Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. The MidSeason Clean Up Thread!

[mkilban2]

So we've had 10 episodes of Agents of Shield so far, we're starting to get to know the cast and storylines are really starting to come together. But what I propose with this thread is what would you like to see done differently? Try and be as specific as possible with what you want changed and how it could be done differently.

I figured I'd try and make a thread for these types of talk since they're all variously scattered around (even in the AoU thread a bit lol)

What I personally want to see done differently in the rest of this season is a quick resolution of Skye's secretive backstory. The whole Coulson/May hiding it from her, and Skye constantly breaking the rules and annoying anyone and everyone to find the answers is really hurting what I think her character can be. I'd rather them give her and us the answer so she can start moving forward and developing into a better member of the cast.


I know there's a lot of different things people have had problems with and I didn't find a complaint/resolution thread so lets have some good, fun, civil discussion about what we want to see going forward! And lets try and be as specific as possible! Haha

 

[cherokeesam]

*Make Skye a latent super. It's the only way the writers can save face for bringing such a useless character into a situation she is spectacularly unqualified and unprepared for.

*Michael Peterson is still alive, and becomes a regular team member.

*More Lola, dammit.

*Mine the comic books a lot more. Yes, we all know they aren't going to give us any of the major heroes and villains we're itching to see, but it's not going to hurt "continuity" (such as it is) one damn bit to drop a D- or C-lister in every once in awhile instead of trying to make up "original" one-and-done heroes/villains.

*Expand the cast even further. More importantly, add one or two *name* TV stars to the cast --- celebs (even has-beens) who'll actually pop up on the radar of the general audiences and/or the fans who dropped out of the series shortly after the pilot episode.

*Better. damn. writers. Period. It's time for the kiddies to graduate to grownups. The actors don't have to *act* like children to still *appeal* to children.

 

[mkilban2]

I like the idea of adding a *name* or two as you said to the cast. I definitely don't want anyone dropped but bringing in someone could for sure help both the show and the audience appeal.

 

[Alex_Kidd]

- Ward, the Specialist of the team, make something special. some lone missions, even some alone storyline, anything as long as someone show what is his specialization.

- Better and rude fights and gunfights.

- a big storyline involving Fitz-Simmons, some British-issue

- Deadly Melinda May. The motivation of the "cavalry" is too fleeting. Wow she recovered dome hostages killing a super and his adept... there is anything that Romanov can't do?

- new team members and really meaningful cameos

 

[Xeno]

The changes I would make if I had godlike power over AOS:


• Clean out the writers' room and hire better scribes. That, first and foremost, is what this show needs. The plotting has been unfocused and most of the scripts are dull and fall into the same exposition-heavy format every episode. None of the writers except Joss Whedon has mastered writing action scenes, which hurts the show badly. The producers need to find writers who can turn out crisper scripts with better plotting, consistent characterization and decently staged action.


• Make the show less episodic. In The Bridge it was suddenly revealed that a lot of seemingly unconnected plot threads were part of a larger scheme. It would have worked better had the writers woven all of that together as it happened so that the audience understood that the show was building towards a crescendo. In order to engage the audience AOS needs to have an overarching story arc that is clearly delineated and then expanded upon in each episode. It doesn't have to become as tightly-plotted as Lost or OUAT, but we need to constantly see the connections even when the team goes off into other directions.


• Beef up the team and make it more like the professional, elite paramilitary SHIELD we know from the film universe. Bringing back Mike Peterson and making him a regular would be a good place to start. Then add another seasoned agent or two whose presence is mandated from above due to Coulson's erratic leadership. That would be a way to inject some professionalism into the team as well as stir up conflict in a very organic manner.


• As a corollary to making the team stronger, cut the deadwood. Five of the characters are useful and serve a purpose; one does not. Skye is obviously the fifth wheel on the Bus since she isn't an agent of SHIELD and brings nothing to the team that other members cannot supply. Fitz and/or Simmons have hacked computer systems when called upon by Coulson and any child can look things up on the Internet.


