Justice League The Reason WB Can't Get JL off the Ground

[thorstone]

It's mythology. They can't get the courage together to just make a science fiction super hero movie about the characters rather than their mythologies. What is important are the characters-- Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter.

X-men only explored the origin of two characters; opening the film with Magneto as a child and later with the x-rays showing Wolverine has had his body altered. That is all fans should hope for in a JL film.

America knows who these characters are; the same as the X-men. No one needs to know the biography of Scott Summers. All we need is Cyclops with a visor and a laser beam.

The film can open with Manhunter's arrival on Earth and then later in the first quarter of the film; offer some brief acknowledgement that Flash was involved in an accident caused by lightning which resulted in his super human powers. We don't need any Greek, Egyptian, and Atlantean mythology or magical weapons.

What the audience needs to know is that Wonder Woman's identity is Diana Prince-- not Princess Diana.

 

[TheWatcher]

It's mythology. They can't get the courage together to just make a science fiction super hero movie about the characters rather than their mythologies. What is important are the characters-- Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter.

X-men only explored the origin of two characters; opening the film with Magneto as a child and later with the x-rays showing Wolverine has had his body altered. That is all fans should hope for in a JL film.

America knows who these characters are; the same as the X-men. No one needs to know the biography of Scott Summers. All we need is Cyclops with a visor and a laser beam.

The film can open with Manhunter's arrival on Earth and then later in the first quarter of the film; offer some brief acknowledgement that Flash was involved in an accident caused by lightning which resulted in his super human powers. We don't need any Greek, Egyptian, and Atlantean mythology or magical weapons.

What the audience needs to know is that Wonder Woman's identity is Diana Prince-- not Princess Diana.

Anybody else see what's wrong with this?

 

[Lily Adler]

From what I seen from the Aquaman thread and the Hawkman thread he started in the DC Comic Films section, he basically wants everyone to be like Batman...

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

It's mythology. They can't get the courage together to just make a science fiction super hero movie about the characters rather than their mythologies. What is important are the characters-- Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter.

X-men only explored the origin of two characters; opening the film with Magneto as a child and later with the x-rays showing Wolverine has had his body altered. That is all fans should hope for in a JL film.

America knows who these characters are; the same as the X-men. No one needs to know the biography of Scott Summers. All we need is Cyclops with a visor and a laser beam.

The film can open with Manhunter's arrival on Earth and then later in the first quarter of the film; offer some brief acknowledgement that Flash was involved in an accident caused by lightning which resulted in his super human powers. We don't need any Greek, Egyptian, and Atlantean mythology or magical weapons.

What the audience needs to know is that Wonder Woman's identity is Diana Prince-- not Princess Diana.

Anybody else see what's wrong with this?

Yep, as well as the other sentences I bolded.

No one is asking for the origins of these characters to be delved into in JL. That's what solo movies are for. Just give them the proper screen time and respect that they deserve, and people will be happy.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

From what I seen from the Aquaman thread and the Hawkman thread he started in the DC Comic Films section, he basically wants everyone to be like Batman...

 

[Lily Adler]

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Take that

and this

and that

actually, that last one's not so bad.

 

[thorstone]

I never related Aquaman to Batman in the Aquaman thread and I only drew inspiration from Batman's costume in the Hawkman thread.

 

[metaphysician]

It's mythology. They can't get the courage together to just make a science fiction super hero movie about the characters rather than their mythologies. What is important are the characters-- Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter.

X-men only explored the origin of two characters; opening the film with Magneto as a child and later with the x-rays showing Wolverine has had his body altered. That is all fans should hope for in a JL film.

America knows who these characters are; the same as the X-men. No one needs to know the biography of Scott Summers. All we need is Cyclops with a visor and a laser beam.

The film can open with Manhunter's arrival on Earth and then later in the first quarter of the film; offer some brief acknowledgement that Flash was involved in an accident caused by lightning which resulted in his super human powers. We don't need any Greek, Egyptian, and Atlantean mythology or magical weapons.

What the audience needs to know is that Wonder Woman's identity is Diana Prince-- not Princess Diana.

