Spider-Man 4 Theme

Discussion in 'Spider-Man Sequels' started by BobJM, Nov 10, 2007.

  1. BobJM

    BobJM Who's Bad?

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    Everyone seems hung up on the idea of who's going to be the next baddie in the Spider-Man saga, but a more important question is...

    "What lesson will Peter Parker learn"?

    Or, better yet, what will Aunt May tell us?

    Here's my breakdown of the first three films along with my predictions/desire for Spider-Man 4.

    Spider-Man 1: Power & Responsibility
    Spider-Man 2: Choice & Sacrifice
    Spider-Man 3: Revenge & Forgiveness
    Spider-Man 4: Redemption & Hope

    Complete with color and everything! :woot:

    *Feel free to elaborate your story ideas and how characters and/or plotlines would fit into this theme.
     
  2. Visionary

    Visionary Registered

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    I know I'm along here, but I'm getting tired of these learning lessons for Peter, like this is a Disney movie. How about a movie where Peter now knows what he must do, and have already learned what he needs to know because of the life lessons in SM1 through SM3. :cool:
     
  3. Blader5489

    Blader5489 CASUAL SEX!

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    You're right, Peter should stop growing up. :whatever:
     
  4. Arcturus

    Arcturus Registered

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    Peters next lesson should be about the dangers of drinking and driving.
     
  5. ThatDamnNinja

    ThatDamnNinja Registered

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    Let's not turn Spider-Man into an afterschool special. I think Spider-Man 2 had it right, in terms of having a theme, but not driving into your skull like Spider-Man 3 did.

    I'm not sure how to condense it into a neat little two word package, but I think Spider-Man 4 should essentially revolve around the conflict Peter has within himself regarding the Lizard. I mean, we've got the Lizard, a savage, mindless beast who is occasionally killing innocent people, but Peter is also one of only a handful of people who knows that it's really Dr. Curt Connors, who he cares about and respects deeply. The Lizard is very strong, and not easily subdued, so a capture isn't simple.

    Not only is he faced with his own crisis of conscious, he is faced with a public that becomes hysterical in their fear, and begins to resent Spider-Man for not bringing the crisis to a close more quickly, and begin to demand that the Lizard be killed (which of course raises a question within Peter; is he being selfish? he wants to search for a cure, but the longer he waits, the more people die; is the cost too much? is he putting his own desires before the greater good by continuing to spare the Lizard, despite the death and destruction he causes?).

    Enter Kraven, a man more than willing to and more than capable of giving the public exactly what they want by killing the Lizard. Quickly, the conflict between Kraven and Spider-Man becomes well-publicized, and the media and public opinion sways in Kraven's favor.

    So the Peter is faced with an intense internal conflict: personal moral crisis; conscious vs. public pressure; as well as a complicated external conflict: defeat Lizard, keep Kraven from killing Lizard, keep Lizard and Kraven from killing him).

    I think that's more than enough to fill the moral theme quota.
     
  6. Blader5489

    Blader5489 CASUAL SEX!

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    Uh...what? If anything, SM3 conveyed it's theme a bit more subtly than Aunt May's 10 minute hero speech.

    Commitment. If the previous movies were about Peter learning responsibility, selflessness, and forgiveness, then the theme of a Lizard/Kraven story could revolve around the lesson of commitment; or more specifically, a reevaluation of priorities. Peter would be torn between MJ and Gwen; Spider-Man would be torn be protecting his friend and protecting the city; Connors would be torn between his dream and his family; Kraven would be committed solely to the hunt, which proves to be his downfall in the end.

    And if you have Captain Stacy in the storyline, he would sacrifice himself to save a kid during a Spidey/Lizard fight, showing his commitment to the people while also providing the impetus for Kraven to begin his hunt.
     
  7. Da Games Elite

    Da Games Elite Registered

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    What if you had Kraven be the one to kill Captain Stacy?
     
  8. BobJM

    BobJM Who's Bad?

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    I would like to Captain Stacy survive SM4, maybe show more of a relationship between him and Spider-Man.

    Besides, he was only in SM3 for like 5 minutes, his death would have no impact.
     
  9. Gamma Warrior

    Gamma Warrior Ghetto Fabulous

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    Peter should evolve beyond needing to be taught a general lesson. The theme could be about dualism in the Lizard. Which Peter had to deal with himself. Spidey could help Connors over come the same problem.
     
