[BlackLantern]

but SpongeBob still brings in consistent viewers, even after a decade....TV is a fickle mistress, Kids TV is even worse...i thought 'Life and Times of Juniper Lee' was a great show, but it did not catch on

 

[Etienne]

but SpongeBob still brings in consistent viewers, even after a decade....TV is a fickle mistress, Kids TV is even worse...i thought 'Life and Times of Juniper Lee' was a great show, but it did not catch on

I don't think anyone is talking about viewers/ratings here as much as the quality of these shows.

 

[BlackLantern]

well as kids tv is very subjective, isn't quality as well??...while I don't think SpongeBob reinvents the wheel, i find it funny and it does have a good message...plus my niece and nephew love the "Best day ever" song

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Hey, how long has it been since this series was announced? Will it ever hit the air?

Footage was shown at the San Diego Comic-Con so I guess not much longer. Maybe by late 2009/early 2010 at most.

 

[Wheels]

well as kids tv is very subjective, isn't quality as well??...while I don't think SpongeBob reinvents the wheel, i find it funny and it does have a good message...plus my niece and nephew love the "Best day ever" song

I really enjoy SpongeBob, it's a very well-written and entertaining show. Most of the jokes go right over the kids' heads. It's truly the last great Nicktoon.

 

[BlackLantern]

that and Fairly OddParents, which just came back after a year long hiatus

 

[Wheels]

I forgot about that show! Cosmo is hilarious. If only they had more shows like these and less like Back at the Barnyard.

 

[Jager X]

It looks like CNReal is failing. I noticed that Slamball, after two or three week on air, has been taken off the schedule. This is the fastes cancellation I have ever seen and is a sign of what's going on behind the scenes. Oh, and Andrew W.K looks desperate in the new CNReal plug.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

I wish Nick hadn't canceled Danny Phantom. I saw a lot of good things in the series.

 

[TMC1982]

I would estimate that Nick's current schedule is made up like this:
*75% of SpongeBob and iCarly

*At least 20% of Penguins and True Jackson

*At least 5% of FOP

 

[BlackLantern]

and a dash of Fairly OddParents

 

[Kurosawa]

Cartoon Network has fallen the most because of just how great it once was...at one time there was literally nothing BUT quality original cartoons on it. Disney and Nick were never on CN's level to begin with, although SBSP is an awesome show and some of Nick;s live action shows like All That were actually pretty clever as well.

 

[terry78]

The only thing Disney Channel shows that I may watch if it's on at like 8 or 9pm is Phineas and Ferb, which is ridiculously funny.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Cartoon Network has fallen the most because of just how great it once was...at one time there was literally nothing BUT quality original cartoons on it. Disney and Nick were never on CN's level to begin with, although SBSP is an awesome show and some of Nick;s live action shows like All That were actually pretty clever as well.

Nick never on Cartoon Network's quality? I think its fair to say there was a time that both networks were on an even with each other. Nick did have SNICK, Game shows, and some pretty good nicktoons.

 

[AnimatedFury]

Nick never on Cartoon Network's quality? I think its fair to say there was a time that both networks were on an even with each other. Nick did have SNICK, Game shows, and some pretty good nicktoons.

I'm not going to be a hater on any network because all three channels have at one time been really great and still today have some quality or at least amusing shows.

To me, CN never compared to early-90's Nickelodeon. Not just the masterworks like Doug, Ren & Stimpy, Rugrats and Rocko's Modern Life, but also great live-action like Salute Your Shorts, "Hey, Dude!", Clarissa Explains It All, PETE & PETE, Round House, "Are You Afraid of the Dark?" and Welcome Freshmen. I even enjoyed the cheesier than SBTB teen drama Fifteen. Nick also had a horde of great game shows like Double Dare, GUTS, Legends of the Hidden Temple, What Would You Do?, Wild and Crazy Kids and Nick Arcade. And the way Nickelodeon presented itself back then with Pete & Pete vignettes and the hosting skills of Stick Stickley, there is no contest for me.

But in the mid-90's, I really didn't care for Nick or many of its new shows (Kabloom, CatDog, Figure it Out). I don't think I got CN until like 1996 or so, and they had the great shows like Dexter's Lab and the legendary Johnny Bravo.

As far as who has fallen off the most, I don't know. Nick has had Danny Phantom, SBSP and FOP which have been decent, and CN has Ben-10 which I like for some reason, and their newer shows like Flapjack and some other crap I can't remember that I thought was funny. I guess the winner for keeping it consistent goes to Disney since all I ever really liked a whole lot was Even Stevens and Recess, and they still play that sometimes at like 4am.

 

[Hellion]

Imo...Cartoon Network...canning Toonami was a big mistake imo, good memories of watching Sailor Moon way back when, and kinda watching Dragonball/Dragonball Z, and getting hooked on Naruto a few years ago...btw...why did Naruto move to Disney?...Hate the Live Action especially the one with the three guys doing experiments or breaking stuff or whatever......Most of the Cartoons are okay, or at least tolerable, happen to like Flapjack, and Adventure Time is kinda Adult Swim Lite.........I think the live action and films hurt the channel, especially some of the films they do show...I know kids who hate most of the films they decide to run.............................................................................but I mainly stick with Adult Swim...I need my King of the Hill Fix...

Nickelodeon: late-80s early-90s, so many memories: Clarissa Explains It All, Salute Your Shorts, Hey Dude, ...and on and on...I miss the orange couch and SNICK...as of now...I still think the programmings okay...I just hate the seeing a Spongebob or Icarly marathon every other day...Pleeasantly surprised with Tru Jackson, Big TIme Rush, THe Troop and so on...not that I watch JONAS (on disney)...but to me BTR is wayyy better...the JoBros shouldn't quit their dayjob...I notice those two are being compared...

Disney: watched a handful of shows in the mid-late 90s...of the more recent shows...the Only Programming I watched, or can remember trying to watch was Phil of the Future and that ended in 2006 IIRC.........I tried watching Aaron Stone (more of a scheduling conflict kept me from watching, I did like the show) and from the few eps I watched I thought it was pretty good...(I know its Disney XD and not Disney Channel proper...)...Kinda bummed its cancelled, supposedly to focus on more comedy themed live action shows , at least I have itunes and youtube......Sorta like Nick...I think most of the programmins okay...

Don't really know what else to say...?

 

[BlackLantern]

well the Toonami block ran for 11 years, that's twice as long as any programming block on that channel...and shows a lot of the anime went away because CN lost the rights...anime got big again and the rights were more than CN was willing to pay

Disney has always done well with their live action shows