Just to add further "What the. . . ?", since people have already commented on the other aspects. Seriously, no, "America" doesn't know Aquaman, Flash, or Martian Manhunter. And even those who've heard of them don't care about them.

Repeat after me: "I am not representative. I am an outlier."

 

[shauner111]

America doesn't know Martian Manhunter as they do X-Men. Flash & Aquaman, even if it's limited knowledge, we all have knowledge of these two.

 

[KangConquers]

America doesn't know Martian Manhunter as they do X-Men. Flash & Aquaman, even if it's limited knowledge, we all have knowledge of these two.

Yes. There are two types of "A-list" Superheroes. Ones the general audience knows of (name + have a firm visual representation in their mind) and ones they know (details of their personality, powers, villains, girlfriends etc.) MMH is neither.

He's to Justice League what Hank Pym is to the Avengers; a major cornerstone, of the team, but not someone who's ever captured the public's imagination on his own.

 

[nogap87]

Chances are this movie will have a ton of opening credits. Do what "The Incredible Hulk" did and give the audience a CliffsNotes version of each character's origin. Also, Watchmen's little clip show did a good job of introducing the type of world the characters lived in.

The first five minutes of a Justice League movie can easily show Superman, Batman, Flash, and Green Lantern are already active.

 

[Lord]

Starting the same way the tv show did by having all the heroes known to the public is the beast way to go.

 

[thorstone]

Yes. There are two types of "A-list" Superheroes. Ones the general audience knows of (name + have a firm visual representation in their mind) and ones they know (details of their personality, powers, villains, girlfriends etc.) MMH is neither.

He's to Justice League what Hank Pym is to the Avengers; a major cornerstone, of the team, but not someone who's ever captured the public's imagination on his own.

I grew up in the 80s; so maybe my perspective is different, but more people from my generation were exposed to Manhunter, Wonder Woman, Flash, and Aquaman than Thor, Captain America, or Iron Man. Until Marvel/Disney invested in movies for their second tier guys; most movie goers didn't know a thing about Thor.

Manhunter is not as well known as Superman, but he is no Hank Pym.

 

[shauner111]

But he's no Flash or Aquaman that's for damn sure. I was born in the 80s, my brother grew up throughout the decade, and i can tell you that the general public or the "common knowledge comic fans" have no idea of this character. I honestly only found out about him a couple of years ago. Nobody knows who the hell im talking about when i say his name.

 

[dnno1]

It's mythology. They can't get the courage together to just make a science fiction super hero movie about the characters rather than their mythologies. What is important are the characters-- Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, and Martian Manhunter.

X-men only explored the origin of two characters; opening the film with Magneto as a child and later with the x-rays showing Wolverine has had his body altered. That is all fans should hope for in a JL film.

America knows who these characters are; the same as the X-men. No one needs to know the biography of Scott Summers. All we need is Cyclops with a visor and a laser beam.

The film can open with Manhunter's arrival on Earth and then later in the first quarter of the film; offer some brief acknowledgement that Flash was involved in an accident caused by lightning which resulted in his super human powers. We don't need any Greek, Egyptian, and Atlantean mythology or magical weapons.

What the audience needs to know is that Wonder Woman's identity is Diana Prince-- not Princess Diana.

The main reason why they haven't gotten a JL film franchise off the ground is because of the film rights of Batman and Superman. Those were tied up with different producers and has complicated things greatly. Now that the latest Batman trilogy of films has finished up it is a great opportunity to start anew and work towards a series of DC based films with a shared universe that will tie into a JL movie or two (or three).

 

[dnno1]

But he's no Flash or Aquaman that's for damn sure. I was born in the 80s, my brother grew up throughout the decade, and i can tell you that the general public or the "common knowledge comic fans" have no idea of this character. I honestly only found out about him a couple of years ago. Nobody knows who the hell im talking about when i say his name.

