The Matrix Resurrections

Free Guy was all about Ryan Reynolds doing his Deadpool thing + being about video games. There were even Avengers references thrown in there.

So what? It wasn't a sequel. It wasn't a reboot. It wasn't a remake. It wasn't based on a book or comic or existing property.

That's like saying Deadpool is Ryan Reynolds doing his Van Wilder thing.
 
So what? It wasn't a sequel. It wasn't a reboot. It wasn't a remake. It wasn't based on a book or comic or existing property.

That's like saying Deadpool is Ryan Reynolds doing his Van Wilder thing.
Again, it included tons of pop culture references and starred a man most people like and are familiar with. Hence why it made money
 
Rather than movie goers not "caring" about originality, I think it's easy for fans to go see characters they like. If you ask people whether they want to see a new, original movie, they would invariably say yes. What they will reach into their pocket for is something they know or has created a lot of buzz.
 
No it isn’t really. We obviously aren’t on the same page, so let’s just move on.

yes it is. You are dismissing Free Guy as an original film just because it had a big name star from Deadpool and pop culture references which many movies have.
 
yes it is. You are dismissing Free Guy as an original film just because it had a big name star from Deadpool and pop culture references which many movies have.
I never said anything about Free Guy’s originality. I said it I thought it was successful because it was a blockbuster with elements that general audiences are familiar with and already love. Video games, Avengers references, + Ryan Reynolds. Now Is it original? Sure of course but it’s embedded with things that are already extremely popular.
 
I never said anything about Free Guy’s originality. I said it I thought it was successful because it was a blockbuster with elements that general audiences are familiar with and already love. Video games, Avengers references, + Ryan Reynolds. Now Is it original? Sure of course but it’s embedded with things that are already extremely popular.
I frankly don't consider Free Guy "original". Just the fact that it isn't a sequel doesn't, IMO, make something original.....and I never put any goal posts down. So I guess Jungle Cruise was original?? Sorry, but I don't see it. A Quiet Place was pretty original so what invariably happens is you get a sequel because the first one created a good bit of buzz, there was more to be told, and people liked the characters. The "more to be told" part doesn't mean there won't be a sequel. Jungle Cruise didn't exactly leave us hanging, but I would put my money on a sequel and think it will do well......back to my main point about why people shell out money to see movies.

It just depends on what you see as original. Free Guy wasn't a sequel. That is all.
 
I frankly don't consider Free Guy "original". Just the fact that it isn't a sequel doesn't, IMO, make something original.....and I never put any goal posts down. So I guess Jungle Cruise was original?? Sorry, but I don't see it. A Quiet Place was pretty original so what invariably happens is you get a sequel because the first one created a good bit of buzz, there was more to be told, and people liked the characters. The "more to be told" part doesn't mean there won't be a sequel. Jungle Cruise didn't exactly leave us hanging, but I would put my money on a sequel and think it will do well......back to my main point about why people shell out money to see movies.
My original point was that people mainly pay money to see blockbusters/stuff they are familiar with. Free Guy fits there. A Quiet Place is another exception. I’m glad that it found an audience. But there are countless examples this year of movies people didn’t want to see. Nightmare Alley, The Last Duel, Licorice Pizza, The Green Knight, etc…

a few years ago, these movies would’ve done relatively well compared to their budget. Not anymore.
 
I feel I need to rewatch this at least once before I comment on it. Right now I just feel a bit confused about it. It certainly didn't feel like a "typical" Matrix flick. And at first I felt something was lacking, then again it feels like a totally different film in various areas compared to earlier offerings. Yeah, I definitely need to rewatch this.
 
My original point was that people mainly pay money to see blockbusters/stuff they are familiar with. Free Guy fits there. A Quiet Place is another exception. I’m glad that it found an audience. But there are countless examples this year of movies people didn’t want to see. Nightmare Alley, The Last Duel, Licorice Pizza, The Green Knight, etc…

a few years ago, these movies would’ve done relatively well compared to their budget. Not anymore.
Agree. Like I said, you can ASK people if they want original (in the sense you're talking about) and they say Yes. What the dig into their wallet to see is another matter. Jungle Cruise is another perfect example. The Rock, Emily Blunt, Disney, Indiana Jones, etc. They don't pay these actors out of a sense of altruism. They pay them more because it helps the movie make more.
 