  10. BobJM

    BobJM Who's Bad?

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    Duality is always more of a sub-theme, isn't it? In each film, Peter is always struggling with his secret identity and balancing both of his alter egos.
     
  11. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    Capt. Stacy needs more build up before we can kill him. No one would care enough at this point.

    As for theme, I am just going to wait and see. I am not trying to write the script, so trying to predict the theme I feel is fruitless.
     
  12. Spider-ManHero12

    Spider-ManHero12 Web-Slinger

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    I like the theme's you guys have thought of. conflict, personal moral crisis, etc. I really tohught was great. :up:

    As for killing Captain Stacy, I say no. It's too early for him to die, and as Spider-Fan930 said, he needs more build up before he can die.
     
  13. Blader5489

    Blader5489 CASUAL SEX!

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    Connors has had about 5 minutes of screentime thus far and people already want him to become the Lizard. As I see it, you only need to spend the first act of SM4 to build the relationship between Spider-Man and Captain Stacy.
     
  14. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    You would definately have to establish a relationship between the 2, so if you wanted him to die, then Capt. Stacy would have to become one of the more main characters of the movie.
     
  15. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    Just Spider-Fan now :spidey:

    Dropped the 930.
     
  16. chaseter

    chaseter Esteemed Member

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    I like Redemption and Downfall

    Dr. Connors is so obsessed in his work to make himself a full man again that he looses sight of what he has and how great of a man he has become due to circumstances. He turns himself into the Lizard and plummets into a savage creature with no remorse. Spider-Man is dealing with a sick Aunt May and his life is in a downward spiral as well. J.K. is smeering Spidey and the city is once again against him. Spider-Man is at another low. Meanwhile, Kraven comes to NY to hunt down an elusive beast. All in all, Spider-Man must redeem himself to the public as well as help out Connors get his life back together.
     
  17. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    I think Spidey would have to do something to get people to hate him. I mean, everyone loved him in SM3. JJJ smearing him wouldn't be enough.
     
  18. chaseter

    chaseter Esteemed Member

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    He was tarnished with the fake Brock photo. Maybe accidentally letting someone die like Cap. or Gwen Stacy.
     
  19. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    Yeah, but that fake photo showed him robbing a bank and being a criminal. That is definately something that would alter perception (though all was forgiven...since it was faked).

    Letting someone die may do it, but the Stacy's need more impactful deaths, so they need more development before either can die.

    Maybe they could do a Kraven's Last Hunt esque thing, and have Kraven do things as Spider-Man to tarnish his name.
     
  20. chaseter

    chaseter Esteemed Member

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    Kraven masquerading around as Spider-Man would be lame IMO. Gwen's death would be meaningful period b/c she had a good role in SM3. I think her dying and the Cap. becoming angry and sending the police on him would be great.
     
  21. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    Eh, I don't like that idea. She would have to die fairly early for it to be a big part of the movie, and I feel we need more of a connection to her for something that impactful.

    I am not sure what I would make him do to get trashed by the people again, however. Kraven acting as Spider-Man is the best I got at the moment.
     
  22. Blader5489

    Blader5489 CASUAL SEX!

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    Like I said, spend the first act building the relationship between Spidey and Capt. Stacy, then kill him off during the first battle with the Lizard. Spidey is blamed for the captain's death, providing the impetus for Kraven's hunting the Lizard.
     
  23. Spider-Fan

    Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014 Champion

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    Now that I think of it, this idea is not bad.

    But, I am still gonna wait and see. Not going to sell myself on anyone way SM4 should be on this site, cause that is what sets you up for disappointment.
     
  24. Visionary

    Visionary Registered

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    Yeah, the boy is getting too tall. :D
    Smart man, it's usually when everyone has already written in their head what villain(s) and story should be told, and cling to them, is where a lot of disappointment comes in. Some people are already saying The Lizard/Kraven motif or they'll be disappointed. :dry:
     
  25. Leenie

    Leenie Registered

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    I agree with this, which brings me my idea of Spider-Man 4's "theme": failure.

    Captain Stacy dies, and Spider-Man deals with his first real failure as a superhero. Throughout the film, Spidey thinks that he'll fail Dr. Connors by not curing him. Of course, there's a happy ending.

    It's a somewhat loose theme, but I think it could work nicely.
     

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