"The Metal Face of Comedy" Talkback

the joker has only been in one episode this season, chill...

Saying this though, i'm not a fan of the 'this is reality' edge because that is actually one of my favourite batman episodes so tinkiering with it in any form is bound to cause a backlash.
 
When Joker turned his head into a cannon, that was when I decided this episode was worst of the season.
 
It was kind of funny and kind of boring. It was alright.
 
i hope this gets on the internet soon

how was the legion of superheroes episode in comparison
 
legion was a repeat.

superman x


this episode is blah.
 
Fun geek fact; this episode was written by Alexx Van Dyne, whose last name is interesting because it is also the maiden name of Marvel's Wasp. Coincidence, but it caught my eye.

So far, this season has been somewhat predictable, focusing mostly on Batman and Robin teaming up with a random superhero of the week, usually ones Batman already knows from the Justice League (save for Superman). Said hero either knows Batman's identity or discovers it very quickly, meets with him in the Batcave, and Batman will usually be instrumental in defeating their own rogue. The only diversion from this formula are episodes where Batman, Robin, and occasionally Batgirl battle the Joker.

That's it. Either Superfriend team-up or Joker episodes. The only bump in this pattern was the Phosphorus episode.

This episode marks the second time Joker ended up getting a super-power to battle Batman with; the first time was BRAWN in Season 3, and thankfully this episode is superior to that rubbish. That doesn't mean it is fantastic, but it is better than last week's episode with Hal Jordon.

Despite the synopsis, this episode was actually hardly like "WHAT IS REALITY?" at all. The beginning reminded me of "IF YOU'RE SO SMART, WHY AREN'T YOU RICH?" (another Timm-era Riddler episode, the first in fact) in which Robin is playing a video game on the Batcomputer which ends up serving a purpose at the end. This time instead of some dungeon crawler, the game is some VR sim where Robin's avatar, Nightwing, battles the nefarious Captain Slash, and loses. By sheer coincidence, Capt. Slash is played by Harry Slash (or "Slacker"), the newest of Joker's minions. All of them are here; Harley, Punch & Judy. The newest gimmick is employing Slash to allow Joker to rob money from banks digitally. It is interesting that in earlier seasons, Joker seemed more obsessed with causing random dangerous pranks or chaos, but in both of his episodes here, he is thinking more like a crook and seeking quick cash. I don't think it is a bad thing, Joker starting to get practical, but felt it was worth noting.

Naturally, Jerry O'Connell reprises his role as Nightwing from last season, only this time Robin's avatar sports the 70's era Perez design, complete with light blue jacket with the collar, and amazingly...it didn't look terrible. Not that I don't prefer Nightwing's current costume, and the last that was animated, but considering how cheesy this costume looked on paper, I was susprised that it didn't look nearly as bad in motion. Considering Bruce Timm will be making a DTV of the Teen Titans's JUDAS CONVENANT story for a future DTV, in which Robin first became Nightwing and donned that costume, it may be a hint of the future.

The rest of the episode is typical Saturday morning fare. Bruce Wayne unveals his technology of the week, which are a set of nanobots that can shift into any form, which reminded me of NANO from the 2k3 era TMNT. When Slash's cyber-helmet short circuts the Joker's psyche into the digital network of the bank during his fight with the Dynamic Duo, the Slacker is able to help him download into the nanobots, thus creating a superpowered Joker. Unfortunately, the real Joker eventually recovers from his injury and competes with his dopple. I did get annoyed at all the "Joker 2.0/Joker 1.0" lines, but Hynden Welch does another good job as Harley, and Patton Oswald's Slacker character was interesting. It was the first time Joker seemed to get a minion who wasn't clown themed or in training to be insane (even Prank was in a clown get-up). Some of Joker 2.0's antics did get a bit ridiculous and reminded me of THE MASK's own cartoon series of the 90's. And sadly, the episode had the one thing that all underwhelming episodes of THE BATMAN seem to have; the Bat-bot. To be fair, the Bat-Bot made sense, and it was used well here, but I just don't care for it, and every time I see it, it reminds me of how much like a generic superhero, and how less like a dark knight detective, that this Batman is. And it still faces the same issue that it did in Season 1; if Batman has this tough Bat-Mech, why not just use that every night and effortlessly beat any criminal? Plot convience, that's why. Hence, best to leave the dopey armor to Iron Man.