Skye's best contribution would be a painful death that shakes the agents to their core, shows Coulson that his newfound kinder side can be a dangerous weakness and brings the heavy hand of SHIELD in to lay down the law. That would introduce new conflict in the form of Phil Coulson vs. SHIELD, which is where the show should always have been headed. Skye's death would be the final catalyst to Coulson's agents pulling themselves together and becoming the elite, professional first response force that they should be, always focused and prepared because they learned the dangers of carelessness the hard way.


• There will be a tie-in to Captain America: The Winter Soldier, but it must be handled better than the post-Thor episode. Since the movie deals heavily with SHIELD it would be absolutely inexcusable for AOS's writers to drop that ball. Ideally, Markus & McFeeley should at least consult on the script in order to keep it in line with the movie.

 

[fixxxer]

Posted this in the episode 11 thread since folks were discussing which aspects of the show they found disappointing, but fits much better here...

I'm somewhat in the 'sam/xeno camp even if my degree of disappointment with the show is not at their level. Overall, despite being a fan of the show, (it is Marvel after all) I'm disappointed that we got a somewhat generic if entertaining show rather than something special. I wanted AOS to do for television what the MCU has done for movies. Instead, we got a show that doesn't push the envelope creatively and that is, minus the MCU connection, practically indistinguishable from dozens and dozens of it's network TV brethren. Frankly, if the show wasn't rooted in the MCU, I probably wouldn't be watching based on the strength of the show alone.

So what's wrong? And if not wrong, what needs improvement?

Writing
Quite simply, the level of writing seems a bit amateurish and needs to improve in a hurry. Plots need to be crafted better. Character motivations need to be explored with a greater sense of nuance. The characters need to, quite simply put, stop acting like idiots. Many things that the characters do stem from... hold on, I'm channeling Fury himself here... stupid-ass decisions. I've often thought that any character on a show/movie/whatever can only be as intelligent as said show's most intelligent writer. This affects everything. The humor, for example... wit should stem from intelligence rather than childish goofiness. Too often (though not always) it's the latter rather than the former.

The "what do you want... it's TV" argument does not hold. Over the past decade or so, the level of quality of TV shows out there has been astonishing. That almost all of these have been on cable is irrelevant.

Connective tissue
Something of the scale of the MCU is the greatest playground that any TV show could've asked for. I've heard all kinds of responses from "not enough references to the MCU" to "too many references to the MCU". My opinion is that the references to the MCU should be meaningful. Instead of Fury cameoing in episode 2 just to berate Coulson about damaging the Bus, why not expand the universe by Fury talking about the happenings of IM3, and possibly expressing disgust that the government ordered SHIELD to take a backseat in those happenings. Now, that's just an example, but there are many many meaningful ways to connect AOS to the MCU that don't include forced throwaway one-liners.

I don't think AOS needs to be a comic-book-mining (or MCU-mining) factory. However, there's a vast treasure trove out there. Just take some of what's out there and incorporate it meaningfully. Architecture and planning is important here. Not much of either has gone into constructing the framework of AOS thus far.

Characters
Overall, the team does not seem competent or highly skilled. I don't buy the fact that they've managed to survive as many dangerous situations as they've encountered thus far. While some level of suspension-of-disbelief is necessary for the continuation of any series of this sort, I just can't get over how amateurish the team seems. As Skye alluded to, this really looks like Little SHIELD. A bunch of children playing cops and robbers.

Ok then, let's get down to it... Skye, Skye, Skye. Her inclusion in the team is inexplicable. This is supposed to be a paramilitary first response team of skilled operatives tasked with keeping the world safe from all the craziness that's out there in the MCU. I've mentioned this before, but "she's hot", "snark is the new humor", "audience proxy" and "hey, we don't have anyone to monitor Instagram" are not valid reasons for her inclusion. I think the character is salvageable though. Give us a valid reason... possibly something known only to Coulson (and maybe May) and I'm good. If she's a latent super, so be it. If it's something else, okay. However, it needs to happen sooner rather than later.

