Official DD Thread

[runawayboulder]

I knew one day creatively, DD would s**t the bed, I just never thought it would be under Diggle. I guess that long amazing run of solid storytelling officially came to an end. Matt as a wandering bum could work, it did back in the early 90's when Ann Nocenti was on the book.

 

[runawayboulder]

Actually make that late 80's....

 

[kguillou]

And Diggle was actually off to a good start. All those pre-shadowland issues of DD were GREAT stuff. I loved that story where he went to Japan to meet with the Hand's other branch leaders. He was heading in the right direction...then shadowland hit and it all just exploded in fail.

Oh well...call me insane but im actually kinda looking forward to this new Black Panther stuff. I know i know, its a cheap gimmick but ive always had a soft spot for panther and...well the art looks good.lol

 

[E-Man]

Nope, he just simply popped up in Daredevil's book, Luke Cage and Iron Fist asked him what the hell he was doing there, and he was like all "This is my neighborhood now!"

 

[Shockdingo]

Nope, he just simply popped up in Daredevil's book, Luke Cage and Iron Fist asked him what the hell he was doing there, and he was like all "This is my neighborhood now!"

Really?

....



*imitates E-man's avatar only with 50% more rage*

 

[E-Man]

It's okay to rage. I haven't read the trades yet but I'm not liking what I hear from Shadowland. I guess Runawayboulder was right. At some point in time this great run of Daredevil was going to come to an end.

 

[Midnyte_Sun]

I haven't picked up Shadowland #5 yet, but are the rumors true that [BLACKOUT] Ghost Rider loses to a demon possessing Daredevil?[/BLACKOUT]

Please say the editors didn't just take another dump on that character..

 

[Shockdingo]

....uh...as a fellow Ghost Rider (and Daredevil) fan, after reading the above, I implore you to NOT pick up #5. Massive levels of chump out featured.

 

[runawayboulder]

I'm out of the loop on Ghost Rider so can somebody explain to me what was with the way he was speaking? He sounded more like Bendis' version of Luke Cage than the Spirit of Vengeance I remember from the 90's. I'm guessing that wasn't Blaze or Ketch.....?

 

[Motown Marvel]

how long is this black panther crap supposed to last for?

i dont understand why DD: Reborn doesnt take place in the regular title, and the black panther man without fear take place in its own separate title. i dont want to buy the black panther stuff but i also dont want gaps in my numbering.

 

[runawayboulder]

Prob 6 issues. DD Reborn starts 1 month after BP takes over DD and Reborn is a 5 issue mini I think.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Really?

....

 

[DDTMWF]

Prob 6 issues. DD Reborn starts 1 month after BP takes over DD and Reborn is a 5 issue mini I think.

That's what I was hoping for, not really into BP, but I have all issues from #172 to now.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

I just picked up Shadowland 5.

I'm really sick of possessions ending with the character simply snapping out of it. Sure, he may have had Iron Fist's help doing it, but there was nothing stopping Matt from doing this 5 issues ago before the Demon's influence (who from what I can tell, was just a generic demon?) was as strong as it was at the end.

this ending was rushed, cheap, and shallow.

 

[runawayboulder]

Ghost Rider got punked out pretty hard too. The guy was featured on the cover only to get his ass handed to him in a 4 page fight. Iron Fist took out the Beast with a punch to the chest, where was Danny when The Sentry was running amok?

 

[Shockdingo]

Absolute Win

Ghost Rider got punked out pretty hard too. The guy was featured on the cover only to get his ass handed to him in a 4 page fight. Iron Fist took out the Beast with a punch to the chest, where was Danny when The Sentry was running amok?

That's one of my problems with this "The Beast" character, he was nothing but hype. It's a Double-I-T-S moment as my sister would say (It's in the script) It's like "Why is the beast so scary"-----> Cause he is. End of story

I never really saw him do much other than make Matt's body grossly disproportionate, knock back people with pinkish energy and whoop Ghost Rider with a kick and hellfire inhalation. I'm not explaining my point with eloquence, but the main issue is the execution. He just did stuff, you didn't see him plotting, or manifesting power, anything like that. There was no building up, there was not a deeper perspective into his powers other than "He can beat people because"

It's like the South Park episode where they're all ninjas and are having the fantasies, but Cartman keeps adding on powers through the episode.

