So, was there racist subtext or not?

[Pythenis]

Racist?? Look at Starwars.......all the sucky stormtroopers were white...and Vader wore black and controlled them! Plus Chewy was a giant dog? I mean whats up with that? Lando was in charge of a bunch of white people? The only one that was totally pimp was Jabba the Hutt because he had the pricess and that hot dancing chick that he threw to the rancor monster......jabba was the pimp!

 

[dpm07]

I didn't notice anything being wrong either subliminally or overt. I thought the movie was great as it was.

I had no problem with any depiction of anyone.

 

[Kid_Kaos]

I didn't notice anything being wrong either subliminally or overt. I thought the movie was great as it was.

I had no problem with any depiction of anyone.

Same with me!

I don't get why there's so much whining and complaining about some black guys who play the villains!? It's been this way since the beginning of Hollywood.

white = good / black = evil

Simple concept every children's book uses to this day.

If anyone is racist it's the ones complaining about white people beeing the good guys in a movie. So what if I start a petition against any "black" movie that's coming out!? Isn't "Norbit" or "Bad Boys" racist as well by those standards?

Pathetic we even have to talk about this in 2007.

 

[Webhead7]

This thread is pointless it should be closed.

 

[GL1]

Wearing black and being black are obviously different things, Pythenis.

Pathetic we even have to talk about this in 2007.

It's pathetic I have to experience racism in 2007. It's also it's a shame you are too naive to even acknowledge your own ignorance.

Are you all that scared to talk about race, that you have to pretend it doesn't exist? "I didn't notice" doesn't mean it wasn't there... just that you didn't notice that most of the "persian" army was African. If you didn't notice, fine... but that's what happened.

 

[Nivek]

This movie isn't about race, it's about fighting against cultural domination. Eastern vs. western culture, like 5,000 years of the same old battles over territory and dominence. It wasn't just Persians that were the bad guys, it was Conquered Egyptians, african tribes, asians, mongolians, ect. They were united under domination, under lash from Xerses, to drive the Spartans back. End of story. Too bad people are too caught in their own cultural guilt/pride to see the obvious.

BTW- This is a place to talk about comic book/graphic novel based films, not hot button race bull-s##t.

 

[ILikeYourCoat]

The 3 major bad guys are all black or dark-skinned. First, the messenger who brings in the skulls of dead kings to frighten Leonidas, and get's his ass drop-kicked into a well, is black. Second, the dude with the whip whose arm gets sliced off, and he says they will blot out the sun with arrows, he is dark-skinned. And finally, the main bad guy, King Xerxes, played by a Latino, had make-up put on him to make him much darker looking than he is in real life. All the good guys are white. So it could be seen in racial terms. Maybe it's payback for the past 40 years of Hollywood movies portraying Whites as evildoers, and every single person of color as an oppressed victim of Whites.

 

[the a1ant]

This movie isn't about race, it's about fighting against cultural domination. Eastern vs. western culture, like 5,000 years of the same old battles over territory and dominence. It wasn't just Persians that were the bad guys, it was Conquered Egyptians, african tribes, asians, mongolians, ect. They were united under domination, under lash from Xerses, to drive the Spartans back. End of story. Too bad people are too caught in their own cultural guilt/pride to see the obvious.

Agreed. Being a black man myself, I saw nothing racist about this flick. Whenever one race/empire is fighting against another race/empire, there's a possibility that someone is going to take offense. I didn't feel that it was being glorified though. It just served the story. Like someone said earlier, our history has racism behind it. Did Snyder and Miller intentionally get the darkest actors to play certain roles for racist reasonings? I don't know, but it's not something that crossed my mind in the theater. =/

 

[ToddIsDead]

The Achaemenid Empire was the particular persion empire depicted in this film. Here, you will find a map that shows exactly what territories this empire held, and you will see that this empire did stretch into Africa. If you didn't aready know, there are black people in Africa. This would indicate that there were at least a few blacks within the empire. If the movie is just trying to accurately depict the racial diversities of the empire, how is it trying to be racist?

 

[Warhammer]

Do these people look African

How big was the Persian Empire again?

 

[Warhammer]

Oh please, it's not that no one is scared to talk race, it's that some people didn't go into the theatre thinking "OH MAN, THIS IS GOING TO BE A RACIST MOVIE, BLAH BLAH BLAH." The movie wasn't about whites vs. non whites. It was about 300 Spartans vs. the Persian Army. Historically, the Persian Empire extended it's power to all the corners of the Earth.. Even Africa. It wasn't like they threw black people in there just to be killed, they threw them in there because HISTORICALLY they were part of the empire. And lets look at the the actual Persian warriors. The ones within the turbans and shawls were Middle Eastern, not black, because, WOW, historically, parts of the Middle East were conquered by the Persian Empire. Why were the black people in this movie construed as evil doers? Because look at the facts. The story is told from the point of view of a SPARTAN soldier, who hates the Persian Empire.. Of course he's going to glorify his former comrades and make the Persian army seem like savages.. Because he was telling the tale to a group of soldiers in order to rally them up for the Battle of Plataea, which was AGAINST THE PERSIAN ARMY. He wanted to get his men in a revenge state of mind as to avenge their fallen comrades. Of course he is going to over glorify the Spartan's while at the same time exaggerating the evil-ness of the Persian's.