----------

Overall, these things are quite fixable. Hopefully, someone will start making the right decisions. Soon.

 

[The Question]

Fitz and/or Simmons have hacked computer systems when called upon by Coulson

When?

 

[Xeno]

When?

In episode 3 Skye was inexplicably sent to infiltrate Ian Quinn's compound. The billionaire's laser security grid needed to be hacked and disabled so that Coulson and Ward could sneak in and find Franklin Hall who was being held inside. Fitz created the device that Skye carried in which allowed him to access the system via wifi and disable it. May was involved in the computer work as well, running traces on Quinn's servers. If Fitz had his trained monkey the little animal could easily have carried out Skye's portion of the scheme. That entire episode made it clear that the team's supposed need for Skye's questionable skills is the result of plot-induced stupidity.

 

[mkilban2]

I hope Franklin Hall comes back soon, but I can see them doing an episode where he teams up with AIM er I mean Centipede and maybe end the season with a few episodes on that.

 

[mkilban2]

I'm also thinking when the show comes back were going to see a lot of the immaturity and those types of things sent away, their leader Coulson has been kidnapped and I think that's really going to put everyone's burdens on the back burner or have them realize their problems aren't as important as they thought. I could for sure see a more serious tone to the series going forward due to the events that are currently going on, and that's a very good thing for the show.

I'm still pretty confident that this team was put together for a purpose and Skye was recruited to make a difference. Coulson wants this team of varying personalities to mesh together and they've been clashing pretty hard so far. The team is still learning and growing and I can see major good things coming for the team

 

[Quasimod0]

Bring back mike Peterson and make him a regular, powers or not.
More name characters from the comics making appearances
A few cameos from actors who are in the marvel films wouldn't hurt.

 

[Xeno]

I'm also thinking when the show comes back were going to see a lot of the immaturity and those types of things sent away, their leader Coulson has been kidnapped and I think that's really going to put everyone's burdens on the back burner or have them realize their problems aren't as important as they thought. I could for sure see a more serious tone to the series going forward due to the events that are currently going on, and that's a very good thing for the show.

I'm still pretty confident that this team was put together for a purpose and Skye was recruited to make a difference. Coulson wants this team of varying personalities to mesh together and they've been clashing pretty hard so far. The team is still learning and growing and I can see major good things coming for the team

Conflict between the characters is a good thing when it's meaningful, when it highlights the personalities involved and develops themes central to the show. Unfortunately, the conflict on AOS has served none of those purposes. The characters seem to go in circles, covering the same ground over and over without resolving anything.


For instance, May and Ward came to Coulson with legitimate and well-founded concerns about Skye's loyalties and her behavior. Coulson brushed them off repeatedly, only to see their concerns borne out when Skye betrayed the team. That should have had a larger impact than it did, with extreme long-term consequences for the traitor, the team and the man who mistakenly trusted her. Instead, it blew over in five minutes with Skye receiving a literal slap on the wrist for her criminal actions and then gaining instant forgiveness from Coulson. Even the bracelet that was supposed to track her computer usage was played for laughs in The Hub and proved ineffective when she was able to hack SHIELD's mainframes from within a secure facility without being detected.


Skye's betrayal should have been a real turning point for all of the characters. Coulson should have had his faith in his own judgment badly shaken, not just momentarily but for the rest of the season at least. That could have led to his leaning on May more in decision-making. Ward, having his suspicions about Skye confirmed, should have confronted Coulson about the fact that he had warned his superior several times not to trust the hacker. The team's alpha male might have gone on to challenge Coulson's leadership and perhaps push for reassignment since he hadn't wanted to join the team in the first place. FitzSimmons, who are trained agents, should have been more wary of Skye afterwards, at the very least. Instead of real repercussions, however, relationships continued without much change and the team carried on playing games and pranking each other as if nothing had ever happened.