"We need the beast to beat the mostly human and non-mystical heroes back all at once for the big cliffhanger to the 4th issue!"
-Energy blast.

"We need him to own Ghost Rider! He's mystical and uber powerful when written a certain way!"
-He'll just kick him off his bike and suck up his mystical hellfire

"Ok crap, almost out of pages! How's he beaten?"
-Chi powered punch by Iron Fist and psychological suicide by Matt

I don't know. It's like they built him up to be this big bad (his coming would realize the potential of the Hand, and all would be at its mercy, almost like the Chaos King thingie-- now that guy looks scary) It all ended so anti-climatically for me, it felt like there should have been more, but they knew they couldn't deliver, or rather a massive change of plans forced a non-ideal revamp at the last second.

I know we've had some vague one timey event villains before and they don't always receive a lot of backstory depth, but we at least get a good idea of the nature and execution of their powers or goals. We never really once saw what the Beast wanted other than the generic, destroy, let it all burn out the earth spiel.

Rant over, my brain is hurting because of end of the year stuffs and argument no workie in brainly skull.
"

 

[kguillou]

Just out of curiousity, have the sales on shadowland been good? Just wondering cause its been getting horrible word of mouth since issue 1....then again so did Loeb's Ultimatum and that sold through the roof.

 

[CConn]

how long is this black panther crap supposed to last for?

i dont understand why DD: Reborn doesnt take place in the regular title, and the black panther man without fear take place in its own separate title. i dont want to buy the black panther stuff but i also dont want gaps in my numbering.

I'm sure Marvel will be very upset to learn that they upset your numbering.

 

[runawayboulder]

You could always buy a copy of DD Reborn and scribble 513 over the 1......


I think Marvel is trying to catch lightening in a bottle again like they did with renaming The Incredible Hulk to The Incredible Hercules.

 

[Midnyte_Sun]

Absolute Win


That's one of my problems with this "The Beast" character, he was nothing but hype. It's a Double-I-T-S moment as my sister would say (It's in the script) It's like "Why is the beast so scary"-----> Cause he is. End of story

I never really saw him do much other than make Matt's body grossly disproportionate, knock back people with pinkish energy and whoop Ghost Rider with a kick and hellfire inhalation. I'm not explaining my point with eloquence, but the main issue is the execution. He just did stuff, you didn't see him plotting, or manifesting power, anything like that. There was no building up, there was not a deeper perspective into his powers other than "He can beat people because"

It's like the South Park episode where they're all ninjas and are having the fantasies, but Cartman keeps adding on powers through the episode.

"We need the beast to beat the mostly human and non-mystical heroes back all at once for the big cliffhanger to the 4th issue!"
-Energy blast.

"We need him to own Ghost Rider! He's mystical and uber powerful when written a certain way!"
-He'll just kick him off his bike and suck up his mystical hellfire

"Ok crap, almost out of pages! How's he beaten?"
-Chi powered punch by Iron Fist and psychological suicide by Matt

I don't know. It's like they built him up to be this big bad (his coming would realize the potential of the Hand, and all would be at its mercy, almost like the Chaos King thingie-- now that guy looks scary) It all ended so anti-climatically for me, it felt like there should have been more, but they knew they couldn't deliver, or rather a massive change of plans forced a non-ideal revamp at the last second.

I know we've had some vague one timey event villains before and they don't always receive a lot of backstory depth, but we at least get a good idea of the nature and execution of their powers or goals. We never really once saw what the Beast wanted other than the generic, destroy, let it all burn out the earth spiel.

Rant over, my brain is hurting because of end of the year stuffs and argument no workie in brainly skull.
"

I had a lot of hopes for this arc but what you said pretty much sums it all up.