Martian Manhunter was almost non-existent in the 1980's (and for that matter from 1968 to 1984) since he was not featured on TV nor hardly ever in the comics. He really became popular after he was featured in the DCAU series "Justice League" and "Justie League Unlimited" around the turn of the last century. We would have to presume that he is not very well know among general audiences and might need some explaining and introductions in order to get movie goers in general acquainted with the character.

 

[The Guard]

I think The Martian Manhunter is definitely the character that general audiences know the least. He's a relative unknown compared to the rest of them to most people. As such, it makes perfect sense that, in a JUSTICE LEAGUE film, the details of his origins would be the ones spotlighted above the others. If only because there are thematic connections with pretty much all the leaguers inherent in his origins, J'onn's story would allow for an organic reveal of all the other leaguers backgrounds/key issues, etc.

 

[shauner111]

I dont want the film to feel like the Martian Manhunter story featuring members of the Justice League. Not that it would automatically be this way if you include him, but there only chance to reveal his origins lie in a JL movie. They would have to be somewhat detailed.

The least sci-fi or alien elements the better. It's just not the direction i want this movie to take. I dont want to hear about Krypton, where Green Lanterns ring came from and where he trained. I dont want to see Atlantis or hear/see in detail, where J'onn J'onnz was born.

I want Superman, Batman, Green Lantern, Flash and Wonder Womans characters to be established already (Aquaman too if he's going to be in this). Cyborg can get away with actually showing his origins in a Justice League movie. Preferrably a sequel. Do a couple of the characters' origin stories AFTER JL, like Flash or WW...i dont care, but keep the martian stuff away from that first movie.

It's just a personal preference..i want this to be gritty. And ya i know that J'onn could have some african-american identity at first, and then shapeshifts to his real self....then we see some flashbacks take place that dont have to use up much screen-time. But i just believe they shouldnt go too crazy with the sci-fi elements. Id like to see an approach of "If these super-powered beings, minus Batman, formed a League, in our real world, what would it really be like & how would the people/governments react?".

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

I dont want the film to feel like the Martian Manhunter story featuring members of the Justice League. Not that it would automatically be this way if you include him, but there only chance to reveal his origins lie in a JL movie. They would have to be somewhat detailed.

The least sci-fi or alien elements the better. It's just not the direction i want this movie to take. I dont want to hear about Krypton, where Green Lanterns ring came from and where he trained. I dont want to see Atlantis or hear/see in detail, where J'onn J'onnz was born.

I want Superman, Batman, Green Lantern, Flash and Wonder Womans characters to be established already (Aquaman too if he's going to be in this). Cyborg can get away with actually showing his origins in a Justice League movie. Preferrably a sequel. Do a couple of the characters' origin stories AFTER JL, like Flash or WW...i dont care, but keep the martian stuff away from that first movie.

It's just a personal preference..i want this to be gritty. And ya i know that J'onn could have some african-american identity at first, and then shapeshifts to his real self....then we see some flashbacks take place that dont have to use up much screen-time. But i just believe they shouldnt go too crazy with the sci-fi elements. Id like to see an approach of "If these super-powered beings, minus Batman, formed a League, in our real world, what would it really be like & how would the people/governments react?".

The majority of the Justice League is made up of sci-fi and fantasy characters and elements. You can't just pass over that like it doesn't matter. Superman and Martian Manhunter come from other worlds and Green Lantern's weapon comes from another world. Being an alien is an essential part of both Clark and J'onn's identities. Being the king of Atlantis and a being an ambassador from Themyscira is essential to Aquaman and Wonder Woman, respectively.

I don't get your "our world" claim. DC's main line of comics has always been romanticized, which in the case of superheroes, means a world different than our own. You are asking for Watchmen, but they already made that movie. This movie is Warner Bros. chance to show that they can stand up to Marvel Studios' success with their own unabashed product.

They don't need to ground it, make it gritty, realistic, etc. That's not what the Justice League is about. The Justice League is about combining the forces of the "World's Greatest Superheroes" and it's that last word that is the most important. These are "super" people, extraordinary people. It would be a travesty to take that aspect away from them.