The lack of real consequences or change after Skye's betrayal was just one of many missed opportunities for character development. The writers kept teasing Skye's status as a double agent, only to drop it as soon as she was outed. We don't even know whether Rising Tide exists beyond her and her scruffy boyfriend since that angle wasn't further explored. It's poor storytelling, plain and simple.

 

[The Question]

In episode 3 Skye was inexplicably sent to infiltrate Ian Quinn's compound. The billionaire's laser security grid needed to be hacked and disabled so that Coulson and Ward could sneak in and find Franklin Hall who was being held inside. Fitz created the device that Skye carried in which allowed him to access the system via wifi and disable it. May was involved in the computer work as well, running traces on Quinn's servers. If Fitz had his trained monkey the little animal could easily have carried out Skye's portion of the scheme. That entire episode made it clear that the team's supposed need for Skye's questionable skills is the result of plot-induced stupidity.

So because a character did something with computers once, they don't need a separate computer specialist at all?

I don't think I agree with your definition of "plot-induced stupidity," sir.

 

[mkilban2]

Skye's essentially been shut out by May and Ward after her slip ups, they don't effect FirzSimmons much so I can see why that relationship didn't change. Coulson is forgiving because he obviously sees something in her. And clearly Shield doesn't like her either. So yeah, she's gotten her punishment rightfully, you just think it should be much more harsh because you hate the character with a passion. As much as you don't want to admit it, she's going to probably have the second biggest role in the show behind Coulson and I wouldn't be surprised if she's the one who rescues him from Centipede, which I already know you'll hate and find problems with Xeno

 

[Jammat]

I can see why people have a problem with Skye, it could be that the character could be realised better, but I have absolutely no problem with her being on the team, and think she will be centre of an interesting sup-plot in the first series or two as she develops into a useful agent from a naive but idealistic member of the public.

First, in the MCU, SHIELD have form for recruiting unlikely people and getting the best out of them. In the few films and shorts we've seen a couple of bank robbers recruited, a former Russian agent who was supposed to be assassinated, a man who was frozen for 50 years and doesn't understand the modern world, and a lab experiment who nearly exploded in a train station and put someone in hospital when he lost his temper. Perhaps in the real world a large organisation wouldn't act like this, but I like the idea that the rules are more fluid in this universe.

Second, she has been set up to be a good hacker - and by good I mean unrealistic super-skills. This has been shown in the first episode, and in the Hub where she finds out about Ward and Fitz being effectively left for dead, despite her wrist band (ultimately saving their lives and and proving her worth to the team). It's a difficult thing to portray, but cyberspace is a very important part of 21st century security, and with organisations like Anonymous and Wikileaks making headlines, its topical.

My view on Skye's recruitment is that Coulson had several things in mind, she has potential, but she also has links to The Rising Tide, and having someone on the inside with links to a (potentially) damaging organisation could prove to be advantageous. Finally, I think he feels SHIELD has a debt to her for whatever went on in her childhood.

I don't expect everyone to agree with the above, and a realistic drama wouldn't go the same route, but I watch AoS and other Marvel films for escapism and don't tend to think too deeply about them.

 

[Evil Twin]

I'd start with resolving HOW Coulson came back pronto. It's not like they're throwing out clues and red herrings to make it a fun guessing game or that there's any urgency in that mystery given that it's a fait accompli of the series. Resolve the how, and get on to how the revelation is affecting Coulson now that he has a second chance at life. Heck, have him grapple with what it means to be human. That's a lot more interesting than "Tahiti is a magical place or is it?" on repeat.

All the personal mysteries and subplots on the show need to move faster. Coulson's subplot has stalled out. They haven't done much of anything with Skye's either. May's subplot basically supplied some details consistent with what we already knew. And it almost always deals with the subplots one at a time. Get some multiple plates spinning here. Not really allowing the agents to have personal lives away from the Bus, cuts down on the possibility of what life can throw at them, so find ways to get them off the Bus more.