 

[hippie_hunter]

You could always buy a copy of DD Reborn and scribble 513 over the 1......


I think Marvel is trying to catch lightening in a bottle again like they did with renaming The Incredible Hulk to The Incredible Hercules.

Except while Incredible Hercules was critically acclaimed, after readers realised that it wasn't going back to being the Incredible Hulk, the book dropped like a rock. And take a look at how Hercules: Fall of an Avengers, Prince of Power, and Chaos War sold.

Unless it's a superficial title change like the upcoming title change for Fantastic Four, the Incredible Hulk to the Incredible Hulks, or Iron Man to Iron Man: Director of S.H.I.E.L.D., changing the title of a book and replacing the character often hurts the book tremendously. Incredible Hercules flopped onced readers realised that it wasn't going back to Incredible Hulk. Dark Wolverine flopped and took the entire Wolverine line with it. Franken-Castle delivered a direction for the Punisher that Punisher fans dreaded and bombed even though that too was fun and good.

Black Panther: The Man Without Fear is going to flop. And it's going to flop embarassingly. Both of Black Panther's previous books have flopped hard, which shows that not only does the comic book buying public not care about the character right now, he also needs a bit of a break. So far his appearances in the Daredevil books have been two lines telling Luke Cage and Iron Fist "This is my neighborhood now" and telling Detective Kurtz "I'll be watching Hell's Kitchen now!" WHY!? He has no connection at all with Daredevil (at least Hercules and Daken made sense taking over Hulk and Logans' books by having connections with those characters) and they have no build up to him coming to Hells Kitchen (at least they built up Hercules taking over Hulk's book and Daken taking over Wolverine at least felt somewhat built up through Dark Reign).

This has to be one of the stupidest things Marvel has ever done. EVER.

 

[E-Man]

Well, I think that there is a market for BP, but just that Marvel can't maintain good numbers. He's similar to Iron Fist and Moon Knight in the sense that his comics debuted pretty well over the past five years, but the numbers dwindled for a variety of reasons. *cough* Hudlin sucks *cough*

I don't think that this will work though. Like hippie hunter said, people are going to drop this once they realize that it's just a marketing ploy. The bad thing is that everyone already sees it as that, so this is really going to be walking a tight line of success. The debut will sell well because comic readers like their shiny, new toys. If the first issue isn't that good or intriguing, then it'll slowly descend into obscurity until DD comes back.

 

[runawayboulder]

This has to be one of the stupidest things Marvel has ever done. EVER.

You're totally forgetting everything Marvel has done to Spider-Man for the past decade.

 

[hippie_hunter]

You're totally forgetting everything Marvel has done to Spider-Man for the past decade.

Nope. This is stupider .

 

[hippie_hunter]

Well, I think that there is a market for BP, but just that Marvel can't maintain good numbers. He's similar to Iron Fist and Moon Knight in the sense that his comics debuted pretty well over the past five years, but the numbers dwindled for a variety of reasons. *cough* Hudlin sucks *cough*

I think that there is a market for Black Panther if you just give the character a break, put him in other books such as Avengers and Fantastic Four, and then after a couple of years give him a new book. And even then, that's debatable, the previous Black Panther book debuted to good numbers and was originally sustainable only due to gimmicks like having JRJR appear for the first arc, tying in with Civil War and Secret Invasion, the marriage with Storm, joining the Fantastic Four, etc.

I don't think that this will work though. Like hippie hunter said, people are going to drop this once they realize that it's just a marketing ploy. The bad thing is that everyone already sees it as that, so this is really going to be walking a tight line of success. The debut will sell well because comic readers like their shiny, new toys. If the first issue isn't that good or intriguing, then it'll slowly descend into obscurity until DD comes back.

I don't even think that the first issue is going to sell that well. People are tired of the Panther and the only people who are going to buy this are the Daredevil diehards who don't want an interruption in their numbering while waiting for Daredevil to return (which will happen) and the few Black Panther diehards.