I hate it when people try to make something seem racist even when it really isn't. You're missing the point of the movie if you can't see past the supposed racial issues within it. And why is it only movies where whites triumph over non-whites racist? It seems like it's only wrong if something is racist against non-whites but if it's racist against white people, it's fair game. The fact is that anything can be made racist if you look into it hard enough and it's really stupid to consider this movie racist because it's completely not an issue.

This may be one of the single greatest posts in the history of the Hype.
This should go right to the face of anyone who deemed 300 racist.

 

[ILikeYourCoat]

The guy on the right looks a little like Eddie Munster.

http://myspace-224.vo.llnwd.net/00043/42/29/43039224_l.jpg

 

[Obsidian]

This thread is pointless it should be closed.

I don't see why it is. We're getting some healthy discussion on this and not because of the white vs. black issue

It’s not about race.
It’s about culture. It’s ethnocentric, not racist.

The Spartans are ethnocentric, yes. But the film itself is intentionally racist by depicting the Persian Empire (and all its subsidiaries) as monstrous creatures. Did this take away from the enjoyment experience? No. The racism isn't as bad as it was in "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom".

 

[herakles]

How big was the Persian Empire again?

The VAST Majority of the Persian Empire where of Middle Eastern decent. The empire did strech into north Africa and down into Nubia/Sudan. So most of Xerxes' army was made up of Persians, Medians, Armenians, Greeks, Iraqis, Egyptians, and Nubians! in the that order of percentage. Could they have use Nubians are messangers? Maybe But I think the one that got thrown into well in Sparta where native Persians and/or Medians? What Im trying to say is that if there was a historically acturate movie made 80% of Xerxes army is Middle Eastern and the other 20% is Greeks from the Ionian territories of the Anatolian Coast, Greeks from Allied Polis, Egyptian, and Nubians. I don't think that Im too far off but I doubt I am 100% sure of the ethnic make up of Xerxes' army.

I found a map of the time period and it looks like the border stops at the First cateract of the Nile? That is historical border between Egypt and Numibia.

 

[SolidSnakeMGS]

The 3 major bad guys are all black or dark-skinned. First, the messenger who brings in the skulls of dead kings to frighten Leonidas, and get's his ass drop-kicked into a well, is black. Second, the dude with the whip whose arm gets sliced off, and he says they will blot out the sun with arrows, he is dark-skinned. And finally, the main bad guy, King Xerxes, played by a Latino, had make-up put on him to make him much darker looking than he is in real life. All the good guys are white. So it could be seen in racial terms. Maybe it's payback for the past 40 years of Hollywood movies portraying Whites as evildoers, and every single person of color as an oppressed victim of Whites.

Ridiculous. You mention all of the deaths of the so called dark-skinned people; but you neglect the slaughter of 300 overwhelmed white men.

Also, there were many different ethnic appearances; I saw many Persians who did not resemble black people.

This movie was neither portrayed in racial terms or political terms. This thread is ridiculous and pointless, not to mention inciting.

 

[WeeZiTe]

You can

 

[GSFOR]

Wearing black and being black are obviously different things, Pythenis.



It's pathetic I have to experience racism in 2007. It's also it's a shame you are too naive to even acknowledge your own ignorance.

Are you all that scared to talk about race, that you have to pretend it doesn't exist? "I didn't notice" doesn't mean it wasn't there... just that you didn't notice that most of the "persian" army was African. If you didn't notice, fine... but that's what happened.

Um I have a question, since so much persian and african american are ,or have been offended. What race has the immortals offended? I know their has got to be a race of peole with claws on their finger as well as dracular like fang teeth. How come these people are not stepping up. I for one feel offended for that race of people. Remember they were made to be the worst of all of xerxes people. Get over yourselves, watch the movie, and be glad you weren't alive back then to face a real spartan.

 

[SolidSnakeMGS]

Mutated hunchbacks should be offended as they were portrayed as traiterous cowards. I expect rallys and riots very soon.

 

[herakles]

Um I have a question, since so much persian and african american are ,or have been offended. What race has the immortals offended? I know their has got to be a race of peole with claws on their finger as well as dracular like fang teeth. How come these people are not stepping up. I for one feel offended for that race of people. Remember they were made to be the worst of all of xerxes people. Get over yourselves, watch the movie, and be glad you weren't alive back then to face a real spartan.

Well I would think that Persians/Iranians would be pissed at the way the Immortals are shown in the movie.

I found the article on them in wikipedia

The Persian Immortals were the Persian elite Imperial Guard regiment during the Greco-Persian Wars.
The term Immortals comes from Herodotus who called them either Ten Thousand or Athanatoi (lit. immortals). Persians themselves probably did not use the term — Herodotus may have used a corruption of a Persian word anusiya (= "companions").