Still, despite the corny and dopey bits, I found myself more entertained by this episode than with last week's predictable and generic Green Lantern outing, despite myself. Still, I am getting tired of the Joker. He gets the most episodes and unlike B:TAS, the majority of them are NOT very good. This was better than some, but not his best.

THE BATMAN seems to be playing the Silver and Golden age stories straight and modern. Now, some writers actually like that kind of thing; Grant Morrison is doing that on BATMAN right now. I don't feel it fits for Batman, but it was a part of his era for decades. But it was amusing seeing what ridiculous thing Joker 2.0 would morph into, and a Giant Joker has that sort of 1950's cheese appeal to it, like the sort of idea a kid would imagine is "cool".

Still, if LEGION OF SUPERHEROES has taught me anything, it is that two of the same character in one episode isn't always so hot.

This hasn't been THE BATMAN's worst season by far, but it is a step down from the 4th and hopefully the finale will redeem it somehow.
 
yah, just watched it on veoh

it was alright, actually there were too many jokers...

I think this sort of episode would have maybe worked better with gearhead or something, an actual technological baddie.

harley was good, but they should have kept it as simply one version of the joker with his real mind downloaded into a computer so they had to get it back into his body...

shake it up with some idea that his body will die soon without his brain and then have the angle of batman actually trying to save the life of his greatest enemy. That would have been better than two roaming around...

As it stood it would have been nice if the real joker still managed to out do the one with all the gimmicks, his greatest ability is not in matter shifting, it's just pure insanity and it would have been nice if it had shined through...

overall the joker's gone soft this season, where's the complex character seen in the laughing bat?

meh...
 
The Joker fluctuates. For every episode that portrays him as deeply deranged, like LAUGHING BAT, there are maybe two that depict him as a fairly standard crazy kook. As the rogue who gets the most episode appearances (barely a step ahead of Penguin), he acquires a bit of a batting average.

Hmm...I hadn't thought of Gearhead honestly, since he's been a one-and-done rogue. But he probably would have worked better. But, sadly, Joker has more hype, so he seems to get shoved into a lot of plots.
 
True. I enjoy his little "staff" though (girlfriend, goons, pets and uh, intern?) It makes sense because Batman's got TWO teams behind him now and a screwed up bad guy like Mr. J needs a dysfunctional family of sorts. What disappointed me about this episode most is that they barely took advantage of that. We pretty much knew where it was going (downhill) when the two Jokers shook hands in a fake truce. A second Joker might have worked in the earlier seasons but it felt totally unnecessary here. This should have been like one of those "Brotherhood-centric" episodes of X-Men Evolution the fans got so fond of.

Alot of people seem to agree that the biggest problem with the Joker in this series is that he's more of a troublemaker than a genuine threat. Homicidal intent has gotten watered down in Saturday morning cartoons considerably which is a shame because I can only imagine how sick Heath Ledger's (alleged) Joker would be like in this cartoon body.

But nothing like that would have been necessary if they could let him develop enough character beyond "blowing crap up while making bad puns in differently pitched voices" and actually carry an episode. After all, he's got a team to act off of now. All he's lacking is creative writing.
 
The Joker fluctuates. For every episode that portrays him as deeply deranged, like LAUGHING BAT, there are maybe two that depict him as a fairly standard crazy kook. As the rogue who gets the most episode appearances (barely a step ahead of Penguin), he acquires a bit of a batting average.

Hmm...I hadn't thought of Gearhead honestly, since he's been a one-and-done rogue. But he probably would have worked better. But, sadly, Joker has more hype, so he seems to get shoved into a lot of plots.
The reason gearhead sprung to mind is that i thought he was getting a toy out to coincide with this season, probably showing that he was going to feature in it in some shape or form.

This would have probably been his best attempt at it. Saying this though, wouldn't his current technology make bruce's nanotechnology seem a bit like 'old tech'. Gearhead was doing this kinda stuff in season 2/3 (can't remember).
 