Figure out the balance of Skye, Fitz, and Simmons as the tech side of the team.

It wouldn't necessarily be a bad idea seeing them deal with two cases at once. CSI doesn't always have all its cast working on the same case. If you're going to have a six member cast, maybe splitting them up from time to time would be helpful in giving everybody something to do.

Look forward and outward more to exploring the MCU. Referencing past events was cute at first, but yeah, we know the Heroes of New York changed everything, Coulson is friends with Thor, Tony Stark, etc., Extremis is a thing, etc. We've seen the movies. But, if all of the significant world building is going to be in the films, you make the show redundant. Heck, do more than cursory interviews with civilians on cases where all we hear is "I couldn't believe how strong that guy was" and see how civilians are reacting to a changing world. Heck, go to Wakanda for an episode or something.

Bring in some more gadgets to spice up the action. Remember that staff thing from Episode 2? You have agents going up against supersoldiers and the plan is to punch and kick them? Yeah, the "night night" gun is fine and dandy, but S.H.I.E.L.D. has always been filled with fun gadgets, bring some of them out to even up the odds. Because the more these agents hold their own against superpowered foes without any help, the less super the foes seem and the smaller the show seems.

 

[cph9fa]

I have a hope that Coulson's abduction will be a sort of "crucible moment" for the team, forcing them to up their game.

Heck, go to Wakanda for an episode or something.

Wakanda is cool, but I doubt we'd see it before seeing a Black Panther movie, so as not to crimp that film's graphic designers, artists, and effects teams.

Instead, I really hope at some point we see the slums of Madripoor. It should be much easier to depict, budgetarily, and it seems like just the kind of place they would go to infiltrate one of Van Chat's gulags, or something. Or continue building up towards HYDRA's involvement behind Project Centipede. Maybe the team ends up there in a post-CATWS season finale, with Skye kidnapped in a HYDRA facility.

 

[DeeLovesMarvel]

They need to clarify on whether Skye is a field agent or apart of the tech team. So far we've seen her doing both, but she still needs a lot of training no matter what her position is.

I also agree that they should beef up her character a little more. Give her some type of latent power, let her discover who her parents are, let us discover that she actually is a mole. I like Skye and all, but right now she's kind of just there with no real purpose.

 

[kane9321]

kick skye off the team..or just kill her outright.

 

[Artistsean]

I would say start revealing details, like the big secret of Coulsen or Skye's parents, etc. Maybe Coulsen is a clone and that is why he has no muscle memory.
Maybe he is Skye's father.

And maybe have one of the characters change in a profound way like dying or becoming infected with something like how Fred on Angel was infected with a demon and she became completely different. Something like that, maybe a friend becomes a big bad villain or gets powers or something, or is killed off.

And I would also bring into the team a semi big comic character who is not a no-name but not a huge character who would get his or her own movie.
Someone like Gravity.

I think the show needs to start becoming more interesting. By Season 2 I would like to see the cast somewhat changed. Maybe by Season 2 we have things like this Coulsen is a clone of the one who died in New York. Sky is actually his daughter (of the original Coulsen) and she is revealed to actually be working for Hydra and becomes a double agent. She is also revealed to be more skilled at being a spy than she let on.
We could also have Fitz of Simmons die or become dramatically different, maybe by one of their missions. And maybe they no longer look human like Beast in the X-Men comics. And we bring in one or two characters from the comics, one a super character like Gravity and the other a non powered agent from the comics like Gabriel Jones or Jimmy Woo. Or maybe they could bring in a super character like Gravity and Agent Gorilla Man. The FX these days could be good enough to pull off a Gorilla Man character in a TV series. Anyway, my main thought is to bring in more of the convoluted and weird plots from the comics.