Herodotus tells that Immortals were heavy infantry lead by Hydarnes that was kept constantly in strength of exactly 10,000 men — every killed, seriously wounded or sick member was immediately replaced with a new one, maintaining the cohesion of the unit. The regiment accepted only Median or Persian applicants.

Their weapons were a leather and wicker shield, a short spear with an iron point and a counterbalance on the other end, a bow with cane arrows, a quiver for them and a dagger or short sword. The regiment's uniform consisted of a tiara or soft felt cap, an embroidered long-sleeved tunic, trousers, and a coat of metal. Their usual tactics involved a front rank charge at the enemy while the rear ranks shot arrows to support the assault.

 

[GSFOR]

Well I would think that Persians/Iranians would be pissed at the way the Immortals are shown in the movie.

I found the article on them in wikipedia

The Persian Immortals were the Persian elite Imperial Guard regiment during the Greco-Persian Wars.
The term Immortals comes from Herodotus who called them either Ten Thousand or Athanatoi (lit. immortals). Persians themselves probably did not use the term — Herodotus may have used a corruption of a Persian word anusiya (= "companions").

Herodotus tells that Immortals were heavy infantry lead by Hydarnes that was kept constantly in strength of exactly 10,000 men — every killed, seriously wounded or sick member was immediately replaced with a new one, maintaining the cohesion of the unit. The regiment accepted only Median or Persian applicants.

Their weapons were a leather and wicker shield, a short spear with an iron point and a counterbalance on the other end, a bow with cane arrows, a quiver for them and a dagger or short sword. The regiment's uniform consisted of a tiara or soft felt cap, an embroidered long-sleeved tunic, trousers, and a coat of metal. Their usual tactics involved a front rank charge at the enemy while the rear ranks shot arrows to support the assault.

YEAAAAAAH, Thanks for the brief history leson...ALL I CAN SAY NOW IS *ERR-GO-GY* (don't really know if it exist but I know I didn't spell it right. I put it like that, as I was trying to sound it out. You historian do the rest) as it's called , forces the children to fight, steal, and even killed. I mean modern day greek should be offended. I guess at the fact that at one time, they were taught to be theives, murderer and bully, before even reaching adulthood. Or at how barbaric the movie made greeks, throwing your kids over a cliff, due to imperfection. I know nowadays you can't send your kids to school with one scratch on them. Coz child service might take them from you . But in sparta at seven they were getting slapped around by their 250lbs fathers, what kind of a society put up with something like that. It's seems like the movie offended everyone. Or maybe it was just a movie, and your just looking too far beyond that.

 

[Obsidian]

YEAAAAAAH, Thanks for the brief history leson...ALL I CAN SAY NOW IS *ERR-GO-GY* (don't really know if it exist but I know I didn't spell it right. I put it like that, as I was trying to sound it out. You historian do the rest) as it's called , forces the children to fight, steal, and even killed. I mean modern day greek should be offended. I guess at the fact that at one time, they were taught to be theives, murderer and bully, before even reaching adulthood. Or at how barbaric the movie made greeks, throwing your kids over a cliff, due to imperfection. I know nowadays you can't send your kids to school with one scratch on them. Coz child service might take them from you . But in sparta at seven they were getting slapped around by their 250lbs fathers, what kind of a society put up with something like that. It's seems like the movie offended everyone. Or maybe it was just a movie, and your just looking too far beyond that.

Why should modern day Greeks be offended? Their elite weren't portrayed as hideous creatures with teeth filed to points.

 

[cryptic name]

it's not just that but the fact that many of the Persians we did see had horribly disfigured faces and resembled some monstrous creatures instead of humans..against the good-looking Spartan army..that is pretty racist

regardless, i still enjoyed the movie

that's not racist. painting the enemy of the heroes as monstrous is common in myth and literature. if they were fighting anglos, they still woud have looked disfigured and frightning

 

[GSFOR]

OBSIDIAN you are right, however in todays society the spartan code would be considered montrous, inhumane, as well as savages. I am saying they are not offended because most of all people it is a movie and sometimes things are exagerated...I guess you also believed that leonidas wasn't freezing in the woods that night because he was white. Or because his boxer gave him special power that kept him from catching pneumonia as well as his hands and feet from going numb.

 

[Mr Sparkle]

Dudes, let me make it simple.
300 Is a cool flick that wanted to make money.
the best way to do that is to slip in messages that certain people will identify with and others will ignore.
simple. I went to see it with a friend of mine and we both rolled our eyes at the rather obvious lack of subtlety in it's message.
we laughed our asses off on the way home just anticipating the ways certain people were going to receive it.
regardless, it was an enjoyable flick.
it's American so it's going to favor the demographic, simple as that, no ulterior motive.
if anything, the only issue I have is one of the last phrases which infers that the Greeks were not Mystics.

they...uh...were, historically they melted the weapons of their defeated persian foes (in another battle) and offered them to their Oracle.

so, uh, yeah, pretty supersticious.

 

[Warhammer]

You people who say the film is racist need to lighten up.
There's nothing you can do about it, so get over it.
What is there is there. It was based on Frank Miller's graphic novel, not the actual battle itself. (Which the graphic novel was based off of)

Stop b!tching about it.
Get over it.