Funny story; Gearhead's action figure is named Metalhead.
 
this episode was okay, it could of been better. the thing with nightwing popping up in the video game, & robin naming his chararcter nightwing, could mean that he will be leaving batman's side in a future episode. if thier is going to be any future episodes.

but with all the speculation with this being the last season, this fundemental fact may indeed be flawless. but nethertheless i still enjoyed the episode.
 
The reason gearhead sprung to mind is that i thought he was getting a toy out to coincide with this season, probably showing that he was going to feature in it in some shape or form.

This would have probably been his best attempt at it. Saying this though, wouldn't his current technology make bruce's nanotechnology seem a bit like 'old tech'. Gearhead was doing this kinda stuff in season 2/3 (can't remember).

Very true. Since Batman has ripped off his rogues' technology before (he started using those "Freeze Bombs" after fighting Mr. Freeze, for instance), I wouldn't be surprised if Gearhead "inspired" some of that tech. Of course, had Gearhead been in the episode, he may have felt slighted about being imitated, and it would have been stronger.

But, to hell with that, right? Joker's the #1 rogue. :p
 
this was a good episode. I'm still waiting for two-face though...
 
Just saw the episode, it was alright. The story was pretty good but they didn't really use it to its potential. I wished they used Nightwing more. It seemed like a nod to the fans but they didn't know what to do with it. I thought it was funny how Joker can't even stand himself.
Overall, 7/10
 
YOu know what they should have done?

Since they uprooted the joker's persona from the digital world, they should have also taken another bout of nanobots and uprooted nightwing's persona

this way there would actually be someone he could tackle together and it brings in the unique opportunity to have batman/robin and nightwing all in the same ep.
 
you know November rain, that is the same thing I thought
 
YOu know what they should have done?

Since they uprooted the joker's persona from the digital world, they should have also taken another bout of nanobots and uprooted nightwing's persona

this way there would actually be someone he could tackle together and it brings in the unique opportunity to have batman/robin and nightwing all in the same ep.

That would have felt too much like what LOSH is doing with Superman and Superman-X this season, since Nightwing and Robin are essentially the same character, just at different ages. And that isn't a good thing to me.
 
Well I'm not great on my batman mythos but the difference would be in first

digital nightwings would have powers (dare i say probably less than joker perhaps based on the nanomeds used on him being from an earlier generation)

secondly bruce's relationship with nightwing wouldn't be the same as robin's as robin (as much as he likes to gloat about other heroes) looks up to batman with much more respect while nightwing from artifacts seemed to look to bruce with some sort of pity for not being able to let go and pushing things too hard.

heck, the fact that it's not the real nightwing and a digital one and it's only for a one off ep could have made it decent

another change i would have made would be to perhaps give the harley duplicate the powers instead of the joker, It would have been really nice to see how their love of mister j would have affected one another. Obviously joker would be hard on the real one and take more of a shine to the digital one.

Again lost potential.

Now that i think about it, bruce really didn't have to be in much of this episode at all...bruce gets knocked out by a digital harvey, robin gets ideas and asks lucious for help to gain access to old tech, out come nightwing and they both come in and take out the garbage

If earlier in the ep (at school) one of the kids mentioned something about robin not being able to stand on his own or do anything without batman, this would help start the wheels in motion to perhaps think bruce's way of things isn't the right way to go and without even realising, he's beaten the joker without batman (or by himself if you discout nightwing being real).

The only problem with this is that the batman has yet to reach that obssessed stage.

If harley would have gotten a digital clone and robin made his own, this ep could have done quite a lot to help boost their ratings of both the sidekick characters since robin hasn't had much since his encounter with the black mask with batgirl (which was the poorest ep of season 4).

You know it makes sense...

ps, Superman x rocks. The only problem with legion is that imperiax is too much of a *****. I guess if anymore changes were to be made to superman x, it would be that his character should be more like warren worthington's from x-men tas, especially in the episode obsession. Taking down imperiax should be all that matters since it was actually what he was created for, he's mellowed out far too quickly and easily.

For examples of this, watch this ep. Superman x=angel, superman=cyclops

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_r4x1mo8kA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZJy82k3Gbg&feature=related
 
I agree about Superman x, he rocks.
Anyway, back on topic, I found this episode not so bad. that wasn't crap, just very very bad. The only real thing I liked was the appearance of Harley.
"The batman" keeps being bad, oh well ... I'm getting used to it.
 

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