I don't get it, this is the same guy who ended the show that pissed off so many people and has baffled people to this day. Clearly he wasn't gonna make a movie like everyone wanted. Now how that movie was made, is another matter, but going by the story, it's on brand with how Chase creates his stories. This isn't a George Lucas situation.
Of course this thing tanked at the BO. Venom or not this absolutely not the kind of movie that audiences flock to. It KINDA wants to be Goodfellas but it doesnt have Scorcese’s energy and style. I liked the movie but people are gonna be bored outta their minds with this. This felt like a tv movie and not something you’d release in theaters.
It's also the type of thing that's way more accessible if you've watched The Sopranos. I definitely wouldn't have enjoyed it if I wasn't a fan of the show.
A lot of good ideas, but none of them really worked for me at all. And then add a bunch of nonsensical easter eggs and nods to the show that make no real sense. It was a very disappointing experience.
I don't get the criticisms of this. This was a very good movie. 8/10. It has its problems, but they have more to do with directing and referential choices than the script which was strong.
Dickie is just as bad, if not worse than Tony, maybe because Dickie is more lost than Tony was whether through life circumstances, the time period, or by his own doing. There is an element of tragedy where maybe these people are just born into a situation they never had any control over. On the other hand, he's his own worst enemy.
Dickie begins this story
killing his own father and ends killing the wife to his father
. There's that classic Chase psycho undercurrent but also the Sopranos has always been about people trapped in the cycles of their own lives from their own choices who won't do better despite having the choices to do so. Dickie is caught in eternal suffering because of his "wanting" yet he never does anything real to change that. He knows he wants to do good but doesn't. And it ends in the only way it could end for someone like that. And it's done in classic Chase irony of
Uncle Jr. being behind his death. He really was always a true bastard with now a dirty secret in the show. It's a brilliant bait and switch. Of course Dickie Moltisanti gets killed because Jr. felt emasculated by Dickie, and his girlfriend not having sex with him was the straw that broke the camels back. It wasn't Harold who did it. Harold was more there as a representation of changing America, someone who actually changed his destiny yet unlike his white counterparts, is punished for it in Newark. Ironic Dickie is killed not for reasons of trying to change.
Dickie's fate ripples to Tony who is in search of a parental figure of Dickie, but since that's the best he can do, yet either way, it seems like Tony may have always been destined for his future life. Tony may have always been screwed. Or not. Maybe
if Dickie was alive
, Tony at some point could have gone into furniture. It's the what if, the unknown that makes it tragic. Gandolfini is excellent as young Tony, the often spoken about caring kid who never had the support he needed. Him trying to get his mother help to how it ends was just great.
This isn't "The Sopranos Movie" with all the bells in whistles of that. It's how David Chase does it. The show was as influenced by European cinema and French New Wave and it's no different here. Stories driven by the characters choices than plot, randomness, ambiguity, irony, fate, the surreal. And it's mixed in with Chase's interest in talking about America as he is with the characters. All the characters arrive to nowhere in some way.
As for the problems with it, the direction is lackluster. Not bad, it's fine, it just comes off like more of a TV movie than something more cinematic. Taylor did a great job on the show, but he isn't up to it here. This movie ironically may have needed a more outside vision, like a European or South Korean or Hispanic director. It needed more style, something to balance out Chase's script, to which those sensibilities fit better in the first place.
And some of the references are too on the nose. *****'s name being announced, Carmela's name reference. Except the Haltson's thing was great. It seems to be the point of fate for Tony Soprano. Was he sitting in the same bar stool the guy with the Members Only jacket was sitting?
I can't decide if the guy who played Silvio took it too far. Silvio is such a cartoonish character and you need to be careful. The guy was spot on and it was a riot, but character wise, was it the right choice? Probably not. I don't buy Silvio always acted like that.
Other than that, that's really it. I think time will catch up to this story. Not without its flaws, even if it cheapens it a little, they by no means debilitate the narrative and Chase spins a really satisfying one.
I watched it the other night and I had some mixed feelings on how it flowed as a narrative, but I think you raise a lot of great points here in terms of the film's merits and what it was going for.
I do think it sits in a bit of an uncomfortable in between where I'm not sure if it truly succeeds as a stand alone mob story as much as it does a companion piece to the show. There are some pretty deep cuts (I'm sure I didn't catch them all) to fully appreciate some of the callbacks and poetic echoes to the show. I also was left with a bit of "was this story necessary?" lingering feeling. I think the long form format just fit that world and style of storytelling better, for my taste.
Vera Farmiga as Livia was the standout performance for me. I feel like she more than any other really made me believe I was watching the same character from the show.
The only thing that's questionable is Christopher's narration being necessary if it's a standalone. But I'd have to think about that some more.
But as a structured film, it was written like how David Chase writes everything from the show to his film Not Fade Away. It's not a mob story, neither was Sopranos. It's a story about a person who's his own worst enemy and doesn't change, even if he's tormented by his choices to how it effects this young kid who will become just like him.
The only thing that's questionable is Christopher's narration being necessary if it's a standalone. But I'd have to think about that some more.
But as a structured film, it was written like how David Chase writes everything from the show to his film Not Fade Away. It's not a mob story, neither was Sopranos. It's a story about a person who's his own worst enemy and doesn't change, even if he's tormented by his choices to how it effects this young kid who will become just like him.
Regardless of whether it was necessary, I have to say I found the opening both creepy and darkly funny. Very effective way to bring us back into that world.
Though I will say the ending felt a bit tacked-on to bookend it for the sake of it.
I'd be willing to watch another movie or even a series if there's more focus on Johnny Boy and Junior since they were very underused in Many Saints of Newark.
This is a great analysis of Tony Soprano.
Ultimately it’s just their opinion but for me it’s spot on. He made me realize characteristic’s in Tony that I didn’t pick up on.
Watched this last night before it disappears on HBO Max and maybe it’s just because I don’t really consider myself a Sopranos die-hard, but I was into it. Especially Corey Stoll, Vera and Michael Gandolfini. And considering IP is everything these days, I would be shocked if they don’t do some sort of continuation series. Ideally with enough time to spare for me to make it through the entire show by the time it comes out.
How can they want another series to go until the time the series begins? James Gandolfini is gone as well as Nancy Marchand, and even if they were still with us the entire cast is still 20 years older than they were when the show started. I'm all for another prequel movie/show to continue where Many Saints of Newark left off, but the timeline shouldn't go beyond the early-mid '80s.
I'll take whatever Chase wants to do. If he wants to do a movie, then let him do the movie. His mini series about old Hollywood sounds great. I wish they'd give him the money to do that.
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