Slightly off topic, but I rather liked Licorice Pizza and while part of the premise of the movie creeped me out a little bit, it was well done and the acting was very, very good. Cooper was just terrific and man can you ever tell who his father was.
 
I frankly don't consider Free Guy "original". Just the fact that it isn't a sequel doesn't, IMO, make something original.....and I never put any goal posts down. So I guess Jungle Cruise was original?? Sorry, but I don't see it. A Quiet Place was pretty original so what invariably happens is you get a sequel because the first one created a good bit of buzz, there was more to be told, and people liked the characters. The "more to be told" part doesn't mean there won't be a sequel. Jungle Cruise didn't exactly leave us hanging, but I would put my money on a sequel and think it will do well......back to my main point about why people shell out money to see movies.

It just depends on what you see as original. Free Guy wasn't a sequel. That is all.

Jungle Cruise is based on a Disney theme park ride.

Free Guy is an original IP and story. Ryan Reynolds agrees with me.
 
Having let this film settle in my mind for a little while, Im still in love with it. Id really like to have a sequel to see where the franchise goes, but at the same time this was just such a wholesome story about Neo and Trinity that I'm not sure I want to risk a bad sequel tarnishing it. If it doesn't get a sequel I can appreciate this as an epilogue and have my own head canon of what Neo and Trinity did after this.
 
Some people have a hard time listening to what others say.
 
Except look at this movie.

WB may have greatly overestimated the desire for another Matrix sequel in the first place given the reception of the sequels. Throw in a simultaneous HBO Max release, a superhero juggernaut dominating the box office, the release happening just as Omnicron spikes were going crazy, middling reviews and well...yeah. Not a surprising outcome.

As a longtime Matrix fan though, I'm so happy this movie exists. It feels like it shouldn't have got through, which makes it all the sweeter.
 
My point: You can make good original films that audiences want to see. And not all updates of established franchises are not always a slam dunk. The problem is that at the corporate decision making level, all they want is the established brand names with existing brand recognition.
 
I tried to avoid spoilers for this completely. Like didn’t even read fan theories or anything but apparently this shot from the finale has been online for a year now?? :wow::funny:
 
My point: You can make good original films that audiences want to see. And not all updates of established franchises are not always a slam dunk. The problem is that at the corporate decision making level, all they want is the established brand names with existing brand recognition.


It's so easy to make original content too. What was stopping WB from making a sci-fi movie where a chosen one travels the virtual landscape and calls it.... "The Net?"

IMO, Matrix Resurrection is a great example of a movie that didn't need to be made. Instead of doing the work to write a similar but original dystopian sci-fi story with good actors.. they said, "nah, let's just repackage a known brand, because that's easier on us, and more likely to get a big cash dump."

This is just laziness. And what's worse... this kind of lazy storytelling is not without cost. They've pretty much destroyed the original Matrix movies now. At the end of Matrix 1, Neo said that he was going to show the world what the Matrix was. Did he? Would we really have been super interested in Matrix 3, if we knew that the stakes were, "Will Neo stop this iteration of the Matrix for a few years until the new, improved version comes back?" No, of course not.

Instead of making a new story with the characters they wanted.. they chose to rewrite a Sci-Fi classic.... to adjust the characters and their abilities in order to fit the story they wanted to tell. It's lazy.
 
Rather than movie goers not "caring" about originality, I think it's easy for fans to go see characters they like. If you ask people whether they want to see a new, original movie, they would invariably say yes. What they will reach into their pocket for is something they know or has created a lot of buzz.

Its better to view it in terms of a spectrum of risk. I, the consumer, have a finite budget of time and money to spend on entertainment, and want to spend that budget well. An "original" movie is, by definition, new- its an unknown. Will I like its content or quality? Who knows! A sequel or franchise, by contrast, is a known factor. Its not guaranteed to be appealing, but the customer has much more information to judge the likelihood of it being appealing. Thus, it is intrinsically less of a risk than an original movie- you are choosing between "have good reason to think it will be worth it" vs "have no good reason to think it will be worth it". Does this mean an original movie can never succeed? Of course not. . . but it has to do a much harder job selling itself to the audience, and it needs to have more measured expectations of success going in. Note that going "But you the audience should just heedlessly risk your time and money" is not an effective method of marketing.