 

[thorstone]

The majority of the Justice League is made up of sci-fi and fantasy characters and elements. You can't just pass over that like it doesn't matter. Superman and Martian Manhunter come from other worlds and Green Lantern's weapon comes from another world. Being an alien is an essential part of both Clark and J'onn's identities. Being the king of Atlantis and a being an ambassador from Themyscira is essential to Aquaman and Wonder Woman, respectively.

I don't get your "our world" claim. DC's main line of comics has always been romanticized, which in the case of superheroes, means a world different than our own. You are asking for Watchmen, but they already made that movie. This movie is Warner Bros. chance to show that they can stand up to Marvel Studios' success with their own unabashed product.

They don't need to ground it, make it gritty, realistic, etc. That's not what the Justice League is about. The Justice League is about combining the forces of the "World's Greatest Superheroes" and it's that last word that is the most important. These are "super" people, extraordinary people. It would be a travesty to take that aspect away from them.

Both the Dark Knight and Man of Steel franchises are based on introducing these characters to a world that is more of a real world; though the cities are given pseudonyms.

The main reason why they haven't gotten a JL film franchise off the ground is because of the film rights of Batman and Superman. Those were tied up with different producers and has complicated things greatly. Now that the latest Batman trilogy of films has finished up it is a great opportunity to start anew and work towards a series of DC based films with a shared universe that will tie into a JL movie or two (or three).

I think it is highly unlikely that Batman or Superman are going to be featured in the Justice League universe.
The real question is whether Nolan and Snyder have locked down Darkseid, Kalibak, and the New Gods for future Superman movies; preventing them from appearing in the Justice League films.

Martian Manhunter was almost non-existent in the 1980's (and for that matter from 1968 to 1984) since he was not featured on TV nor hardly ever in the comics. He really became popular after he was featured in the DCAU series "Justice League" and "Justie League Unlimited" around the turn of the last century. We would have to presume that he is not very well know among general audiences and might need some explaining and introductions in order to get movie goers in general acquainted with the character.

You are overlooking the importance of toys in the 80s.

Of course his origin is the most important (and easiest) to explain-- the character's story is mysterious to the general audience, but the image of the character is more iconic than Thor (before he appeared on the big screen).

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

The majority of the Justice League is made up of sci-fi and fantasy characters and elements. You can't just pass over that like it doesn't matter. Superman and Martian Manhunter come from other worlds and Green Lantern's weapon comes from another world. Being an alien is an essential part of both Clark and J'onn's identities. Being the king of Atlantis and a being an ambassador from Themyscira is essential to Aquaman and Wonder Woman, respectively.

I don't get your "our world" claim. DC's main line of comics has always been romanticized, which in the case of superheroes, means a world different than our own. You are asking for Watchmen, but they already made that movie. This movie is Warner Bros. chance to show that they can stand up to Marvel Studios' success with their own unabashed product.

They don't need to ground it, make it gritty, realistic, etc. That's not what the Justice League is about. The Justice League is about combining the forces of the "World's Greatest Superheroes" and it's that last word that is the most important. These are "super" people, extraordinary people. It would be a travesty to take that aspect away from them.

Agreed, good post.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

Both the Dark Knight and Man of Steel franchises are based on introducing these characters to a world that is more of a real world; though the cities are given pseudonyms.

The Dark Knight trilogy was "real world" in the sense of plausibility, but the characterization is still from the comics and it is still romanticized. For Man of Steel, I await to see what that means for this movie. We're still talking about flying aliens with heat vision; and it's Zach Snyder in the chair, not Sidney Lumet, haha. Real to Snyder isn't real to us, it's r......eeaaAAAA......LLLLLLll! Know what I mean?

 

[The Guard]

You are overlooking the importance of toys in the 80s.

There was a figure in a later series of SUPER POWERS line of figures. But there were a lot of figures about characters that weren't/aren't well known.

 

[KangConquers]

Why can't WB get Justice League off the ground? Because the Potter series and Nolan Batman trilogy were higher priority.

It's often forgotten that Marvel tried getting Iron Man, Captain America and Thor off the ground for 15-20 years, and that for a long time they had as many holes in their character line-up as DC did.