( A sequel/franchise/whatever could also give the customer good information to believe they *won't* enjoy it. . . but if so, they presumably aren't considering it as one of their options in the first place, natch. )
 
The irony here is that the public wasn’t interested in a Matrix 4 anyway, so if this had been an original film instead, maybe it would’ve made the same amount.
 
IMO, Matrix Resurrection is a great example of a movie that didn't need to be made. Instead of doing the work to write a similar but original dystopian sci-fi story with good actors.. they said, "nah, let's just repackage a known brand, because that's easier on us, and more likely to get a big cash dump."

IMO, this isn't a complete read on what Matrix Resurrections actually is doing. To me, this is an artist taking a movie that they know doesn't strictly "need" to be made, but one that the studio was going to make one way or another, and using it as an opportunity to tell reclaim their creation in a sense. Making a statement on the state of pop culture and movies, expressing something personal with it, highlighting love as the most important theme of the original films. Whether it succeeds or not is subjective, but I applaud the ambition of even trying to do all of that with this movie. When it's so easy to imagine what the real "lazy" and cynical version of this would've been.

Lana Wachowski essentially covertly made a niche film under the guise of a franchise reboot. It wasn't made with the intent to spawn off endless more sequels and reboots. Whether you love or hate the film, it was clearly made with a specific artistic point of view. And in this day and age I welcome that with open arms.


This is just laziness. And what's worse... this kind of lazy storytelling is not without cost. They've pretty much destroyed the original Matrix movies now. At the end of Matrix 1, Neo said that he was going to show the world what the Matrix was. Did he? Would we really have been super interested in Matrix 3, if we knew that the stakes were, "Will Neo stop this iteration of the Matrix for a few years until the new, improved version comes back?" No, of course not.

The original Matrix still functions as a completely functional standalone film. Even as a fan of the trilogy, when I watch the original film, it feels standalone. Similar to watching A New Hope.

I don't mind that the endgame changed though. To me it just presents something more nuanced and interesting than humans= good, machines= bad.

Still though, Neo's sacrifice led to bigger and more long-lasting changes in the Matrix universe than the Star Wars OT characters' victories did if you want to compare legacy sequels. 60 years of peace, machines at war with each other, humans and machines working together, the real world humans reaching a better quality of life thanks to working with the machines. The movie took the care to demonstrate all of this. Sure, it alludes to a 'new power', but that's not really the focus. To me it struck exactly the right balance in terms of honoring the accomplishments of the original trilogy while advancing the world-building in a way that felt plausible. Obviously things aren't going to just be perfect forever, but they are demonstrably better. This was refreshing as hell to me.

Compare this to Force Awakens though. What it ultimately boils down to is 30 years of New Republic, wiped out. Luke's attempt to restart the Jedi, a failure. It leaned so heavily into the cyclical aspect of the story that it neglected to give the ending of the previous films a proper sense of weight and meaning.
 
Last edited:
Its better to view it in terms of a spectrum of risk. I, the consumer, have a finite budget of time and money to spend on entertainment, and want to spend that budget well. An "original" movie is, by definition, new- its an unknown. Will I like its content or quality? Who knows! A sequel or franchise, by contrast, is a known factor. Its not guaranteed to be appealing, but the customer has much more information to judge the likelihood of it being appealing. Thus, it is intrinsically less of a risk than an original movie- you are choosing between "have good reason to think it will be worth it" vs "have no good reason to think it will be worth it". Does this mean an original movie can never succeed? Of course not. . . but it has to do a much harder job selling itself to the audience, and it needs to have more measured expectations of success going in. Note that going "But you the audience should just heedlessly risk your time and money" is not an effective method of marketing.

( A sequel/franchise/whatever could also give the customer good information to believe they *won't* enjoy it. . . but if so, they presumably aren't considering it as one of their options in the first place, natch. )
I think that's the main factor and is a more detailed explanation of what I was saying. If an "original" movie has a good buzz, it, among other things, reduces that risk factor. A movie like Avatar is a good example of this.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"